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Anyone following Formula E racing? This is a FIA single-seat fully electric racing car series (http://www.fiaformulae.com/en/guide/overview.aspx). I think they just completed season one and Renault has signed on as a manufacturer for season two. Many drivers in Formula E are ex-F1 drivers so there is only a small drop off in quality compared with F1. 

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Interesting article on the Tesla strategy and the chances of a Model III sales success

 

 

Tesla Motors Inc.'s Model 3 Ambitions May Be More Realistic Than You Think
 

Tesla Motors(NASDAQ:TSLA) CEO Elon Musk believes that with the help of its planned more-affordable fully electric vehicle and its upcoming Gigafactory lithium-ion vehicle-battery production plant, Tesla can sell 500,000 cars per year by 2020. But many investors have flagged his vision as a pipe dream. After all, electric vehicles, or EVs, are only a fraction of the market, so there's no evidence that demand for a lower-cost Tesla vehicle would be sufficient to drive such significant sales -- right? Even more, won't well-capitalized, highly experienced competitors stomp all over Tesla when they join the EV race? For answers to these questions, buckle up for an in-depth look at the company's record so far and its future place in the EV industry.

tesla-fremont-factory_large.png

Tesla factory in Fremont, California. Image source: Tesla Motors.

Tesla is betting big on Model 3
In August 2006, just before the recession, Musk published his "secret master plan" for Tesla. In his own words, Musk summarized the plan like this:

  • Build sports car
  • Use that money to build an affordable car
  • Use that money to build an even more affordable car

Importantly, Musk noted each subsequent decrease in price should drive higher sales volumes.

"The strategy of Tesla is to enter at the high end of the market, where customers are prepared to pay a premium, and then drive [down-market] as fast as possible to higher unit volume and lower prices with each successive model," Musk explained.

For the most part, Tesla has stuck to this plan. The Tesla Roadster became available in 2008. Priced above $100,000, the Roadster was an expensive two-door demonstration of what electric cars can do, and it helped fund the development of the company's next vehicle: the Model S.

The four-door sedan was aimed at proving electric cars can not only compete with, but be better than comparably priced gas-powered cars. If the vehicle's accoladesto date are the measure of whether Tesla achieved this, it certainly did.

model-s-warm-silver-2_large.png

Model S. Image source: Tesla Motors.

But the Model S wasn't exactly affordable. With deliveries beginning in 2012, Model S initially had a starting price of about $60,000 (until Tesla said insufficient demand for its planned 40 kWh battery pack led the company to stop production of the entry-level battery, leaving the lowest-priced Model S at $69,900 for the 60 kWh version).

Tesla is now moving to the third stage of its plan. This "even more affordable car" is dubbed the Model 3. With it, Tesla wants to finally bring a compelling fully electric car to the masses.

As Tesla continues to sell Model S and preps its Model X sport utility vehicle for a production ramp-up, the company is already laying the groundwork for Model 3. Aiming to price the vehicle at $35,000, Tesla hopes the car will appeal to hundreds of thousands of consumers. With plans to launch the vehicle in 2017, the car is one of the main reasons behind Tesla's under-construction $5 billion Gigafactory, which is set to begin electric cell production next year.

Given Tesla's nearly $34 billion market capitalization, and with the company currently selling about 10,000 vehicles per quarter, investors are clearly depending on the Model 3 to be a major success. Failing to sell hundreds of thousands of cars by the end of the decade and millions by 2025 would make Tesla stock grossly overvalued at today's prices.

This raises the question: Is Tesla's vision for selling 500,000 vehicles per year by 2020 only a pipe dream? Or does a close look reveal it might be more realistic than critics suggest?

The path to 500,000
Piecing together commentary from management, investors can get some idea of how Tesla might go about reaching 500,000 vehicles per year.

It will mostly depend on Model 3.

