Jump to content

Sign in to follow this  
Petit-fou-fou

New TT better than my Commonwealth 12D? It maybe, it ain't no Rolls though

Recommended Posts

I have got bored with building amps.

So it is time for a new Vinyl spinner, my old Royce is getting an overhaul. I've had this in my TT stash for years and often thought about giving it a new life. Well the time has come for a stripdown and a motor rumble cure. A new plinth for a 9" and 12" arm should see it good for another decade or two. If it's good enough I'll put an ET2 on it.

For those of you not familiar with this old Aussie TT here's a couple of pics post-151141-0-28863900-1435301860_thumb.post-151141-0-72862400-1435301879_thumb.post-151141-0-98534100-1435301900_thumb.post-151141-0-41196600-1435301921_thumb.post-151141-0-41723200-1435301940_thumb.post-151141-0-69266800-1435301957_thumb.post-151141-0-81253100-1435301978_thumb..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow hardcore looking setup, that motor looks like it could turn clay

 

What sort of wood are you thinking about for the plinth

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 Not sure about the plinth yet, I have a couple of nice thick slabs of marble looking for a purpose. Initially I thought of a sandwich of MDF and Brass or Copper sheet. That motor, yes it's a bit of a monster, you gotta love these old machines with their fractional Horsepower motors. This one is rated at 1/3 Horsepower.

Going to polish up the Brass and Aluminium platter/frame and think about new bearings for the motor.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[moderator post] some respect please for the OP, has gone to some trouble to share this project, least we can do is not dump on it from get go [end moderator post]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


I have got bored with building amps.

So it is time for a new Vinyl spinner, my old Royce is getting an overhaul. I've had this in my TT stash for years and often thought about giving it a new life. Well the time has come for a stripdown and a motor rumble cure. A new plinth for a 9" and 12" arm should see it good for another decade or two. If it's good enough I'll put an ET2 on it.

For those of you not familiar with this old Aussie TT here's a couple of pics attachicon.gif100_2545.JPGattachicon.gif100_2546.JPGattachicon.gif100_2547.JPGattachicon.gif100_2548.JPGattachicon.gif100_2549.JPGattachicon.gif100_2550.JPGattachicon.gif100_2551.JPG.

Looking forward to watching this. 12 or 16 inch?

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[moderator post] some respect please for the OP, has gone to some trouble to share this project, least we can do is not dump on it from get go [end moderator post]

 

Agreed, Al.  My apologies.

 

Andy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have got bored with building amps.

So it is time for a new Vinyl spinner, my old Royce is getting an overhaul. I've had this in my TT stash for years and often thought about giving it a new life. Well the time has come for a stripdown and a motor rumble cure. A new plinth for a 9" and 12" arm should see it good for another decade or two. If it's good enough I'll put an ET2 on it.

For those of you not familiar with this old Aussie TT here's a couple of pics attachicon.gif100_2545.JPGattachicon.gif100_2546.JPGattachicon.gif100_2547.JPGattachicon.gif100_2548.JPGattachicon.gif100_2549.JPGattachicon.gif100_2550.JPGattachicon.gif100_2551.JPG.

 

Awesome project, look forward to watching this one develop. I just finally sourced (thanks @lovetube) a Garrard 301 to "polish" sometime in the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Marc,

I always fancied a 301 but settled for a 401, it was in my price range. I don't pretend for a moment that this will rival my 12D, the title should give it away to all but the least educated (seems to be quite a few here) amongst us. This is after all a cheapo budget job from the dark days of Vinyl. The redeeming qualities being those of a high quality bearing and a super heavy platter. All in all I think it may have a chance at being better than the sum of its parts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Marc and Al,

I'm going to apologize in advance in case I'm out of order, please don't delete this post.  I have Just noticed that I had 22 replies to my original post while I was out working on my Royce, but they seem to have disappeared.....

Wow, have I missed a hissy fight between the anointed? If you lot need to dump on me, go for it, I don't need protecting from wannabees and legends in their own lunch time.

