emesbee Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 (edited) I just came across this video and found it quite interesting and entertaining (not sure if anyone has already posted this). Looks like there are quite a few edit points, judging by the video jumps, but it flows together quite well. Check out where he demonstrates AutoTune with his own voice around the 10:20 mark. The over-use of auto-tune would have to be up there along with excessive use of dynamic range compression as the two major sins in so many modern recordings. Combine the two and you are a step closer to total homogenisation of 'popular' music. After just posting this, I realised it might be more appropriate for it to be under The Great Audio Debate. Will be happy for the moderators to move it they think so. Edited June 21, 2021 by emesbee 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eggmeister Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 Rick Beato has some great videos on "what makes this song great" 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deepthought Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 This is a great song that uses too much autotune Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emesbee Posted June 21, 2021 Author Share Posted June 21, 2021 In that example it sounds more like they are using it as a special effect. The trouble is that you seem to hear the same effect in so many songs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deepthought Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 (edited) 34 minutes ago, emesbee said: In that example it sounds more like they are using it as a special effect. The trouble is that you seem to hear the same effect in so many songs. Twere but a joke. I have watched a lot of Rick's videos. Always good value Edited June 21, 2021 by deepthought 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martykt Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 6 hours ago, emesbee said: The over-use of auto-tune would have to be up there along with excessive use of dynamic range compression as the two major sins in so many modern recordings. I couldn't agree more. Auto-tune (along with compression) is the scourge of the music industry and sadly not just the realm of manufactured top 40 junk and is also used strongly in alternative music as well. In my opinion the music industry needs to get back artists who are actually capable of singing and are true musicians. As mentioned earlier the one example which I do agree with is Daft Punk who as a duo are supposed to be robots so their voices are supposed to sound computerised. Most other uses that I've heard either simply can't sing or are just following a fad/sound which is not that good a sound anyway. BAN AUTO-TUNE !!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LHC Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 Great video, just watched it now. To force this to the Great Audio Debate - make the analogy with the usual audiophile debates: why audiophiles like certain distortions and gears that don't measure perfectly why analog hi-fi sounds more real than digital including digital signal processing why measurement is not the best way to tell if something sounds good (now ducking for cover . ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest thethrowback Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 (edited) As an old fart I don't listen to a lot of popular music, however today I was driving in an area with limited radio reception and the only station I could get played top 40 type music. Just about every song was recorded with auto-tune and it is an effect that has annoyed me ever since Cher wavered "Believe". My immediate impression when I hear someone sing using auto-tune is that they are a no talent bum. Edited June 21, 2021 by thethrowback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martykt Posted June 21, 2021 Share Posted June 21, 2021 1 hour ago, LHC said: why measurement is not the best way to tell if something sounds good You can measure that Cher song all you like, it still won't sound even remotely good !!! I suppose theoretically you could use this arguments against objectivists who want everything to measure perfectly flat.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian McP Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 23 hours ago, deepthought said: This is a great song that uses too much autotune Here's a version without autotune! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deepthought Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 Here's one with MORE Autotune: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator62 Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Autotune is a tool - used in studios obviously but also live. I remember sitting behind the control desk at a particular concert and watching the screen as auto tune grabbed the female artists voice and pushed it into the right note. Plenty of compression too. When I think of how the arena venues in Melbourne ( Rod Laver etc) are so not configured for acoustics at all , and the very very expensive concert tickets, its all in aid of trying to find some level of audio that is digestible - the 'spectacle' of these gigs is always the main draw, not the sound. In recording, auto tune is a symptom of a deeper infection than just a lack of talent - or rather its just one symptom of how the 'artist' in popular music has been inexorably disempowered as a musical entity. It reminds all of us that the record companies (which isnt really the right term anymore) dont need musical talent to sell a product - they just need a face... which is really just the old cliche of the primacy