Sure, sales of Tesla's premium-priced vehicles look set to grow beyond 2014 levels. Not only does Tesla aim to sell 50,000 Model S units this year, but Musk believes demand for its Model X SUV will rival demand for Model S. In other words, it's possible as many as 100,000 of these 500,000 in deliveries could come from sales of Tesla's luxury vehicles. But this still leaves about 400,000 vehicles before Tesla arrives at 500,000 in annual sales.

tesla-vehicle-sales-forecast-5-years_lar

Data for 2012, 2013, and 2014 retrieved from respective annual SEC filings. Years with asterisks indicate estimates based on forecasts and comments from management, as well as extrapolation from this commentary by author. Chart source: Author.

But when the Model 3 goes on sale, will it create sufficient demand to fill that gap?

There is risk to any prediction -- particularly when it comes to projections based on huge growth rates. But a close examination of current demand for Tesla's vehicles suggests Musk's ambitious vision may not be as far-fetched as it would first seem. Here are three reasons.

1. Sales of long-range EVs are soaring. Many observers of the EV market lump together hybrids, plug-in hybrids, short-range EVs, and long-range EVs into a single category. This is a huge mistake. Since some of these categories are growing at significantly slower rates than others, doing this dramatically understates the trajectory of demand growth for compelling EVs.

To understand the current state of the EV market that applies to Tesla's vehicles, irrelevant vehicle types often included in analyzing EV sales must be identified and discounted. Sure, hybrids, plug-in hybrids, short-range fully electric vehicles, and long-range fully electric vehicles are all greener alternatives to internal combustion engine vehicles. But just because they share this characteristic doesn't mean they should be evaluated in a single category. Instead, consider each of these subcategories individually, with a focus on their respective value proposition:

Conventional hybrids are so far removed from fully electric vehicles that they would be better off included in the traditional internal combustion engine vehicle category. With no way to plug in and charge, this vehicle type still requires owners to visit a gas station every time they run low on fuel, eliminating the option to charge at home and run the vehicle solely on a battery and electric motor. While conventional hybrids are rarely included in an analysis of the EV market, it's important to realize how irrelevant this vehicle type is to the market that applies to Tesla.

Plug-in hybrids are essentially EVs required to cart around a giant gas-powered generator.

Short-range EVs, which I'll define as fully electric vehicles with 100 miles of range or less, are made for short-distance driving. Many of their owners will opt to drive fuel-burning vehicles when traveling longer distances.

Long-range EVs, which I'll define as those with 200 miles or more of range, fall in an entirely different category. These vehicles offer electric-motor acceleration, faster charging (because a larger battery can handle a faster charge), and complete freedom from gas stations. Furthermore, most drivers travel fewer than 200 miles in a day, so these electric vehicles can generally be charged at home rather than at a charging station. And since drivers travel more than 200 miles in a day far less often than they travel fewer than 100 miles in a day, the number of electric charging stations required to support these vehicles when traveling is a fraction of what would be required to support short-range fully electric vehicles.

When viewed in terms of the value propositions each type of "green" car offers consumers, long-range EVs are clearly in their own category.

Only one EV currently fits the definition of a long-range EV: Tesla's Model S. Because of that, the Model S is the best and only indicator of the demand for long-range EVs.

So how is the market for long-range EVs looking? Despite the Model S' now $75,000-plus price tag, sales are soaring, up 56% in Tesla's most recent quarter. This is not just an isolated moment of growth: The company believes it will achieve this same growth rate for the full year.The bullish demand story for long-range EVs has been consistent since the Model S first went on sale in 2012.

tesla-model-s-sales-growth_large.png

Data for chart retrieved from Tesla quarterly SEC filings for quarters shown and each quarter's respective year-ago quarters. Chart source: Author.

Furthermore, if the Model X, which Tesla plans to begin delivering this year, captures the same sort of attention among comparably priced SUVs, this growth rate for $75,000-plus fully electric long-range vehicles could persist for another year or two. In fact, it already looks like this will be the case. Even with zero advertising and the production version of Model X yet to be shown off, Tesla has over 20,000 deposit-backed net orders on the books.