There are only one or two people that I consider worth listening to. They are the doers and the ones that will show the steps they take to their own DIY heaven or hell. Plus those that put in the time and effort for constructive criticism and suggestion. There are a few of us left.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looking forward to watching this. 12 or 16 inch?

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

 Upfront,

 

It is a 12" platter and very heavy with a lead lining. A high quality brass and Bronze bearing that is nice and quiet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Marc and Al,

I'm going to apologize in advance in case I'm out of order, please don't delete this post.  I have Just noticed that I had 22 replies to my original post while I was out working on my Royce, but they seem to have disappeared.....

Wow, have I missed a hissy fight between the anointed? If you lot need to dump on me, go for it, I don't need protecting from wannabees and legends in their own lunch time.

There are only one or two people that I consider worth listening to. They are the doers and the ones that will show the steps they take to their own DIY heaven or hell. Plus those that put in the time and effort for constructive criticism and suggestion. There are a few of us left.

Petit-fou-fou, well said. 

 

For what its worth, these turntables are, IMO, works of industrial art, and worth of plenty of respect. 

 

It sounds like a great project. Look forward to hearing how it progresses, and your impressions of how it sounds. I've never heard one.

 

I imagine that it will be quite pitch stable, and that how quiet it is will depend on the design and construction of the plinth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Hensa

Petit-fou-fou,

I'm not one with the skills for DIY but I love watching these kinds of projects as they unfold with lots of pictures of progress. You don't need to be a skilled at DIY to have an admiration of those who embark on these projects.. I have a feeling this one is going to turn into a jewel!

Good luck and looking forward to following your progress!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Guest Muon

Love these type of big ol beasts from yesteryear, good luck with the restoration :cool:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Upfront,

It is a 12" platter and very heavy with a lead lining. A high quality brass and Bronze bearing that is nice and quiet.

Well worth the effort mate. In dire need of some elbow grease. Will be interesting to see what you do with it. I've bid on a couple of these.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great project.

 

I take it its a belt drive, going to be a big belt.

Hows the platter bearing? Hopefully its not worn or pitted badly. If you can get a smooth running motor and platter you'll have a great deck.

Perhaps you could separate the motor to the platter bearing?.....going to need a heavy plinth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So whats the first step?

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


First step is clean it all up and check for wear. The bearing is fine and runs smoothly. The motor has been running for 24 hours after I put some new bushings in it. The bearings are plain sintel types now. It ran in the fridge overnight to keep the motor cool as the bearings bedded in.

The motor is an absolute dog, it shakes and vibrates like the squeezes' favourite toy. I will probably isolate it and drive the platter through an intermediate bearing.

The platter is going to be bloody heavy. The Marble won't do the job I think I'll have to go with a hollow plinth loaded with Garnet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is it worth paying to get the motor balanced?

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The motor doesn't appear to have been balanced by the manufacturer. It looks like the vibration isolation provided by the rubber mounts and the belt was sufficient for the time. When I can get on the lathe the rotor can go between centres and be balanced, I'm hoping this will allow the motor to sit in it's original position. A new pulley might be in order as well, with a bit of pickling to age it. I think the original look should be kept as long as feasible with a resto job. The motor is still almost as rough as the toy (Janes' 73 stroker shovel) In the meantime I will continue cleaning the casting and thinking about a plinth for the old girl. The platter is nicely balanced and spins for a long time after a good push so, a bit of good news.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pff - you are obviously taking the Commonwealth to a level which is way beyond its original sonic delivery.  Respect! :thumb:

 

But I suggest, in doing this, it is not necessary to keep sympathetic with the 'original look'.  If a new pulley is in order then maybe a highly polished one will sound better than a 'pickled' one?

 

And (from my experience) don't be afraid to change to a silicon (round-section) belt, rather than a flat belt - which I assume the original belt is.  IMO, S70 is the best choice.  Renseal in Dandenong South can supply both nitrile and silicon, flat or O-ring, in various N/S ratings and many sizes.

