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Synchro-Mesh


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Hi JD, re the NAD M51 USB/Lion issue, I don't know if the latest M51 firmware update (from 1.37 to 1.39) fixes it. NAD (Pam Anderson) tells me the update fixes 'some OS X USB issues'. I haven't updated yet as it probably involves about 3 hrs roundtrip drive to nearest dealer ... unless I can persuade Todd Norberry at Audio Products to trust me, send the update, so I can do it myself!

VERY happy with sound of system now, using USB from MM to AP2 (plugged directly into M51 coax). Now using battery USB to AP2.

Hope I haven't misunderstood your comment above?!

Unless they guarrantee 100% fixed and provide some technical info to back that claim, dont bother! Firmware upgrades that require an authorised tech to perform is a real disaster PR for NAD especially for a consumer audio product!

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Sorry to go OT above. What I meant to add is I'm very impressed with Steve at Empire Audio's expertise based on the feedback on here and Computeraudiophile.

I'm still toying with idea of getting one of his OR5's, despite Bhobba's buying group idea biting the dust (at least for now!). I'm curious to hear what AES/XLR input to M51 would sound like in my system.

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Unless they guarrantee 100% fixed and provide some technical info to back that claim, dont bother! Firmware upgrades that require an authorised tech to perform is a real disaster PR for NAD especially for a consumer audio product!

Yes, it's no longer an urgent issue for me for reasons stated above, and LC's comments that my present connection set-up to M51 is better than straight USB.

Actually, I'm grateful there WAS (is?) a USB issue, as I might never have arrived at the decision to buy the Audiophilleo2.

Or...being tempted to buy an Off-Ramp. You've got a lot to answer for Bill Hobba!!!!

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I wonder wether the synchromesh can work its magic with top quality cd transport. So far, haven't seen anybody tested it. Will monitor the progress of this thread.

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I wonder wether the synchromesh can work its magic with top quality cd transport. So far, haven't seen anybody tested it. Will monitor the progress of this thread.

I would imagine (and I could be wrong) that it will be a diminishing return. If you are starting with a very well engineered and clean signal to start with, such as that you would expect from a top end CD player, then I don't imagine the Synchro will really add much if any value. The benefit of the SM is that it reclocks a data feed and presents a clean de-jittered signal, if you have that already - there is no point.

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Yes, it's no longer an urgent issue for me for reasons stated above, and LC's comments that my present connection set-up to M51 is better than straight USB.

Actually, I'm grateful there WAS (is?) a USB issue, as I might never have arrived at the decision to buy the Audiophilleo2.

Or...being tempted to buy an Off-Ramp. You've got a lot to answer for Bill Hobba!!!!

A right trouble maker is that Bill!
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I would imagine (and I could be wrong) that it will be a diminishing return. If you are starting with a very well engineered and clean signal to start with, such as that you would expect from a top end CD player, then I don't imagine the Synchro will really add much if any value. The benefit of the SM is that it reclocks a data feed and presents a clean de-jittered signal, if you have that already - there is no point.

Yeah! Top end cd transport should have a very well engineered digital output, but I would like to be wrong in this case where or I hope so that the syncromesh can improve it further. Quite a few of a good transport i've seen doesn't include a digital spdif reclocking. That what makes me interested with this product. I just hope that any kind souls over here can give a feedback in the future wether it is good or not with a good cd transport.

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Well I don't think a signal needs to be reclocked if is is fine in the first place - I guess that was my point. I would expect a top end player to provide a quality SPDIF signal, at least the couple that I've been lucky enough to try have.

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Well I don't think a signal needs to be reclocked if is is fine in the first place - I guess that was my point. I would expect a top end player to provide a quality SPDIF signal, at least the couple that I've been lucky enough to try have.

I can remember only a few years ago when I thought bits were bits. But I let my ears be the judge and I couldn't figure out why these damned CD transports sounded better than, say, my AirPort Express. Mike Lenehan's tricked-out Marantz I2S transport made my best computer gear sound like total rubbish. :confused:

But then came the Audiophilleo, and even handicapped by SPDIF it outshone the Marantz. Then Mike and Clay put a HiFace inside the DAC with a direct tap from its I2S feed and it takes a step up again. And still later the OffRamp 4 turns up courtesy of Bill bringing performance at least as good as the PDX's internal HiFace to anything it touches.

Bottom line: the advances driven by computer-based audio playback - advances the Synchro-Mesh takes advantage of - have pushed this class of devices into territory that very few traditional CD transports could even approach. I would expect the SM to bring an improvement to just about any disc spinner.

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Bottom line: the advances driven by computer-based audio playback - advances the Synchro-Mesh takes advantage of - have pushed this class of devices into territory that very few traditional CD transports could even approach. I would expect the SM to bring an improvement to just about any disc spinner.

Take a cheap DVD player with the Syncromesh and compare it to a top of the line transport like a Wadia or Esoteric - now that would be interesting.