2. These soaring sales required no advertising spending. Tesla hasn't spent a cent on advertising to achieve its current sales growth. Test drives and word-of-mouth marketing have been enough to boost demand faster than the company can boost supply.

Inherent benefits, or perhaps even advantages, for long-range EVs compared to their gas-powered counterparts build a compelling value proposition -- enticing enough for the car itself to serve as the ultimate advertisement. The more Tesla vehicles there are on the road, the more people understand them, and the more sales rise.

Tesla management explained this word-of-mouth effect in a letter to shareholders in 2013. "As more people see our car on the road, take a test drive or talk with another Model S owner, more demand is created for our product. Demand exceeds supply, despite no advertising, no discounts and no paid endorsements."

3. Model S success makes a case for Model 3 success. Unfortunately, there isn't a lower-priced electric vehicle currently for sale that can help us predict the demand for Model 3. All lower-cost vehicles with electric powertrains fall short of either being fully electric or having the ability to entirely replace a gas car as the only household vehicle.

The only way to assess the potential for Model 3, therefore, is to examine the success of Model S at its price point and think about how this could carry over to a lower price point.

How's the Model S selling compared to its $75,000-plus peers? During the first quarter, the Model S was the top-selling vehicle in the high-end premium sedan segment for all of North America. Therefore, if the Model S' success is any indication of the sort of success a long-range EV could have at a much lower starting price, demand for Model 3 will likely be substantial.

tesla-premium-sedans-market-share_large.

Given the much larger addressable market for vehicles starting at $35,000 compared to the market for those starting at $75,000, it's certainly possible Model 3 could generate enough demand to sell hundreds of thousands of cars per year by 2020. Indeed, the addressable market for sedans at this lower price range is so much larger that a handful of auto manufacturers might sell hundreds of thousands of $35,000-plus long-range EVs per year and still represent only a fraction of the market. For perspective, BMW alone sold about 480,000 of its 3 Series BMWs (one of three of its sedans with starting prices in the range of Tesla's targeted price point of $35,000 for the Model 3) in 2014.

While it might be a tad naive to imagine this success carrying over proportionately to lower-priced vehicles in which the addressable market is much larger, it would also be ignorant not to see the company's success at the high end of the market as at least some evidence that a Tesla vehicle at half the price of Model S could be quite compelling.

Musk articulated this thought process during the company's annual shareholder meeting in April: "As we bring out new models, in the Model X -- in the SUV category, obviously -- and then more affordable cars, this bodes well for being able to replicate this share for Tesla in other product segments."

tesla-battery-drive-unit_large.png

Tesla's choice of making an all-electric car with the battery across the floor of the vehicle is completely unique in the auto industry. For now, Tesla is in a class by itself when it comes to building long-range EVs compelling enough to replace their gas-powered counterparts. Formidable competition in the space could spur greater interest in the category and accelerate a larger transition to Tesla-like vehicles. Image source: Tesla Motors.

4. Long-range, electric competition might benefit Tesla. Finally, and perhaps most important, it's quite possible that competition from other auto manufacturers could actually benefit Tesla. Sure, the introduction of competing electric long-range vehicles might sway some potential Tesla buyers to alternative brands, but if the competing brands make just-as-compelling electric vehicles, the same word-of-mouth and test-drive marketing that is driving demand for Tesla's cars could have outsize benefits on the total number of people interested in buying a Tesla-like vehicle. In essence, the entrance of formidable competition would accelerate demand growth for the whole segment.

So, are Musk's ambitions for Model 3 realistic? Quite possibly. But given the many uncertainties in the equation, investors should still categorize Tesla's big predictions as speculative. Not only is it possible that competing auto manufacturers will snap up a good portion of Tesla's upside, but there are always production risks for the company, notably given that it has never produced a vehicle at volumes even close to hundreds of thousands per year.

But investors who own the stock and are considering selling because of its very forward-looking valuation should think twice. The small but optimistic beginning of long-range electric vehicles is looking quite promising. And Tesla is positioned right smack in the middle of this fast-growing opportunity.

