Duntech PCL-15_Question re different versions of same model.

[Chris_H]

I have had a black pair of PCL-15's for a few years now and thought they where accurate but lacking in bass. However I recently purchased another pair of PCL-15's, a light timber vaneered model and the main driver is mounted on a square aluminium plate where as the black pair has the driver mounted on the speaker box timber.. Other than this, they look identical,however the sound of my newer pair is a great improvement in the overall sound especially the bass. I use them for mixing my recordings and the black pair to me seemed like rather like the Yamaha NS10M, hard to achieve a pleasing mix but once you where there it translated well to other speakers and systems. So I thought it was their design of being very revealing and accurate but not pleasing. The new pair i have seem much more musical but still accurate. This has me thinking there is a posibility there is something wrond with the old pair. Has any one else experienced this variation in within the Duntech PLC_15 model?
All pics on the net of the black pair seem to have the aluminium plate as well? I am hoping some one can shen some light on this for me.

here is a pic of the new ones:

Edited June 11, 2013 by Chris_H

[josh0571]

You could try getting in touch with the owner of Duntech, Kiat. He is a SNA member too though I haven't seen him post for a while.

[Sub Sonic]

Out of curiosity, have you had a look at the model numbers of the woofers? Dynaudio made several versions that look the same, maybe they changed to a similar but different one at some stage? There are higher Q and lower Q versions of the same woofer. They should be something like a 17W75 or a 17W75XL.

Regards,

SS

[henry218]

is that dyn? several brand of drivers using similar design as dyn. dynavox, hivi and even morel.

[Sub Sonic]

I'm pretty certain the bass driver is Dynaudio, I used to pester them quite a lot for ex R&D drivers back when they were in Adelaide :-)

Regards,

SS

[Chris_H]

I have always assumed they where dynaudio. Re the different models, I will check this out but I would be very suprised for this to be the reason as it would cast into doubt their claim of accuracy given the large difference between the different pairs. Since finding this out I have looked more carefully at the pics of duntech PCL-15's on the net and all have the speaker mounted on the metal plate so. I have even begun to entertain the possibility, although slim, that my original pair may be a forgery or copy claiming to be an original duntech as the back sticker with model number etc is different as well.

[Sub Sonic]

A look inside should be able to tell you a bit. Most Duntech models had the internal space pretty much completely filled with an open cell yellowish soft foam (Dunlop Hypersoft HS1730 :-)). The crossovers normally used air cored inductors, first order crossovers and Solen or Bennic polypropylene capacitors. The crossovers should be mounted on a piece of MDF, with connections made via plated pins approx. 5mm diameter, mounted into the MDF. All crossover cabling should be very neatly formed, not haphazardly wired. All the crossover components should be mounted with heat glue to the MDF. Van Den Hul internal cabling was often used.

Hope this helps!

SS

Edited June 12, 2013 by Sub Sonic

[Sub Sonic]

Here's a pic of the working parts of my PCL 10s, shows the style of build you should find inside yours.

 

 

Cheers!

[Chris_H]

Thanks for the info. I'm off to the studio now, screwdriver in hand. Will let you know what i find.

[Chris_H]

The driver is a Dynaudio 17W75EXT and the xover is mounted directly onto the back of the speaker box. It all looks legit. Re the metal plate, in my pair without the plate, the speaker box front where the HF driver is mounted is recessed for time alignment. On my newer pair, the metal plate brings the mid/bass driver forward for time alignment.
Here is a pic of the xover:
 

 

Edited June 13, 2013 by Chris_H

[Sub Sonic]

That's definitely a Duntech build, Solen caps and all.

 

Do both pairs look like this inside! (if you can be bothered opening up the other pair!!). Maybe there was a crossover change, necessitating a different physical time alignment distance?

 

Cheers!

 

SS

[Chris_H]

I'm thinking the time alignment is the same, just a different method of achieving it. It would be more work to recess the tweeters by machining the box, than bringing forward the same distance, the woofer by use of the mounting plate. Now about getting around to opening up the 2nd pair..........i have lost my "round toit"!!  

Very busy day today with two shows to bump in, one with a live recording I'm doing tonight so it will have to wait till the week end, but obviously it's the next thing to do on my quest for an answer.

Thanks for all the replies, it's a definite help being able to have access to others experience with the Duntech's.

I'm one of those recording engineers often referred to here in not so favorable terms but I try not to destroy the original performance with my recording techniques, mixing and mastering etc.

I have a preference for recording music that is live or performed live in the studio and have done a lot of research and sought out mentors who have been on the journey since the days of mono, who have witnessed the transitions in recording technology and methodology. They have given me some fascinating insights that i would like to share in other threads.

I have recently set up a live recording room in a local music venue on the Mornington Peninsula and also have a great purpose built studio designed by Graham Thirkle to work out of for studio based projects and mastering. Most of my recording equipment was built in Australia in the late 60's and the 70's by Graham Thirkle and my recording desk was built by a colleague of Graham's, Alan Jenkins, using Thirkle pre amp cards with Thirkle hand wound transformers. I will upload a pic of the desk as my avatar.

   I have been on a bit of a Duntech splurge hence the quest to find the reason for the difference between my  pairs of PCL-15's. I have 3 pairs of the PCL-15. I just bought 2 pair at auction which sound the same and my former pair that sound different. I got them so i can mix in different locations with some consistency apart from the obvious differences in room acoustics, hence my surprise at the difference between my newly acquired pairs and the former. I also have one pair of Duntech Marquise, and a recently acquired pair of Duntech Thor IB-20 subs with the ASC IB-20 cross over. I am yet to try the subs with the Marquise. Up until now I have mastered using Tannoy Monitor Gold 15 dual concentric. The Tannoy's took a fair bit of getting used to.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Chris_H

[davewantsmoore]

I'm one of those recording engineers often referred to here in not so favorable terms but I try not to destroy the original performance with my recording techniques, mixing and mastering etc.

I have a preference for recording music that is live or performed live in the studio and have done a lot of research and sought out mentors who have been on the journey since the days of mono, who have witnessed the transitions in recording technology and methodology. They have given me some fascinating insights that i would like to share in other threads

 

Please do!!!     I think insight into the goals and compromises faced would be extremely educational    

 

I have been involved with building / fixing a couple of studios, but they were for TV/radio broadcast, rather than live/music recording.

Edited June 14, 2013 by davewantsmoore

[VanArn]

Graham Thirkell,that brings back memories of Optronics and the professional audio equipment built by them,right here in Melbourne.World class gear; now for the photos of what you have in your Mornington venue.

[Chris_H]

Graham Thirkell,that brings back memories of Optronics and the professional audio equipment built by them,right here in Melbourne.World class gear; now for the photos of what you have in your Mornington venue.

Here are some Optro modules from a recording console built for Bill Armstrong. They are very good sounding units of a very similar topology to my Audek console. One of the pointers given to me by those who know so much more than I do is that it is an advantage to record multi tracks using the same type of preamp for all or most the tracks. This recent trend of of using a different preamp design for each different instrument has its drawbacks. So I now have 18 channels of the Optro type in this pic.