3 Way Eliptrac Horn Klipsch La Scalas

[Atlas Gouverneur]

What an interesting build! Thanks for sharing.

[Full Range]

I found a photo during the build that @@sootshe supplied

This one is of the bass horn cabinet back panel area prior to the back being installed

Notice the slit from where the sound waves are forced out towards two horn exits on the left & right

You will also see the triangle diverters and side bracing

Edited April 17, 2014 by Full Range

[henry218]

Hi Paul,

 

Interesting project, I'm wondering what's the goal for having front mouth and reflex loaded? is it for extra sensitivity for the midrange? since its very small box comparing the size of the woofer and using 2 big ports means tuned quite high, whats the expected LF for this?

 

sorry for a lot of questions as I'm not familiar with La Scalas (or any other Klipsch )

 

EDIT: i just realised that the whole upper section before the horn is actually the enclosure. cool

 

cheers

Henry

Edited April 17, 2014 by henry218

[Guest atilsley]

Hi Paul,

 

Interesting project, I'm wondering what's the goal for having front mouth and reflex loaded? is it for extra sensitivity for the midrange? since its very small box comparing the size of the woofer and using 2 big ports means tuned quite high, whats the expected LF for this?

 

sorry for a lot of questions as I'm not familiar with La Scalas (or any other Klipsch )

 

EDIT: i just realised that the whole upper section before the horn is actually the enclosure. cool

 

cheers

Henry

Henry

 

I'd say it's purely to extend the bass response from around 50Hz to 35Hz.

[henry218]

looking at the volume, it could be around 80L, looks like tuning around 45hz

[Full Range]

The height of the bass cabinet is 260 mm internal height & the ports are 100 mm diameter & 180mm long.

And it would be 612 mm square internal measurements

Not sure of the Dog box volume - but I can source it and get back to you

Edited April 17, 2014 by Full Range

[henry218]

i estimated about 100L, so the Fb prob 42hz

[henry218]

with these parameters

FS is 26.3, Re is 3.36, VAS is 506.3 Liters, BL is 12.49, QM is 9.93, QE is 0.27, QT is 0.26. Sensitivity is 97 db. Coil is 1 mH

 

the ideal box should be around 165-195L with fb from 35hz to 30hz.

 

it looks like a great bass driver

 

 

Edited April 17, 2014 by henry218

[Telecine]

A very impressive set of speakers Paul, great work.

[Milos]

Hi Paul,

great to see what you've been up to!!

A few more photos of Earles Amps would be great!

Miles

[Full Range]

On 27/04/2014 at 7:10 PM, Milos said:

Hi Paul,

great to see what you've been up to!!

A few more photos of Earles Amps would be great!

Miles

Here are some more photos Miles

Both built by Earle Weston

This is the main amp

 

And this is the preamp with inbuilt DAC + Headphone amp

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by Full Range

[Milos]

Here are some more photos Miles

Both built by Earle Weston

This is the main amp

image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpg

And this is the preamp with inbuilt DAC

image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpg

Thanks Heaps Paul!!

[Full Range]

For my next tweak I need to enlist help from a local Brisbane SNAer that has electronics experience to be paid in superb award winning coffee and conversation

Help is required to rebuild the the ALK design universal crossovers to ALK AP12-500 & AP12-6000 configurations

I have all the parts and schematics - all the parts from capacitors to hand wound coils are of superior quality and will finish off the speakers to the highest standard

PM me if you are up to the challenge

I have had an offer from a fellow SNAer - thanks @green-wagon to build the crossovers for me for a small cost and the promise of getting that " weak in the knees feeling when he has a listen on the system when it's all connected up

The Crossover design is based on the ALK gentle slope type AP12-500 & AP12-6000 configurations

However ALK has made these crossovers as a two piece system as that fits the Klipsch Heritage range

Green Wagon and I have come to an agreement & based on Troels Gravasens observations and the available space

We have designed this build as a single board - all coil distances are to Troels recommendations

Green wagon has simplified the connectivity of all three driver sections on the crossover and has drawn up a new schematic

(I won't post the schematic as ALK the designer has removed them from the web site due to plagiarism)

First we did a basic layout of the components on the floor with the view to tweak as needed for best performance and fit

.

A close up of the tweeter attenuator - This component will allow me to tweak db volume to suit speaker placement and room sise

We chose a good speaker colour match plywood board - and started the component fit

You will see a set of wire cutters and the tape measure @ 500mm to judge scale

Edited May 8, 2014 by Full Range

[Malcolm]

Very nice FR :-)

[Full Range]

Very nice FR :-)

Thanks @@Malcolm

Wait for more posts as the crossovers progress into the build and then the testing phase

While that is happening I will choose the finish of the surround area - I currently have approx 6 different styles to choose from

Anyone care to help with side finish ideas

Keep in mind the crossovers will be approx + 3 kg each and will need some sort of incorporated handles or grab points for easy lifting

Min clearance height required is 30 mm

[Malcolm]

What about using finishes that are present in your components ?

 

Cheers

[Full Range]

What about using finishes that are present in your components ?

 

Cheers

Yes I will be using Tasmanian oak for framing timber - that is the same as the veneer used on the speakers

All will blend in seamlessly - The crossover components will be on show and exposed as a piece of art and will have a nice clear lid made for them ( similar to a TT lid ) to highlight them and keep dust out

[Green Wagon]

Just had a thought.