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I'm struggling with their plan and pricing or even comments of princing in that article. Looked on the tesla local site cheapest tesla is $122,731 Australian dollars ...for stock base model car no options

so the $60k starting price and then $75k mentioned on the article is way way off ... Unless missing something or this another case of cars from overseas double in price when get here ?

So as far as affordable model goes .... Sorry they are so far off the ball park I would say they have missed completely the no2 target they set of an affordable car.

If their next goal is a more affordable car I shudder to think what price that would be at !

Ps I checked car sales too. Cheapest car they list is tesla model s 85 at $120,648 plus on roads. The 85D is $169,788 plus on roads.

Sorry this is not affordable !

As a note yes I checked the tesla USA website and cash price there was $76,200 for an all wheel drive 70 D and $85,000 for the 85D Awd. So we are definitely being robbed rotten here. Keeping in mind the U.S. Site lists a further $7500 federal tax credit that we do not get here !

So much for parity pricing ! Am I missing something prof ?

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Tesla have a parity pricing policy, its US price -> dollar conversion + local taxes. US$70k converts to about AUD$108k, add roughly $20k 'luxury car tax', state stamp duties etc (varies from state to state - none in ACT for instance) and this accounts for the price difference. They are about $20k more now that they price that I paid for mine - all currency fluctuation. It certainly isn't a cheap car here.

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Tesla have a parity pricing policy, its US price -> dollar conversion + local taxes. US$70k converts to about AUD$108k, add roughly $20k 'luxury car tax', state stamp duties etc (varies from state to state - none in ACT for instance) and this accounts for the price difference. They are about $20k more now that they price that I paid for mine - all currency fluctuation. It certainly isn't a cheap car here.

 

well in that case their "more affordable car" is probably still going to end up with a luxury tax territory then am thinking. pity....still leaves room in that case for an affordable electric car for the people...someone will eventually come up with one ...you would hope.

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The way the AUD$ is going against the US$ the US$30k Model 3 may well be a AUD$60k Model 3

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As a note yes I checked the tesla USA website and cash price there was $76,200 for an all wheel drive 70 D and $85,000 for the 85D Awd. So we are definitely being robbed rotten here. Keeping in mind the U.S. Site lists a further $7500 federal tax credit that we do not get here !

So much for parity pricing ! Am I missing something prof ?

The other thing is that the US website price doesn't include sales tax as the rate is different in each state

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The other thing is that the US website price doesn't include sales tax as the rate is different in each state

 

other way around I think...they actually get tax credits depending on state too. $9k upto $15.5k ! we dont get that which only makes better in their favour. we have severe taxes and on road costs here which only go up as cars get more expensive and particularly so where the tesla is pitched. none of which helps the local price.

 

comes back to what government is doing and makers are doing. 

 

as far as electric cars for the people the fiat 500e could be an option....

 

http://www.topgear.com/au/cars/reviews/fiat/500/2013/e

 

The 500e is a car Fiat would rather not have had to build. But it didn’t have much choice in the matter, as it needs some zero-emission car credits to balance out its Jeep and SRT gas-gulpers and keep its corporate average within US government limits. Even so, you couldn’t blame Fiat if it hadn’t gone to too much trouble.

But, the good news is, it has. From the outside, the car looks pretty much like every other cooking 500 on the road – just a couple of floor panels are different from the petrol-engined models – but don’t be misled. This is a thorough reworking. And thoroughly good it is, too.

The 500e’s vital statistics of a 140km range, 24kWh battery and four-hour charge time only tell you part of the story. Other than the Abarth models, this is probably the most fun 500 you can buy. It might be carrying extra battery weight, but it’s been located so stealthily, the car’s front/rear weight balance has been improved from 64:36 to an altogether more chuckable 57:43.

Likewise, the 83kW motor might take the thick end of nine seconds to hit 100km/h, but it’s the way it gets to 50km/h that’s the real story. In town, with 200Nm of torque from 0rpm, it’ll screech its tyres away and keep them on the edge of adhesion for several whole metres.