of image over sound. While many of us were introduced to music via a genre contemporary of our own times , whether its blues, jazz, prog rock, soul etc, that it was all to a more or lesser extent, subject to the tireless forces of mass marketing and formulaic design over time. Artists who have chosen to break away from the wheel join a growing body of musicians that have to take control of their own careers without the media muscle of large companies - and many do this with varying degrees of success. This isnt purely a current phenomenon. Diana Ross, Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye , The Jacksons et al were the faces of Motown records 40 -50 years ago. For many of us our perceptions of these artists represent much more diversity than that of the present day face of a Sony, Warner or Universal etc...but for the kids, their perceptions have been shaped by the music of their time - much of which has become sonically amorphous to someone of my advancing years. Its an oft repeated corporate narrative. In the end though its money, The recording business has exploited artists since the first grooves in the wax - and the past successes of some musicians has taught the industry that in order to get the lions share - the artist has to be dispensable...but the dream needs to seem real... Fortunately there are still plenty of great artists making unique and interesting music - they just do it in the struggling sub tier of very tight budgets and the public domain. Nice to have another rant on Stereonet again! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deepthought Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Glad to hear I'm not the only one who goes to concerts and thinks the sound of most venues is generally sh*t. And don't get me started on the acoustics in a lot of Cinemas! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andythiing Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Netflix this is pop series has a great episode on the use of auto tune https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.hitc.com/en-gb/2021/06/22/t-pain-and-usher-autotune-drama-explained-when-is-netflixs-this-is-pop-out/%3famp 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaynin Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) Yes, it’s all about selling a look to a certain demographic, and that demographic doesn’t analyse what’s being served up. When the look is no longer fashionable, the artist disappears. Quality music will always remain, and sound great no matter which decade it’s being listened to. It would be nice to live in a world without auto-tune though… Edited July 4, 2021 by Kaynin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator62 Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 32 minutes ago, andythiing said: Netflix this is pop series has a great episode on the use of auto tune https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.hitc.com/en-gb/2021/06/22/t-pain-and-usher-autotune-drama-explained-when-is-netflixs-this-is-pop-out/%3famp Yep I love the paraphrased quote from the producer " My job is so much easier - dont need to find good vocalists- just good looking people" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deepthought Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Not all autotune is bad. if it didn't exist then we wouldn't have this gem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugPowderDust Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 (edited) On 05/07/2021 at 9:00 AM, andythiing said: Netflix this is pop series has a great episode on the use of auto tune https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.hitc.com/en-gb/2021/06/22/t-pain-and-usher-autotune-drama-explained-when-is-netflixs-this-is-pop-out/%3famp Great show Edited July 5, 2021 by BugPowderDust 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator62 Posted July 6, 2021 Share Posted July 6, 2021 (edited) Apart from the numerous and tiresome cutbacks to T-Pain ,the " misunderstood genius" there were some fascinating insights from a select few people including Suzanne Ciani and Jace Clayton. Ciani talks about the effect as a crutch or tonic for something lacking in the artists ability. T-Pain didnt ruin music but he seems to be under the impression that theres something stunningly innovative about using an effect - which is simply delusional. What both Clayton and Ciani point out is that if the effect spurs you to DO something different then its a good thing but unfortunately for T-Pain although it turns out he's not a bad singer -he's just another average singer/rapper of which there are 00's of 000's. I guess the thing that bemuses me is that human voices are all different from one another - and here is an industry befuddled with its formulas for making all of them sound the same... On another tangent - how about guitarists? Its harder than one might imagine to get a guitar sound that differentiates you from another guitarist. I remember loving the Voice box sound on Frampton comes alive (when I was 14) and it reminded me of guitarists whose tone is very dependent on effect for their thing including Santana, Andy Summers, The Edge , and a heap of others. Those effects DO become crutches for some but also signatures - and each of those players found a way to play that differentiated them from each other and everyone else - and with all 3 the sound of their bands too. And how about Wah wah Watson! - I mean there;s no pretense of whats going on there. Not to mention Hendrix, Bill Frisell....the list goes on. Edited July 6, 2021 by gator62 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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