 

Andy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Andy and Rickhead,

 

Sorry Nigel I had to do that with the name, it just came over me. Andy I will swap to a decent belt, the original looked like one of those great big Ozpost Green lackey bands.

A highly polished pulley might act as a friction modifier and cause speed variations, I will investigate all options and check the least sensible sounding.

The Chassis (for want of a better description) has been stripped of its paint and looks rather spiffing. I'll give it a bit of a polish tomorrow and put up the pics.

Here for now is the chassis after stripping. The chassis appears to be made of Tobin metal.post-151141-0-41769000-1435428357_thumb.post-151141-0-79262000-1435428375_thumb.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice! Will be interesting to see how the platter comes up with similar treatment.

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here it is, stripped and polished. The chassis is Tobin Bronze and sand cast, probably from a board pattern using green sharp as the mould.

I am surprised at how rough n ready the chassis is when compared to the machining quality of the platter. The chassis will have to be bedded as I am not going to plane the back of the casting. Bedding will also give it a bit of help in the isolation stakes.

After showing initial promise the motor may have to go to motor heaven as the motor uses a plain thrust bearing for support of the rotor. I had hoped that the magnetic circuit would hold the rotor in its vertical alignment and running height. To fit a bottom support or bearing is going to be a big undertaking for such a low quality motor, I'm going to have to keep an eye out for a free running one while I think of plinth design.

The platter is a sand cast alloy of unknown type, not that this matters as it is good and hard after all these years so it will take a high level of polish. The machining is first class and the spindle has near perfect run out and concentricity. A better and slightly larger ball for the load end will help with the overall noise of the plain Pot Brass bearing.

The platter still has perfect dynamic and static balance.

I am secretly quite pleased with the unit so far and expect that it will be truly,

"Greater than the sum of its parts"

I'm not damning the Royce with faint praise.post-151141-0-76198300-1435476379_thumb.post-151141-0-51556400-1435476357_thumb.post-151141-0-45141500-1435476311_thumb.post-151141-0-10248100-1435476262_thumb.post-151141-0-91604100-1435476657_thumb.

post-151141-0-08372100-1435476285_thumb.

post-151141-0-01729400-1435476336_thumb.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Classifieds Statistics


    Currently Active Ads

    Total Sales (Since 2018)

    Total Sales Value (Last 14 Days)

    Total Ads Value (Since March 2020)
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By daro
      Item Condition: Brand new, never used Shipping Options: Pickup available but audition is not available.,Pickup available and you can audition.,Shipping is included in price. Suburb or Town: Lindfield State: New South Wales Payment Method: Pickup - Cash, Paypal Reason for selling: Abandoned DIY project Further information: 
      I have for sale an Elma Rotary 4 pole 24 way switch (model 04-4133). Perfect for a High-End 2-channel ladder stepped attenuator. It comes with the stop pin.
      I bought it a couple of years ago from the hificollective in the UK to build a stepped attenuator for my DIY project. I could not find time to finish the project, so the sale.
       
      "High quality selector switch, non-magnetic bodied switch with 3 micron gold plated contacts over copper alloy. Ceramic wafer. Swiss made. Mounting hole 10.2mm, 6mm diameter shaft, 15mm shaft length body dimensions 76mm L x (32mm dia. x 25mm dia.). Make-before-break type. Superb for ladder stepped attenuators, balanced stereo stepped attenuators and stereo balanced TVC selector. Elma part number 04-4133."
       
      Happy to post it. I'll cover the cost. Pickup also available from Lindfield (2070).
       