Stopping, unlike many electric cars, is also smooth and free from the crudeness evident in some EVs. As is the rest of the 500e. The central dials are now an info centre showing every imaginable statistic you can think of about the car and the journey. So you’ll never have the excuse that you didn’t know.

Fiat has also worked hard on removing all the other barriers to electric-car ownership. By rolling all the federal and state electric car subsidies into the three-year lease, the $31,800 500e costs around the same per month as a standard 500. And it throws in 12 days of hire cars, for those longer out-of-town journeys, for free.

So, if you live in California – the only place the electron-powered Fiat is available for the moment – there really isn’t any reason not to own a 500e: it’s fun, it looks cute, it costs the same to lease as a petrol variant and you get free hire cars when you want them. Fiat might not have wanted to make this car, but we should consider ourselves lucky it did.

 

 

though as have posted elsewhere it looks really like a made for california thing. with fiat saying they loose about the cost of a regular fiat 500 each time they sell one ! so if they can dont actually want to sell any :D

 

so can just imagine what something like that would end up selling for here $50K even if they did a tesla type "price parity" ???? against what a under $14k drive away for the regular petrol version with 4 times the range and running on the smell of an oily rag ? ... we've probably still got a little way to go .... 

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cheapest electric car at present in oz appears to be the nissan leaf...

 

@ $57,619 !

http://www.carsales.com.au/bnc/details/Nissan-LEAF-2014/SHRM-AD-5607011/?Cr=4

 

though seem to sell for $38,490 drive away...wow $20k off the list price !

 

http://www.carsales.com.au/nearnew/details/Nissan-LEAF-2013/AGC-AD-17253537/?Cr=0

 

other option is the mitsubishi i-miev at $54,520

http://www.carsales.com.au/bnc/details/Mitsubishi-i-MiEV-2012/SHRM-AD-5506013/?Cr=2

 

but that too like the nissan leaf when you see they are actually trying to sell you a car built 3 years ago as a new car ... makes you wonder if anyone is buying these things which most probably wouldn't for the kind of car your getting for your money there. just doesnt make any sense ! 

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^ Also those cars are just 'town trolleys'.  We need the range that only Tesla has at the moment.  Was hoping to be able to afford a Model 3 somehow (magically) in ....oh....about 15 years but those prices don't look good.

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All this talk about Telstra cars has me worried. Can you imagine the ongoing costs, the breakdowns, the poor performance every late afternoon. Leave me out of it!

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Whilst this article comes from the 'evobsession' website, I can actually see this happen. We can see it happening now with the falling cost of PV sucking the profitability from the old power generators and distributors. At the moment the power of ICE cars lays in the easy availability of fuel. There is no range anxiety as there is a petrol station in every suburb and every town but what will happen when the EV market penetration reaches a certain point that marginal fossil fuel retailers become unprofitable and start closing? Suddenly there may not be a petrol station in every suburb or every town but there are powerpoint everywhere...

 

 

Electric Car Tipping Point (For Domination) Within 10 Years, Tesla CTO JB Straubel Predicts (Video)
July 21st, 2015 by Zach
 

Tesla Motors CTO JB Straubel was the headliner at Intersolar North America last week. He talked about the transition to lithium-ion batteries and how that opened the floodgates for electric cars and stationary storage (eventually); the synergy between EVs, solar, and grid storage; the growth of solar power and grid storage; blah blah blah.

I know, I actually love all that stuff as much as the rest of you — it’s what I read, edit, & write about every day(!) — but it’s basically all general history and trends we know all about. But then JB dropped the awesome-bomb:

“I think we’re at the beginning of a new cost-decline curve, and, you know, this is something where there’s a lot of similarities to what happened with photovoltaics. Almost no one [would have predicted] that photovoltaic prices would have dropped as fast as they have, and storage is right at the cliff, heading down that price curve. It’s soon going to be cheaper to drive a car on electricity — a pure EV on electricity — than it is to drive a gasoline car. And as soon as we see that kind of shift in the actual cost of operation in a car that you can actually use for your daily driver, you know, from all manufacturers I believe we’re going to see electric vehicles come to dominate the whole transportation fleet.

