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What is the order of importance of things which can get in the way of your listening enjoyment?


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10 hours ago, Ittaku said:

... a live acoustic performance of something to see your enjoyment of that has also diminished and that it sounded better...

 

These days if going to a live classical music concert in a concert hall, with no artificial sound reinforcement, I make sure to get seats not too far back. That way not only is the sound pressure level generally higher but the additional attenuation of higher frequencies (dependent on humidity) that is unavoidable as sound waves pass through air, is less than it would be for seats further back.

 

This seating strategy reduces in part the impact on my listening experience of age-related reduction in general sensitivity in my hearing, and the greater reduction in acuity for higher frequencies.  However sitting closer cannot fully compensate. I can no longer hear above 15kHz, even at very high sound pressure levels.

 

Such reductions in hearing acuity begin quite early in adult life. I commented on this recently in another thread, as  reproduced in part below. I note that the graphs don't show the tapering off for frequencies above 6kHz, which would even more pronounced than the tapering off at 6kHz!

 

Here is an example of a  graph for hearing threshold change with age (taken from https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/age-shift-in-threshold-d_1474.html):-

 

Men - age and shift in hearing threshold 

 

I'm not sure what studies were used for compiling the above graphs or how accurate they might be,  but it is certainly well known that hearing acuity decreases with age, with the upper frequencies being affected quite noticeably. 

Edited by MLXXX
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5 hours ago, MLXXX said:

 

These days if going to a live classical music concert in a concert hall, with no artificial sound reinforcement, I make sure to get seats not too far back. That way not only is the sound pressure level generally higher but the additional attenuation of higher frequencies (dependent on humidity) that is unavoidable as sound waves pass through air, is less than it would be for seats further back.

 

This seating strategy reduces in part the impact on my listening experience of age-related reduction in general sensitivity in my hearing, and the greater reduction in acuity for higher frequencies.  However sitting closer cannot fully compensate. I can no longer hear above 15kHz, even at very high sound pressure levels.

 

Such reductions in hearing acuity begin quite early in adult life. I commented on this recently in another thread, as  reproduced in part below. I note that the graphs don't show the tapering off for frequencies above 6kHz, which would even more pronounced than the tapering off at 6kHz!

Well, you're talking to a doctor with hearing loss, so let's just say I'm aware of this, and I regularly go to live concerts and always chose the seats closer because I preferred the sound there even when I was 20. But that doesn't answer the actual question I asked - we all know our hearing is affected over time, but does a live acoustic performance sound subjectively worse now?

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On 18/06/2021 at 6:32 AM, Ittaku said:

I regularly go to live concerts and always chose the seats closer because I preferred the sound there even when I was 20.

I have always preferred seats close up, particularly for listening to the soloist.

 

On 18/06/2021 at 6:32 AM, Ittaku said:

but does a live acoustic performance sound subjectively worse now?

As is the case for most people, I can remember sound in extreme detail for only about 3 seconds!  However the level of emotional excitement, and the general impression,  can be remembered for decades; well at least to an approximation!

 

Let me express it this way. If I am seated well to the back of the auditorium, these days the sound seems horribly lacking in treble and generally faint.  I can say fairly confidently that from that seating position the live experience is so diminished that it is not a patch on what it was when I was in my 20s. (I'm now in my 60s.)  But at a closer seating position I find the live experience still very worthwhile indeed, and exciting.

 

People who accompany me can vary in their hearing, and many have more impaired hearing than I have.   If I say things like the following to a person in their 50s, or older:

  • "the air-conditioning noise was a bit intrusive, don't you think?"
  • "I wish the first violinist wouldn't sniff quite so loudly" [a technique to enable the other players in a small ensemble to come in at the same time]

there's a good chance I'll draw a blank. What was annoying to me, was not even noticeable for them!  Despite that, they keep attending live concerts, and say they enjoy them.

Edited by MLXXX
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  • 10 months later...
On 19/03/2021 at 4:18 PM, andyr said:

I thought "The Great Audio Debate" section was the most appropriate place for my question - given I expect it will get radically different responses.  :)

 

I was prompted to post because I've:

  • listened to quite a few people's systems in the last 6 months or so, and
  • recently made a significant amp change in my own (active) system.

 

It seems to me that everyone probably has different issues that spoil their listening.  For me, I would say - in order of most annoying first:

  1. 'listener fatigue' - by which I mean there's a hard edge to the music coming from the speakers which means, after a short while ... you simply don't want to keep listening.  :(  The cause is varied - it could be a metal tweeter ... it could be an amp which emphasises odd-order harmonics ... as well as other things.
  2. hum from the speakers.  Due to, essentially, earthing problems in the system as a whole.
  3. noise from components - such as fan noise or transformer hum.
  4. a high noise floor - typically due to a crap power supply ... or insufficent shielding.
  5. sibilance - aah, but is this in the recording ... or is your system creating/emphasising it?  xD
  6. lack of soundstage depth (soundstage width is easy!).
  7. congestion - ie. a lack of clarity in the musical lines going on.

 

So ... what are others' issues.  "Tone" might be one, for instance, that is super-important to some people?

 

Andy

 


Honestly none of these, not even anything I can think of in relation to my system. I struggle to think of a single area my system is deficient…. I guess I miss seeing the glow of tubes while I listen though sonically nothing.

 

Doesn’t mean I don’t have changes on the way….. Namely a Soundaware D300REF streamer and Absolute Audio Labs SIT-A15 with a whole range of upgrades. Though really any sane person would have stopped already. I’m actually thinking of boxing up my second system. It can in no way compete with my main and I’ve no intention of spending the money to get it closer either….
 

Though I guess the main thing…. My own mood. I also find I enjoy music more if I haven’t listened during the day l though that can also be e true if exposed to a noisy environment during the day. Then I just want quiet.

Edited by MattyW
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11 hours ago, MattyW said:

 My own mood. I also find I enjoy music more if I haven’t listened during the day l though that can also be e true if exposed to a body environment during the day. Then I just want quiet.

So true. These days being time poor like many, i time-box myself to 3 evenings (1-2hr sessions) to enjoy my setup and music.  Friday evenings after the kids goto sleep is my time to catch up on episodes of tv series that i'm following and most Sat evenings are kept as the weekly movie night with the fam.  That way i know i can get both the 2 channel and HT system used.

 

But to emphasise back to Andyr's point - point 5 in recordings (esp older closed mic'ed recordings) and 7 where some recordings are just average..

Edited by MrBurns84
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On 18/06/2021 at 1:17 AM, MLXXX said:

I'm not sure what studies were used for compiling the above graphs or how accurate they might be,  but it is certainly well known that hearing acuity decreases with age, with the upper frequencies being affected quite noticeably. 

The sad reality of this will eventually hit all of us, some earlier and some later.  If and when this time comes, its when i will pass the system on to kids to appreciate (hopefully)!

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1 hour ago, MrBurns84 said:

The sad reality of this will eventually hit all of us, some earlier and some later.  If and when this time comes, its when i will pass the system on to kids to appreciate (hopefully)!

 

If we only have a single great sounding system, and it's simple to operate I figure there's a greater chance of that happening  ;)

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