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HiFi reviews in general, and 6moons in particular


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Does anyone trust reviews from 6moons?

 

Their terrible website design and sometime impenetrable wording aside, they seem to operate entirely from ad revenue from the very same audio companies they review products from. I realise this is probably how a lot of the hifi industry press works, but it seems more blatant here. And importantly, their reviews seem to embody the problematic aspects of this economic model: in a random sampling of 10 or so recent reviews, I saw that all ended positive, mostly flattering, and often explaining away potential issues and reading more like a sales pitch.

 

I also realise the vast issues with reviewing HiFi gear in general (effects of room, other equipment, subjective experiences etc. etc.), and maybe this is as good as it gets? I do in some ways prefer raw measures of performance, like on Audio Science Review, mixed with random user reports though...that seems a better way to get at the 'truth'.

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Someone recently posted here after buying an amp based on the excellent ASR reviews it received.

 

Did not end well.

 

Edit: last time I looked at the thread he was now looking for an amp that will sound good in his system.

Edited by muon*
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3 hours ago, marlott said:

they seem to operate entirely from ad revenue from the very same audio companies they review products from.

There’s no “seem” about it. They are quite open about the fact that they are paid (via ad revenue) for reviews 

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All reviews serve a purpose... some more value than others.

 

ASR are technical to measurements... value ? yes ? though not be all and end all...especially if measuring the wrong thing :D I recall one example very recently where maker got in touch and told them they were doing it wrong... not even measuring the right output that most would use for device... turns out amir at ASR corrected the review (to his credit) and declared the item "recommended" after previously consigning it to oblivion.... I would couple ASR reviews if looking at them...with ones that also listen to item... and check out with  a combination of gear... also reviews I see of value are comparative reviews... you dont often see those... because one is going to come off 2nd best ? no one wants their product to come off 2nd best ... non commercial reviews (ie with no commercial links at all) from end users can be help to add some balance in these cases.

 

One person's opinion is always welcome.... as is someone/anyone elses... but most important is your very own opinion  :D

 

To certain amount doesnt even matter if an item was rubbish in a reviewers system... they are entitled to their view and based on their context(music taste, room, system etc)... but if is fantastic to you in your context all that matters :) 

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@marlott,

 

I have read far more condemnation of  the supposed validity of the findings of ASR than I have ever seen said of 6moons.  I find 6moons useful to assist me with forming a position on something.  It is not the absolute go to though.  I could never say that of ASR.

John

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I have bought a single piece of equipment wholly due to the review it received in Six Moons that completely altered my mindset in regards to Hi-Fi in every aspect.

 

Not just in the art of sound reproduction but as a commercial enterprise in all aspects from technology, innovation and  marketing and a kind of weird subversive undermining of its own clientele and spoken in whispers reverence of audiophilia.

 

I came across the review entirely by accident. 

 

It was for the original Sonic Impact T-Amp amplifier. 

 

Blew my mind.

 

 

 

 

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All ad-revenue website reviews are worthless if you read the conclusions as they always say the same things. You could rip out a conclusion of a $1000 pair of speakers and apply it to a $10,000 pair and not tell them apart.

 

However, they're not completely useless. You have to learn how to read them by looking for the hints.

 

"Not the final word in bass" - means pissweak bass

"Tight punchy bass that compensates for lack of lower extension - means no lower extension

"Soft non-fatiguing midrange" - means lacking any midrange detail

"Razor sharp imaging"- means fatiguing midrange or top end

"Dark tonal balance" - means too much bass/not enough treble

"Light tonal balance" - too much treble

and so on.

 

Don't even bother reading the superlatives, they're the superfluous part of the review.

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14 hours ago, sir sanders zingmore said:

There’s no “seem” about it. They are quite open about the fact that they are paid (via ad revenue) for reviews 

here it is

https://6moons.com/audioreviews2/why/why.html

 

So here's the upshot. From mid July 2014 on, our review policy changed from what it was until then. From that point forward manufacturers who want a review from us commit upfront to at least a small one-month toekn ad. Here we're not talking about a full-page print ad for a costly one-time insertion rate. We're talking about a commitment 1/10th of that. Less than monthly health insurance. It's a very small fee. It is a demonstration of professional respect and courtesy for the time we spend to properly listen to gear, then write and publish a review on it. It makes it very easy even for brand-new manufacturers to participate in the process without having any large resources. And, it puts an end to the imbalance that the few carry the many. Put plain, it eliminates the freeloaders.