“Also, that same battery cost decrease is going to drive batteries in the grid. There’s going to be much faster growth of grid energy storage than I think most people expected. You suddenly get to have energy that’s 100% firm and buffered from photovoltaics that’s cheaper than fossil energy. And we’re within sort of grasping distance of that goal, which is very, very exciting.

“Because once we get to that, and there really is no going back, it will make sense to do this economically without any environmental consideration whatsoever. So that’s the amazing tipping point that’s going to happen within I’m quite certain the next 10 years.”

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EV solar is pretty much defunct in this country though...business has never installed it... so sorry i cant see the argument.

 

batteries are ridiculous in cost...and those with solar now...might look at batteries which might drive popularity but cant see too many putting in solar or batteries in the future....

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I think that what he is saying is that the price trajectory of batteries will be similar to that of PV panels in that prices will fall faster and deeper than predicted. This will result in cheaper and generally better EVs than their ICE equivalent, and grid connected battery storage that will create a tipping point for ICE powered vehicles and traditional power generators. It will certainly overcome intermittent generation issues with large scale PV and to a lesser extent, wind (its less of an issue with grid connected wind generators as it's always windy somewhere) but it will also allow coal fired generators to become more efficient as they can dump their overnight production into batteries. Large scale EV adoption will also create increased demand for traditional power generators, at least until battery storage becomes so cheap that they are unnecessary.

Once a significant part of the vehicle fleet is battery powered (and EV buses and trucks are coming in the next year or so) then many petrol stations become uneconomic and will close, further driving the shift to EVs

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the trajectory for PV in this country was heavily supported by subsidy and incentive....that might as well be non existent now for panels or batteries.

 

given it cost me last week $13 to drive to geelong from other end of melbourne and back, am not too sure the value of electric cars at the present. not at the cost they are going for.

 

ps most busses and trucks dont refeul at petrol stations...happens at depots and with diesel....as opposed to petrol.

 

its a bit of chicken vs egg at the moment... I feel :)

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PV subsidies for households are unchanged as that is electoral poison even for Abbott. Instead he's cut subsidies to large scale PV installations when really it should be the other way around as household PV can hold its own without a subsidy. It costs me $0 to drive to Geelong and back if I recharge at a supercharger, petrol will only get more expensive, batteries (the major cost of an EV) will only get cheaper.

Diesel depots will suffer the same fate as electric trucks make an even more compelling case

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PV subsidies for households are unchanged as that is electoral poison even for Abbott. Instead he's cut subsidies to large scale PV installations when really it should be the other way around as household PV can hold its own without a subsidy. It costs me $0 to drive to Geelong and back if I recharge at a supercharger, petrol will only get more expensive, batteries (the major cost of an EV) will only get cheaper.

Diesel depots will suffer the same fate as electric trucks make an even more compelling case

 

PV subsidies have changed massively ...we are down to 2/5ths of bugger all for FIT. I couldnt justify a new system at the current rate. it doesnt hold its own without subsidy.

 

I'm not paying over $120k on a car to save $13 for a trip to geelong. even on the outer at 25,000 km a year my total fuel bill is going to be $1650 ! and even if complete 100% depreciation of my car over three years thats a total overall cost of $6291 a year...cant justify an electric car at that rate even if only 50% depreciation and zero fuel cost ! 

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Don't pay over $120k, a Model S is not for you - that doesn't make sense, but a US$30k Model 3 or a new gen Nissan Leaf EV starts to make a lot of sense.

A Model S makes sense for me because I'm doing up to 1000km a week, most of that recharged at superchargers and I'm a recidivist early adopter :cool:

 

EVs are only going to get cheaper and better though

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Don't pay over $120k, a Model S is not for you - that doesn't make sense, but a US$30k Model 3 or a new gen Nissan Leaf EV starts to make a lot of sense.

