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alistairm

Cartridge recommendation for Technics SL-10

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What do you reckon the best of breed cart for a Technics SL-10 would be? 

 

MC preferred, as it has a built in MC phono stage. 

 

Links appreciated! 

 

:thumb:

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Guest Hensa

The pick for the SL-10 is probably the original it came with, the EPC310MC. Rare as Hens' teeth and expensive unfortunately, though I'm luckily sitting on a sealed NOS one. Otherwise, I'd look to Ortofon for MC - KABUSA stock a few options in the Ortofon line.

If happy to look at MM, I can very highly recommend the Pickering TMZ-22E which I found to be a slight step up from a Technics 202ED..

The MC phono stage is not a strong point of this excellent linear tracker though. If I am going to mount my 310MC, I probably wouldn't waste such a good cartridge on the internal MC stage - it deserves far better.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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I am not aware of any current production TP4 moving coil cartridges. I am using an Ortofon 520U in my SL-10, and like it. It's a 5mV moving magnet with a fine line stylus.

 

http://www.lpgear.com/product/ORSER320.html

 

By the way, the Technics SL-10 doesn't have a built-in MC phono stage or preamp. It's a head amp/pre-preamp; gain stage only, no R.I.A.A. re-equalisation.

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Guest Hensa

I am not aware of any current production TP4 moving coil cartridges. I am using an Ortofon 520U in my SL-10, and like it. It's a 5mV moving magnet with a fine line stylus.

 

http://www.lpgear.com/product/ORSER320.html

 

By the way, the Technics SL-10 doesn't have a built-in MC phono stage or preamp. It's a head amp/pre-preamp; gain stage only, no R.I.A.A. re-equalisation.

 

Quite correct, the SL-10 MC circuit is a pre-pre amp for input to an MM phono preamp.

 

These Ortofon T4P carts from KABUSA are current production cartridges: https://www.kabusa.com/frameset.htm?/phoncart.htm - look at the Ortofon OMP range under the Ortofon Hi-Fi Cartridges link.

Edited by Hensa

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Did you check with Boidos if he sold his EPC 310?

 

I have an EPC1000Mk4 T4P but you would have to kill me first  :)

 

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/index.php?/topic/82775-technics-epc-310mc-moving-coil-p-mount-cartridge-with-adapter/

 

There are also a few available overseas.  almost tempted to look at the SL-10 in germany  :lol:

 

http://www.hifishark.com/search?q=technics+310+mc

Edited by metal beat

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Ortofon stopped making their X1 MCP mc cartridge recently.

As previously mentioned they still make mm p mounts and the OMP30 and OMP40 are very good.

If you want to get the very best out of these excellent technics linear trackers though I would recommend getting the original technics 310mc cart and retipping.

Or even better get a Technics mm cartridge , they were really on top of their turntable arm and cartridge game in the early eighties and the EPC P205C MK4 and EPC P100C MK4 are competitive with very expensive modern day MC carts.

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I will be listing some  P mounts soon here at SNA, including a used 310MC - I will pm you. 

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On 31/10/2015 at 10:30 AM, Guest Hensa said:

The pick for the SL-10 is probably the original it came with, the EPC310MC. Rare as Hens' teeth and expensive unfortunately, though I'm luckily sitting on a sealed NOS one. Otherwise, I'd look to Ortofon for MC - KABUSA stock a few options in the Ortofon line.

If happy to look at MM, I can very highly recommend the Pickering TMZ-22E which I found to be a slight step up from a Technics 202ED..

The MC phono stage is not a strong point of this excellent linear tracker though. If I am going to mount my 310MC, I probably wouldn't waste such a good cartridge on the internal MC stage - it deserves far better.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have an SL-10 connected to powered speakers. Unfortunately, the sound is very faint even on full volume. I was wondering whether it’s a cartridge issue? Would appreciate any comments.