Thanks

Bill

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You've got a lot to answer for Bill Hobba!!!!
A right trouble maker is that Bill!

Yea that Bill Hobba has more money than sense. Come to think of it with the way he has been spending his dosh he may not have that much money for long. :nana :nana :nana :nana :nana

Thanks

Bill

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Hi Rob

PM sent to firm up when you can come on over. We will soon have you up to speed on exactly what this stuff does not just on the WFS but on other stuff such as the Playback Designs and NAD.

Thanks

Bill

Thanks Bill..very much appreciated...I am at a friends house at the moment, will be back home tomorrow and will sort out the details with you then by PM...really looking forward to this...Rob

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Yea that Bill Hobba has more money than sense. Come to think of it with the way he has been spending his dosh he may not have that much money for long. :nana :nana :nana :nana :nana

Thanks

Bill

LoL

More like ...if we keep listening to you, WE are gonna go broke!

Now you got me on the OR track.

LoL

;)

BTW, the CORRECT expression is more Dollars that sense. Chuckle...

Edited by wis97non
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Right wis97non!!

I think Bill's part of a fiendish plot to send us all broke. Damn him for planting seeds of OR5 in my mind. Once it's planted it's a bit like telling someone, "Don't think of fluorescent koalas"!

D'ya reckon Bill's the sidekick of the evil genius Steve Nugent?

(that was a lame attempt to keep even mildly on-topic) %o}

Edited by GraemeB
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  • 1 month later...

Ooooh baby... a package was waiting for me when I returned home this afternoon! Nicely packaged too.

smesh1.jpg

smesh2.jpg

smesh3.jpg

Please excuse the audiophile-grade, jitter-reducing dust in this horrible photo:

smesh4.jpg

How duzzit sound? I wish I had kept my audio-gd DI for a direct comparison, but my (poor) audio memory tells me that the SM generally does what the DI did in my system, but with an extra level of refinement and control. Insert audio cliches here - better flow, improved liquidity, more analogue-sounding etc. Cliches or not, the SM delivers! The bass is noticeably tighter too.

To be honest I've been a little disappointed with my system since I sold the DI... there was clearly something missing. Everything sounded a bit 'flat' and uninvolving. I had changed from Lenehan ML1s to modded ProAc 1S clones only days after I sold the DI, so this lead me to start wondering whether the speakers were part of the problem.

Adding the SM has confirmed that the speakers are in no way responsible. To my ears, the improvement to the SB Touch with a quality jitter-reducing device like the Audio-gd DI with upgraded clocks (around $300ish) or the Synchro Mesh ($600) is not subtle. I also think the Synchro Mesh is finally letting me hear how good the Audio-gd Reference 5 DAC really is.

I think Senor Darko described the Synchro Mesh as presenting the music as a crisp, sharp image, whereas removing the Synchro Mesh was like an image with the lens nudged slightly out of focus and lacking clarity. I reckon that's spot-on - it certainly correlates with my couple of hours of listening this afternoon. No need for blind testing here IMHO - the difference is easy to hear.

Colour me impressed! :)

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Can anyone tell me how the Synchromesh/Touch combo compares to a Mac/USB-Coax converter combo? I'm currently toiling with this conundrum.

Well for one thing most of the USB converters will support a bunch of different sample rates. Mine does 44.1/88.2/176.4 and 48/96/192. Synchromesh is a fixed rate device.

Empirical's electronics are first-rate: excellent clocks and power stability etc. That counts a great deal in the audible end. USB devices can suffer from instabilities in the power environment of the computer which a SM doesn't have to contend with.

It can be a tough call to make.

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Well for one thing most of the USB converters will support a bunch of different sample rates. Mine does 44.1/88.2/176.4 and 48/96/192. Synchromesh is a fixed rate device.

Very true... the SMesh is available with 44.1khz output or 96khz output only, with the device upsampling, resampling or downsampling depending upon what you feed it.

Mine is a 16/24bit, 96khz model.

Edited by pete_mac
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Very true... the SMesh is available with 44.1khz output or 96khz output only, with the device upsampling, resampling or downsampling depending upon what you feed it.

Mine is a 16/24bit, 96khz model.

My Audio-GD REF5.2 arrived, so it will be good to have a crack with the Sychro/Ref5.2 to see what the cat brings in, against the TeddyDac (with which the SM made a sizeable difference). I just have to get back on the interneck to order a BNC/BNC cable now.

AJ

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My Audio-GD REF5.2 arrived, so it will be good to have a crack with the Sychro/Ref5.2 to see what the cat brings in, against the TeddyDac (with which the SM made a sizeable difference). I just have to get back on the interneck to order a BNC/BNC cable now.

AJ

Ah, nice buy! Looking forward to your thoughts. Is your DAC one of the ones that has already been burned-in for 300+ hours prior to shipment?

I've got one of the audio-gd Canare BNC to BNC cables here which I might try between the SMesh and DAC in the near future. Not sure how good the performance of this cable is, but there's only one way to find out I guess!

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