A Model S makes sense for me because I'm doing up to 1000km a week, most of that recharged at superchargers and I'm a recidivist early adopter :cool:

 

EVs are only going to get cheaper and better though

 

am sure the it makes sense to people for all sorts of reasons, just doubt right now its for the fuel saving ! even 1000 km/wk is only $7800 a year in fuel cost....

 

with 3 year old stock of leaf on car lots they cant give away on all sorts of deals am not sure a new gen one is great buying with that sort of track record. the $30k us model 3 lets see....

 

and yes quite correct EVs are indeed going to be cheaper and better and we have early adopters to thank for that ...like with most new tech :)

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The Model S is a 15 year car for me (most of my cars have been 10 year cars)

15 x $7800 = $117,000 even at today's petrol prices. It front loads the total cost of ownership but lifetime cost is probably going to come out ahead even if only 80% or so of my charging will be at superchargers. Do the costs with a US$30k car...

Add in no routine service requirements for the Tesla vs regular expensive routine service appointments for ICE cars. Of course I'll have the same tyre and windscreen etc costs.

Current Leafs or iMiEVs  should be avoided but Nissan are close to releasing a 200km range completely new model that will be worth a look. GM are working on a 200km EV

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the model s main stumbling block for most I suspect is just the upfront cost...even on lease a quick check your looking at $2.5k a month or $30k a year ...and after 3 years still a balloon of $50k. and thats paying an interest over that time of $14k.

 

people looking for a fuel saving won't buy a 10L/100 large car I quoted it at ...eg a mine will easily do half that at $3380 a year easy and only cost $14k ! to buy over all...so your looking over a 15 year period of $14k plus $3380x15 or $50,700 over a 15 year period. and reality is people won't keep a car like this 15 years ...probably turn it over every 3 at a total cost of $24k or $8k a year ! service cost is in the 100s of dollars...eg my last 3 cars over 9 years averaged out $400 a year. 

 

you'd buy a car like that for other reasons ...awesome car...cutting edge...performance...but cant see the economics...its a bit like solar these days ...I couldnt recommend anyone going solar right now. unless they just want to do it or something.

 

lets see what else comes.... as you say there only going to get cheaper and better :)

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I agree, the Model S is not a car for most people, you either need lots of money or have specific needs for it to make sense but EVs in general will routinely eclipse ICE cars in performance and value within a few years. The 'range anxiety' balance will switch from EV drivers to ICE drivers as EV range increases and more charging options become available

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PV subsidies have changed massively ...we are down to 2/5ths of bugger all for FIT. I couldnt justify a new system at the current rate. it doesnt hold its own without subsidy.

 

I'm not paying over $120k on a car to save $13 for a trip to geelong. even on the outer at 25,000 km a year my total fuel bill is going to be $1650 ! and even if complete 100% depreciation of my car over three years thats a total overall cost of $6291 a year...cant justify an electric car at that rate even if only 50% depreciation and zero fuel cost ! 

 

Horses for courses. One of my mates just collected his new Ferrari 458. A four door Tesla offers performance which is not all that remote from the Ferrari, for a fraction of the price. He is seriously considering one as a second car to cart the family around in.

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All this talk about Telstra cars has me worried. Can you imagine the ongoing costs, the breakdowns, the poor performance every late afternoon. Leave me out of it!

 
 

Not electric car specific, although might get some interest.

 

http://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-highway/

 

Remotely hack the car to take control of:

  • Steering
  • Breaks
  • Ignition
  • Other systems (AC, wipers, etc.)
Edited by davewantsmoore

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Tesla have a hacking competition where they invite hackers to try and take control of the car. The best anyone has been able to do so far is toot the horn and open the doors. They haven't been able to gain access to driving functions unlike Jeep. I suppose thats what happens when your car is built by a Silicon Valley software company rather than a traditional car company

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