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1 hour ago, rossowheels said:

I have an SL-10 connected to powered speakers. Unfortunately, the sound is very faint even on full volume. I was wondering whether it’s a cartridge issue? Would appreciate any comments.


I’m assuming that you do have the SL-10 connected to a Phono preamp which then feeds the RIAA-equalised signal into the powered speakers? If not, this is your problem. 

 

 

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Thanks for your post. The SL-10 supposedly has a preamp according to its specifications. The deck is directly connected to the powered speakers.

 

The SL-10 came equipped with the Technics EPS-310MC moving-coil cartridge. Due to the low output of the moving-coil cartridge, the SL-10 includes a built-in, bypassable step-up preamp to allow it to connect to standard phono inputs. The original Technics EPS-310MC moving-coil cartridge was designed to be replaced as a unit; the stylus was not removable. The cartridge has since been discontinued; the SL-10 will accept any P-mount/T4P cartridge. The SL-10 is capable of being powered by an external DC power adapter or a standard AC power supply. The motor is quartz-locked, providing accurate rotational speed.”

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6 hours ago, rossowheels said:

Thanks for your post. The SL-10 supposedly has a preamp according to its specifications. The deck is directly connected to the powered speakers.

 

The SL-10 came equipped with the Technics EPS-310MC moving-coil cartridge. Due to the low output of the moving-coil cartridge, the SL-10 includes a built-in, bypassable step-up preamp to allow it to connect to standard phono inputs. The original Technics EPS-310MC moving-coil cartridge was designed to be replaced as a unit; the stylus was not removable. The cartridge has since been discontinued; the SL-10 will accept any P-mount/T4P cartridge. The SL-10 is capable of being powered by an external DC power adapter or a standard AC power supply. The motor is quartz-locked, providing accurate rotational speed.”

 

Correct, but the built-in preamp is not a proper phono preamp - it's purpose is to boost the output level from the factory MC cartridge so that it can be fed into an external MM phono stage, or the MM phono stage of an integrated amplifier, preamp or receiver:

 

 

sl10.PNG.b51409b3a8ec11a4dbabd3121043d213.PNG

 

 

You need to add a MM phono stage to your signal path :)

 

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Thanks for your post. The SL-10 supposedly has a preamp according to its specifications. The deck is directly connected to the powered speakers.

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Very helpful. I shall run it by Wharfedale who supplied the powered speakers (Diamond A2) and see what they say. Perhaps their speakers don’t have any preamp which would be strange considering they came with a hub with phono sockets. 

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5 hours ago, rossowheels said:

Thanks for your post. The SL-10 supposedly has a preamp according to its specifications. The deck is directly connected to the powered speakers.

 

Yes, but as above, please don't confuse this with your typical phono preamp. It is only used to increase the output from the MC cart so that it can be fed into a MM phono stage. It is not a proper MC phono stage which converts a MC signal to line-level RCA signal, hence why you are experiencing your issue.

 

Please refer again to the diagram that I posted above. Regardless of which kind of cartridge you use, and whether or not you need to use the built-in MC step-up phono stage, it clearly states that you need to plug the output from the turntable into the MM phono input of an amplifier or receiver.

 

In your application, this will instead be an external MM phono preamp which would then be connected to the RCA line-level inputs of the A2 hub.

 

5 hours ago, rossowheels said:

Very helpful. I shall run it by Wharfedale who supplied the powered speakers (Diamond A2) and see what they say. Perhaps their speakers don’t have any preamp which would be strange considering they came with a hub with phono sockets. 

 

The hub which comes with the Diamond A2 does not include a MM phono stage - it has line-level RCA connections only.

 

As I have noted, you need to acquire a stand-alone MM phono preamp.

 

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Following on from pete_mac.

 

Something needs to perform the RIAA phono equalisation.

 

In the diagram pete_mac posted, the input is always going into a phono input on the amp or receiver. This is where the RIAA phono equalisation is applied. This must be done or the sound from the turntable will sound terrible with low bass and too much treble.

