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On 28/06/2019 at 11:22 AM, betty boop said:

“We are moving up a gear in the transformation towards sustainable mobility, thereby making our company fit for the future," said Harald Kruger, chairman of the BMW board.

There appear to be some disagreement with follow board member reported here https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/28/19154233/bmw-electric-vehicles-ev-event-executive-overhyped

 

BMW executive and board member Klaus Fröhlich told reporters this week that the shift to cars powered by electricity is “overhyped,” and said that there is “no” consumer demand for them.

 

“From what we see, [all-electric vehicles] are for China and California and everywhere else is better off with [plug-in hybrids] with good EV range,” Fröhlich said. He added that he expects diesel engines to survive for at least 20 more years, and gas engines for at least 30.

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6 minutes ago, LHC said:

There appear to be some disagreement with follow board member reported here https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/28/19154233/bmw-electric-vehicles-ev-event-executive-overhyped

 

BMW executive and board member Klaus Fröhlich told reporters this week that the shift to cars powered by electricity is “overhyped,” and said that there is “no” consumer demand for them.

 

“From what we see, [all-electric vehicles] are for China and California and everywhere else is better off with [plug-in hybrids] with good EV range,” Fröhlich said. He added that he expects diesel engines to survive for at least 20 more years, and gas engines for at least 30.

probably his realistic view of current state id suggest.  there is much hype as he says. WAY WAY too much of it. not balanced with the actual demand and take up... to point ie appears a push rather than a pull.  makers do need to balance this. ie with a supply to feed demand. push doesnt help a heck of a lot. ie you are making stuff people dont want...  just end up with large lots of cars no one wants... eg what nissan found with the first gen leaf. 

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Posted (edited)

This is a pretty good review of the Hyundai Ioniq https://www.drive.com.au/review/2019-hyundai-ioniq-electric-review-121749.html?trackLink=SMH3&utm_source=smh&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=tile-4

 

The writer summarises that basically the buyer pays a premium of $15000 for the all electric powertrain. Of course one could recover this cost from fuel and servicing savings; however expenses from depreciation (above the norm) and eventual battery replacement (if the car is kept that long) would need to be factored in as well.

Edited by LHC

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Posted (edited)

Sarcasm alert.  Clearly electric cars simply can’t compete with their direct petrol counterparts and there is no demand whatsoever for a non-fossil alternative. BMW remain king of the premium RWD sports sedan market.  Yup.  Nothing more to see here.

 

610528A9-3DF8-41B8-8351-636A1A9600C9.jpeg

Edited by Briz Vegas

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I think that was the BMW board member's point, the market is distorted for California and China. 

 

However it is true that the German car makers are struggling to compete with the Model 3 at the moment. 

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California and China, that would be the two big economies.  

 

We have a long way to go on full EVs but BMW have largely sat on their hands since they made the i3 under previous management. In BMWs market segment they are having their butts kicked by Tesla from a product perspective. You only have to look at the UK reviews ( impartial-ish third party that hated on EVs in the past???) to see where this is heading.

 

For other market segments you only have to look at the 12 to 18 month waiting lists on Konas and e-Niros to see that we haven’t really started making EVs yet. 

 

 

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looks like the fake noise has now come in effect post 5 year moratorium ...all EVs now have to be equiped with fake sound so as to sound  like they have a standard internal combustion engine .... 

EU requires carmakers to add fake engine noises to electric cars

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/07/01/business/electric-vehicles-warning-noises-scli-intl-gbr/index.html

 

"Electric vehicles have been hailed as part of the answer to the climate crisis, but for some people they represent a new danger.

Pedestrians can struggle to hear quiet electric and hybrid vehicles coming, which presents a particular risk for blind and visually impaired people.
But as of Monday, all new models of electric and hybrid vehicles developed and sold in the European Union must come equipped with an acoustic sound system.
Vehicles will have to produce a sound when reversing, or driving below 12 miles per hour, according to the UK government.
The sound, produced by an acoustic vehicle alert system (AVAS), will be similar to that of a standard internal combustion engine, and drivers will be able to temporarily disable it if they want.
The measure was passed by the European Parliament in 2014, according to a press release from the European Commission, and a five-year transitional period has now ended."

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Happy to see it's only reversing and low speed.

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59 minutes ago, eman said:

Happy to see it's only reversing and low speed.

Love to have it sounding like v12 Ferrari in full flight or F1 engine on rev limit ! :D that should keep the pedestrians away !

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https://www.drive.com.au/news/europe-mandates-sound-generators-for-evs-121813.html

 

also happening in the us where under 30km/h the fake sound is required...

 

"The US is also heading down a similar path, with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) requiring a hybrid and electric cars to be fitted with an AVAS-style system from September 2020. In the US, the system must operate at speeds up to 30km/h."

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Honda are going to make a killing. I want one, bad. Not fussed about performance, this will be the best little town car. 

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Sime V2 said:

Honda are going to make a killing. I want one, bad. Not fussed about performance, this will be the best little town car.

they are getting a LOT ! of interest in the UK and such ! as they say folk are happy with short range and such .... as it is only designed as a city car.

 

while local honda have said (think posted a link here) they are little scared given reception the honda insite received (leaf only reinforced that).... and so have some reluctance bringing here... ie we might not want it... they still havent ruled it out though....

 

good video that one.... visibility great to see cars returning with good visibility. and great turning circle ! will make it great around town ! i reckon it looks like what would be a perfect runabout... we'd happily have :) expected price tad high but 2nd gen of it likely sort that :D

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That Honda is awesome.

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Just a note of caution here, the Honda looks great, however Honda has had a poor record with hybrid implementation, that coupe hybrid it did was slower with worse economy that the ICE version, and the Insight was a flop. I do hope that it does well but Honda don't have good form with EVs or hybrids

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Just now, proftournesol said:

Just a note of caution here, the Honda looks great, however Honda has had a poor record with hybrid implementation, that coupe hybrid it did was slower with worse economy that the ICE version, and the Insight was a flop. I do hope that it does well but Honda don't have good form with EVs or hybrids

long time between drinks for them though... and they seem to be taking some time to get it right...

 

its models like the honda here that will  ! get folks imagination :)

 

It very much reminds me of my fiat 500 ! and the new fiat 500e will be similarly a very interesting car to come in the next year :) 

 

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Posted (edited)

Watched the Honda E video and now I guess I like it.  Lots of hurdles and questions before you can just go buy one on any rainy Saturday, but there is so much more potential than the 25kWh Honda Clarity lease mobile in the US.

 

E would not work for me.  A better route planner says it would add 60 minutes and a 50 km charging detour to my most regular weekend day trip..  In 5 years when chargers are everywhere this will not be an issue.

 

Charging to 80% or 160km in 30 minutes is fine.  That’s 50 kW average charging rate if my mental maths is right, assuming starting from 10%. On the weekend I watched Pawel in Norway charge his Model 3 on an Ionity hypercharger. He added 180km in 10 minutes.  We have a similar 350kW charger at Toombul shopping town in a Brisbane.  I might give it a go when my car turns up. Toombul is not a great location unless you live in an apartment without a charger or you are arriving in Brisbane from out of town.  It would be better near a road trip destination so you can top up your short range car before heading home. On the down side a short range car is unlikely to do more than 50kW. 

Edited by Briz Vegas

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