Why not mount them into 'picture frames' and hang each one on the wall behind each speaker.

 

Living art I think they call it.........................

[Full Range]

Another build progress update

The crossovers are finished - @@Green Wagon has done a fantastic job and has emailed me a couple of photos to share

For all soldered connections Mundorf Silver/Gold solder was used

In these photos you will see the top and underside view

All neat and tidy

[henry218]

the carbon resistor was chosen for its sonic signatures?

[Full Range]

the carbon resistor was chosen for its sonic signatures?

I was contemplating using either the Path Audio - http://www.hificollective.co.uk/components/pathaudio_resistors.html or the

Duelund resistor - http://www.hificollective.co.uk/components/duelund_cast_resistors.html

The Duelund won for its sonic signature

All that's left to do on the crossovers now is to apply the labels and source some Klipsch badges and the frame

But none of that will stop me from using and testing them when I collect them

Edited May 11, 2014 by Full Range

[henry218]

i was hoping you got some measurements gear, so you can objectively tune the speakers before tuning it to your liking

[Green Wagon]

Hello everyone 

 

Few quick notes from me..

 

These have taken a fair bit of time as the original ALK design is for two separate units.

A bass/mid unit, then a mid/tweeter unit for the models that have a tweeter.

That means disconnecting part of the original bass/mid unit, then patching in the new mid/tweeter unit.

 

The issue that presents is they were never meant to reside on one board as these do.

There was a 'normal' schematic for the bass/mid, but only a component overlay for the mid/tweeter unit.

Thus I had to draw out a schematic for the mid/tweet, then another schematic to blend the two together.

 

Then came playing with the layout to maximise neatness and avoid component interaction.

Don't forget, the attenuators being transformers also need to be treated as inductors for spacing issues.

 

All wiring is silver plated stranded copper with teflon coating (from Speakerbug milton).

As FR has said, all soldering was done with Mundorf silver/gold solder.

Terminals are fully insulated (again form speaker bug).

And since that last photo was taken, the flux residue has been cleaned up.

 

The other time consumer was because these came together and grew as an organic procedure, the odd midnight brain wave also made a few changes at the last minute.

FR didn't know about two of the major changes until he came over and actually saw them.

Always a big risk, but I'm glad he seems happy with the result.

 

Henry218 - FR has a second set of crossovers hes currently using, so a direct swap out comparison shouldn't be to hard.

And I suspect his ears are probably pretty well calibrated 

The new layout also allows for reasonable changes to components if they become required.

..................

[Full Range]

i was hoping you got some measurements gear, so you can objectively tune the speakers before tuning it to your liking

I don't have any measurements / testing equipment Henry

Thanks for your interest but I can't help out in your request

Unless an SNAer is willing to come over & do some credible tests to publish, then I will do as I always do - tune them to how the sound pleases me

[Green Wagon]

Today I delivered the (almost) finished crossovers to FR.

He's going to do the rest of the woodwork for their enclosure.

 

As I got to his place I was greeted by my all time favorite dog. An Irish terrier.

He is soooo lucky I didn't smuggle him out when I left.

Sorry, I ramble on. Child hood memories of a better time and all that..

 

He was using a spare pair of crossovers while I worked on these.

They both share the same slope and topology.

The only real difference being old 600 / 6k vs new 500 / 6k and some different brand of components.

 

First we had a quick listen to the speakers with his 'back up' crossovers.

Very nice, but very quickly I knew the bass point had to come down lower. So FR's original request for a lower (500) point is very well founded.

The treble and mid sounded a touch grainy to me. This I thought could be part of the 'signature' of the drivers he's using or the music we were listening to.

Very similar to my dad's pro JBL's in overall character so I didn't give it much thought.

 

He then swapped in the new crossovers, set the mid and tweeter attenuators to the exact same settings as the outgoing units and we double checked all connections etc.

 

Wow. I'm still in awe of the difference they made.

The lower 500 point suits much better, and an unexpected but very welcome effect is the new ones are just sooooooo much smoother in the mid and treble.

I noticed it immediately but kept my mouth shut so I didn't influence FR in his opinions.

After the first song he made the same observation and commented on it before I said a word.

The graininess I first heard has completely gone. Not reduced, gone.

The bass gained a little more definition and impact, and everything was better integrated.

 

I then suggested we try dropping the mid and tweeter output down a smidgen.

While I was there, with the music we tried, it seemed a better blend to me.

Bringing in just a small amount more bass to the overall picture.

 

We then took a break where he made me what I can only describe as the most awesome cup of coffee I have ever tasted in my life.

Forget the 72 virgins, I have tasted heaven and crashed back to earth.

 

Then back to sample a little more magic, I mean music.

For the brief hours I was there, it was superb music.

 

But I have no doubt he will tweak it a touch more over the coming months till it is within a millimeter of aural nirvana.

That is after I've fixed his cd player anyway

 

I promise FR, I will get it done and back to you asap. I cannot leave you stranded without your favorite source..

 

Final thoughts.

If I could take over anyones identity. It would have to be his.

Great wife, superb house, brilliant dog, audio to kill for..