 

 

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I’m using Wharfedale Diamond A2 powered speakers which allegedly are simple to connect to any system which is why I’m surprised to find that I’m having an issue. I didn’t really want another box and more wires. Maybe the speakers work with a different cartridge as the one fitted is the standard MC?

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10 minutes ago, rossowheels said:

I’m using Wharfedale Diamond A2 powered speakers which allegedly are simple to connect to any system which is why I’m surprised to find that I’m having an issue. I didn’t really want another box and more wires. Maybe the speakers work with a different cartridge as the one fitted is the standard MC?


I can’t offer anything further on this... it appears that you are either not understanding my advice, or disregarding it outright. 

 

Please carefully read my earlier posts, including the diagrams, as they are factually correct. No amount of wishing otherwise is going to change things! 
 

To summarise what I have said earlier:

 

You need an external MM phono stage.  
 

The A2 hub does not include a phono stage. 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, pete_mac said:

it appears that you are either not understanding my advice, or disregarding it outright. 

 

Indeed mate.

 

You can only play head-meets-wall for a a while. Wall always wins and nobody can say you didn't try:thumb:

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36 minutes ago, rossowheels said:

I’m using Wharfedale Diamond A2 powered speakers which allegedly are simple to connect to any system which is why I’m surprised to find that I’m having an issue. I didn’t really want another box and more wires. Maybe the speakers work with a different cartridge as the one fitted is the standard MC?

In a word NO.

 

Please read @pete_mac's very helpful replies earlier in this thread.

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Mate. The advice provided by others is correct.

 

Wharfedale do not refer to the analog inputs as "phono". A quote from their website:

 

Analog Input  -  RCA x 2
Bluetooth Input. -  aptX (Priority), SBC
Input sensitivity. -  350mV

 

They do stupidly put the sensitivity for the analog inputs after providing information on the Bluetooth input.

 

The analog input requires 350mV for full output from the speakers.

 

Your cartridge has an output of 0.2mV and with the internal MC pre amp has in the order of 3.5mV output. You need 40dB of additional gain and more importantly you need the standard RIAA equalisation to hear your turntable through these speakers.

 

You have 3 choices, find a turntable with a "line level output", find new speakers that have a "built in phono stage", or follow the excellent advice already provided and get a separate phono stage like this:

 https://www.vinylrevival.com.au/products/project-phono-box-e

 

Cheers

 

Grantn

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Thanks to all for the advice which I have taken fully on board. I have run the advice by Wharfedale because they had indicated the ease of connecting their powered speakers and it turns out that it’s not that simple! I hope others will also benefit from my experience 

Edited by rossowheels

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1 hour ago, rossowheels said:

Thanks to all for the advice which I have taken fully on board. I have run the advice by Wharfedale because they had indicated the ease of connecting their powered speakers and it turns out that it’s not that simple! I hope others will also benefit from my experience 

 

If we go back through this thread, you were previously under the impression that your turntable had a built-in phono stage. If this had indeed been the case, you would have had no dramas and your turntable could have interfaced with the line-level inputs on the hub exactly as intended and designed by Wharfedale. 

 

To be fair to Wharfedale, there’s nothing in Wharfedale’s manuals or marketing material which suggests that a turntable can be connected directly to the hub or that the hub includes a phono stage. 
 

You can’t turn around and blame Wharfedale for not including functionality which they never stated they had in the first place. 

 

I’m not sure what you expect or anticipate Wharfedale will say in response (apart from ‘buy a phono stage’).  They have not been misleading at all..
 

Did you happen to seek any advice from the retailer where you bought the speakers? If you did and if you received incorrect advice, that’s who I would be chasing. 

 

 

Edited by pete_mac

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I wanted to give Wharfedale some feedback as they may wish to incorporate a preamp in future models to simplify connectivity

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