      Photos: 
       

       

       

       

       
       
    • By kramered
      Item Condition: Excellent Shipping Options: Pickup available but audition is not available.,Pickup available and you can audition.,Shipping is included in price. Suburb or Town: Blue Mountains State: New South Wales Payment Method: EFT, COD Reason for selling: NLR Further information: 
      Michell Engineering Orbe SE Turntable with full Stage 3 Gert Pedersen upgrade featuring dual-level machined acrylic and flagship suspension system.
      Everything in perfect working order and given full bill of health in mid-February 2020 by Sydney turntable setup specialist Mark Busby.
      Additional Package Items:
      Famous Trans-Fi Terminator Linear Tracking Air Bearing arm (cartridge not included) provided with air pump and long air tube.
      Trans-Fi Tomahawk wand.
      Includes silver interconnect cable.
      Includes Optional Upgrade Origin Live Motor Drive Ultra controller (33/45rpm).
      Includes Optional Upgrade external Balanced Transformer Motor featuring large high current power supply.
      Includes Michell Engineering Record Clamp.
      Miscellaneous spare parts
       
      Photos: Advertisements without photos of the actual item will not be approved.




    • By Stevan.B
      Item Condition: Brand new in packaging Shipping Options: Pickup available but audition is not available. Suburb or Town: Kellyville State: New South Wales Payment Method: Cash Reason for selling: Surplus to requirements Further information: 
       
      Single pack of Absorb XHD50 in black (6x 2400x1200 sheets). 
       
      only needed two but MOQ is 3 packs. Perfect for DIY acoustic panels or bass traps.
      Photos: Advertisements without photos of the actual item will not be approved.

    • By audioaddict78
      Item Condition: Cartridge Excellent. Stylus will need re-tipping Shipping Options: Pickup available but audition is not available.,Shipping is included in price. Suburb or Town: Dulwich Hill State: New South Wales Payment Method: PayPal, Cash on Pickup, EFT Reason for selling: Trying something new Further information:  Bought this cartridge when I purchased a MoFi UltraDeck turntable less than 2 years ago.
      The cart and cantilever are in excellent condition. The stylus will need re-tipping. It's had about 900hrs of use and starting to show.
      This cart goes for around $899RRP. $190 is very reasonable. Retipping will cost around $160 - $220
       
       
       
      UltraTracker Highlights
      UltraTracker extracts immense amounts of detail, dynamics, tone, and texture from LPs. Literally made to live in records’ grooves, the configuration gives this cartridge innate advantages few others can claim at this price. MoFi cartridges are designed by looking at where a record starts: On a cutting lathe like the model used at Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab. UltraTracker features a V-Twin dual-magnet generator that mirrors the layout of the cutting head that originally makes a record’s grooves. Employing two low-mass, powerful magnets aligned in a V formation parallel with the record grooves, this cartridge features excellent tracking ability.
      V-Twin dual-magnet generator Nude Elliptical stylus Well-damped billet aluminum body 3.5mV output WELL-DAMPED BILLET ALUMINUM BODY
      The well-damped billet aluminum body controls resonances for tight, accurate bass reproduction. UltraTracker delivers finely tuned wide-bandwidth audio, with extension at both frequency extremes and no smearing of detail.
      NUDE-ELLIPTICAL DIAMOND STYLUS
      By using a nude-elliptical diamond stylus, UltraTracker easily tracks complex dynamic passages. You’ll hear superb detail and experience musical emotionalism that will send shivers down your spine.
      Specifications:-
      Type: Dual Magnet Stereo Frequency Response: 20 to 25,000 Hz Recommended Load Impedance: 47,000 Capacitance: 100pF Output Voltage: 3.5 mV Tracking Force: 1.8 – 2.2grams Stylus Construction: Nude eliptical Weight: 9.7 g To see more of the MoFi range 

      Photos: 
       


    • By joshwd
      Item:Turntable
      Price Range:1200
      Item Condition: Used, good condition 
      Extra Info:
      Am looking for a good well looked after TT , $1000-1200; the clearaudio concept is my dream unit but am also open to alternatives.  Am in a pretty remote part of NSW so will have to be shipped (am happy to pay).
       
      Thanks!
       
×
×
  • Create New...