Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) Thought it was about time I created a thread that captured abit of history on my system, and the changes that I make as they occur. I've been into Hifi for around 20 years, but things got pretty serious about 5'ish years ago. Prior to that, like alot of people, I got right into surround sound audio in the late nineties, mainly home theatre. In the early 2000's I ran a Vaf DCX/DC7/DC6 5.1 speaker system, powered by Rotel power amps. For movies this system gave me alot of joy. I was also into crt projector systems. Here is a pic the projection system I ran, in a former home.... That's me standing in the image. I'm about 6ft tall(180cm). To this day, I regret selling that home. That home cinema system gave me endless hours of pleasure. But I did sell for various reasons, and in my next home my focus started to divert away from home cinema, back towards music. For 2ch duties, the DCX's were ok, but I yearned for more. I started doing alot of reading about other speaker systems, and I became very interested in active speakers. I read up alot of information about the pros/cons of the active approach, and I was keen to hear some systems. Nearly 4 years ago I was referred to SGR (Stuart), who was developing his active electronics, and building various speaker variations. After many exchanges of email, and a few phone calls, I decided to take the plunge on some early proto-types. A company called TAG had built a bunch of 3 way speakers using ribbon drivers and seas excel bass drivers. They had some surplus stock, which Stuart converted to active with his electronics (mighty mouse plate amps with builtin active crossovers). Although I was starting to take 2ch music more seriously, I still ran a home theatre system. And Stuart built me a centre speaker with matching ribbon drivers, to go with the mains. It was very difficult to match the Beechwood finish on the mains, nothing would be an ideal match. So I decided to go for black on the centre. I refer to the 3 speakers as "Bob and the Beechies" (bob being short for "black on black"), here's a pic; I've been enamored with these active ribbons since I bought them. They have a clean presentation, with a sense of air, great imaging, and sound very natural through the mids and highs. What they lacked was some real bottom end weight. So, I added some subs into the equation. Enter the X-men. The X-men are sealed subs made from marine ply, they have 15" Tempest-X drivers, and are fitted with SGR plateamps. The plateamps have variable active crossovers, with high pass outputs. So I run my unbalanced cables into the X-men first, and then connect the Beechies in behind them. The main channels effectively becoming a 4way active speaker system, with the crossover point between mains/subs set at 80hz. Here's another shot with them in-situ, shortly after receiving them; It took some time and experimentation to dial in these subs. With this experimentation, I even had them incorrectly setup for a period, with the phase switch on the wrong setting. [doh] But with some guidance from Stuart and some measurements, I eventually got them integrated quite well. Once dialled in correctly, the X-men took the performance of the system to another level. I obtained the bottom end weight I was looking for, and the mid-bass delivered by the mains seemed to benefit aswell. At this point I was still exploring front end options. The system really came together and began to sing, when I introduced the Killerdac. This dac was an immediate improvement over anything I had previously had on the system. It delivered an uncanny analog like presentation, and added some real body to the music. I also experimented with changes to the speaker placement, and found that positioning the subs behind the mains gave me better results. Pic; The big black amp looking box in the middle of this pic, is my (oz)Killerdac. *I ordered this case myself, and had Stevenvalve build the dac with it. I wanted something a little different (in appearance). I ran the system this way for awhile. Before moving my centre speaker back in, and the front end gear to the rear of the room with the rest of the equipment. The final touches on the system was changing the buffer over from a MFtube buffer to a Burson. This change gave a little more transparency. I also added a modified CD94 transport, running I2S into the Killerdac. With all these changes, I had reached what I felt was at the time, nirvana. It was time to invite around some SNA'rs, and get some feedback. So I held a GTG, thread can be read here: Click With the system singing just the way I liked, what does 1 do? Make a big change, and bugger everything up! The room above was in a centrally located open plan living area, and the sound travelled everywhere in the house. Not ideal, when you have a young family. Anything at moderate levels would disturb everyone in the house. My listening sessions were few and far between. So we've sold that house, and have moved into a rental, while we pursue building our dream home. This project is still in the planning, but it will have a dedicated audio/ht room that is isolated from other living areas. Where I'll be able to retreat and crank the system, without worrying about waking our young kids. In the mean time, the rental place has a smaller room that I am using as a music room. This room has totally changed the presentation of the system. The X-men take some reigning in, and bass heavy tracks can really boom at times. I've dialled them in as best I can, but in this room they are almost uncontrollable. The Beechies are also a tad brighter, in this smaller room. This isnt helped by the listening position being very close to the rear wall. So, unfortunately, the system has lost some magic it had in the last place. I cant easily treat the room the way I'd like, given I am renting. But I am experimenting with system changes while I am here. My plan for the next place we build (with dedicated room), was to add another 2 x active speakers for rears - so I would have 5 channels of active speakers running. An opportunity came up recently, and I treated myself to a christmas present. Here is a pic of the current room in our rental home, with a significant change to the system..... More on this change shortly...... Edited December 30, 2011 by ozmillsy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozcal Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Congrats on the new speakers Andrew. I have just skimmed through your journey but will re read properly tonight when I have more time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drizt Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Thanks for the write up mate. I look forward to reading your thoughts on the CX3B's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffK Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Yes i haven't read it thoroughly yet but thanks for posting. It's good to hear of other people's audio/video journeys. Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigears Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I digging this thread A. Some great shots there mate Great to see your good old SGR Beechies agian. Congrats on your new Christmas Present mate, stunning speakers. I will follow your dedicated room project as it unfolds with great anticipation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JohnA Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Thanks for posting Oz looks very nice mate, and congrats on the xmas pressie thos subs do work great in that position. I found them to work best there in my room also, plus they look best there also...so double bonus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proac Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 :partyYippee - I get to hear the 3's & KD this arvo..yippee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Thanks guys, I'll do a good write up of the CX3B's another day soon. But I do like them. Stuarts done a remarkable job with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 I will follow your dedicated room project as it unfolds with great anticipation. Cheers mate, I'll definetly share floor plans and progress shots as things unfold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffK Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Thanks guys, I'll do a good write up of the CX3B's another day soon. But I do like them. Stuarts done a remarkable job with them. Lookin' forward to it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 thos subs do work great in that position. I found them to work best there in my room also, plus they look best there also...so double bonus I should have listened to Harry when I picked them up. He gave me that positioning advise, but I didnt go that way for awhile. I had this silly idea that a "wall" of drivers was kinda cool. But they definetly work better behind the mains, once the phase is tweaked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr X Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Nice looking setup. Is this a 4 way system or do the subs overlap? What crossover frequency on the subs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Nice looking setup.Is this a 4 way system or do the subs overlap? What crossover frequency on the subs? 4-way. I'm currently using the sub output option on the 3b's, which is pre-set to 80hz. It's a really nice feature, placing the speakers ahead of the subs in the chain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drizt Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 4-way. I'm currently using the sub output option on the 3b's, which is pre-set to 80hz. It's a really nice feature, placing the speakers ahead of the subs in the chain. I guess you can't time align the subs with the mains but how have you played with the phase? Is there phase control on the sub plate amps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tax Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Congrats Millsy! New speakers look great. Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Muon Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 The new speakers look very nice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Spencer Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 The question I have to ask is "what about Bob?!" Is he out of the picture now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patjoy Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Congratulations ozmillsy. Thanks for sharing. Looks great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 I guess you can't time align the subs with the mains but how have you played with the phase? Is there phase control on the sub plate amps? Yep........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 The question I have to ask is "what about Bob?!" Is he out of the picture now? Bob is waiting for his new home(theatre) to be built. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proac Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Well I got to have a listen today - wow. Really nice. Very sweet speaker. Work better in OM's temporary room cf with the Beechies: which I really like as well. CF to the 4's..different animal - the 3's by themselves don't have the bass of the 4's (I'm guessing...didn't hear them runnng "full range - but how can they?) and the bass on the 4's is well sorted: indeed a highlight for me. The X man struggle in a small room but add the bass you need beautifully. They need some space!! We had some fun times playing with the Mytek. There was bugger all difference between DSD and Red Book PCM for the same track we tested (converted via Saracon) - I reckon I could hear it reliably but that may have been me wanting to. OM was more circumspect. I reckon I can hear it at my place more easily. Either way no clear answer but it wasn't "OMG that's night and day" at OM's for sure. Thanks for a fun arvo mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Congrats Millsy! Thanks tax, hope to have you up some time to have a listen. They present differently to the ribbons. I havent decided if I prefer the new over the old yet, they have different qualities. There's something special about the ribbons. Either way, I have the choice over what will be used for rears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentient Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Thanks for a fun arvo mate. I really liked the Mytek running direct to SGR's via balanced cables. It had a completely unveiled aspect to it, that I appreciated. It's a great dac. Thanks for bringing it over, much appreciated. I think we should have a blind testing GTG, to see if you and Ben can pick the DSD tracks as easily blinded as you can sighted. I'm not a huge believer in BT'ing, but it can be fun. I need more time with more material that I am familiar with, to spot the difference. It wasnt immediately obvious to me. Oh, and we got async USB working on the Mytek, which is good. But not without a quirk on the display? Are you providing feedback to Mytek on these USB challenges? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drizt Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Good to hear you had a great time guys. Sounds like you need to add some EQ to tame the subs oz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metal beat Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Great system Millsy Very smart when running giant subs like that to use a monitor so not to waste the bass on the speakers. No wonder you miss your Monster ht screen, it looked out of this world. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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