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1 hour ago, sir sanders zingmore said:

So here's the upshot. From mid July 2014 on, our review policy changed from what it was until then. From that point forward manufacturers who want a review from us commit upfront to at least a small one-month toekn ad. Here we're not talking about a full-page print ad for a costly one-time insertion rate. We're talking about a commitment 1/10th of that. Less than monthly health insurance. It's a very small fee. It is a demonstration of professional respect and courtesy for the time we spend to properly listen to gear, then write and publish a review on it. It makes it very easy even for brand-new manufacturers to participate in the process without having any large resources. And, it puts an end to the imbalance that the few carry the many. Put plain, it eliminates the freeloaders.

"Leave a brown paper bag full of unmarked bill's on the bus seat outside the 6 Moons bar and grill, a friend of ours will be there, don't be late.  Think of it as a down payment or health insurance.  We'll arrange things real nice. Don't disappoint us, put plain, we eliminate freeloaders.:

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1 hour ago, allthumbs said:

"Leave a brown paper bag full of unmarked bill's on the bus seat outside the 6 Moons bar and grill, a friend of ours will be there, don't be late.  Think of it as a down payment or health insurance.  We'll arrange things real nice. Don't disappoint us, put plain, we eliminate freeloaders.:

at least they are upfront about it ..

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I now only use the reviews from HiFi News and Record Review as a 'reliable' opinion on a component, and have done since the mid 80's

Their technical testing of components is probably second to none, and a lesson in consistency , and has always been used side by side with the subjective element of a review.

 

They also tend to tell it as they find it, with some very high priced components getting a less than stella reviews

 

I must admit though a lot of the components they tend to review would be found in most peoples 'Fantasy List' IE: way out of most peoples price range, but a bit of escapism isn't all bad.

 

I have noticed over the last 8 to 10 years that the overall stance of the magazine doesn't favor one type of sound as being ''Çorrect'', where prior to that, a review of say a pair of Kilpsch La Scala horn loaded speakers would have gotten a more tongue in cheek, almost goading type of review, today it gets a a more positive review on the understanding that they wouldn't be the speakers for most people.

 

The reviewers all have their own style and preferences, which you get to learn what they are over continued reading, and quite a bit of their review equipment tends to be hired, or on long term loan, so the thought of a 'Payola' type situation isn't going to happen.

 

I also like the fact they don't tend to review items that some would say fall into the Snakeoil category, like ridiculously priced power cables and equipment stands [Unlike HiFi+ which seem to have a different one every issue, and surprise surprise you can usually win one of those reviewed highly overpriced power cables if you take out a subscription...no thanks!]

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56 minutes ago, Tweaky said:

I also like the fact they don't tend to review items that some would say fall into the Snakeoil category, like ridiculously priced power cables and equipment stands

/me dutifully subscribes...

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I gave up trusting magazine reviews during the heyday of the Linn/Naim hegemony. It was amazing how many good products were sacrificed on the elusive altar of PRaT. There must have been plenty of companies producing good kit that went broke because of a bad review during these times.

One of my fond memories of this time was going down to Salisbury for a Naim open day at the factory. Before the tour we taken into the demo room to hear the legendary (at least according to the mags) Linn/Naim 6 pack system - I was shocked at how bad it sounded!

Nowadays I very rarely buy hifi mags as I find them full of equipment that I have not got a hope in hell of owning unless I win the lottery.

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2 hours ago, rabidlistener said:

I gave up trusting magazine reviews during the heyday of the Linn/Naim hegemony. It was amazing how many good products were sacrificed on the elusive altar of PRaT. There must have been plenty of companies producing good kit that went broke because of a bad review during these times.

One of my fond memories of this time was going down to Salisbury for a Naim open day at the factory. Before the tour we taken into the demo room to hear the legendary (at least according to the mags) Linn/Naim 6 pack system - I was shocked at how bad it sounded!

Nowadays I very rarely buy hifi mags as I find them full of equipment that I have not got a hope in hell of owning unless I win the lottery.

That was essentially to shore up their defences against the super decks from far east......the fight against yellow peril still continuous....in politics as well as hifi....:)

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I like the 6 moons reviews, some of them are hard to read but I think they are fairly honest. The main reviewer acknowledges audiophiles have very different opinions of what sounds good and also different tastes in music.

 

In his review he will often try to describe the sound character of the equipment under review and what audiophile preference it is suited. Once you understand his writing style it is usually fairly clear where the product lies in terms of your own preference.

 

6 moons also reviews equipment from any continent which is great for us audiophiles as there are some sonic bargains particularly from China, such as Denafrips which are very reasonably priced.

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8 hours ago, rabidlistener said:

the heyday of the Linn/Naim hegemony

Makes it sound like a couple of nation states that conspired to rule the ancient world.....................Hang on!!......................that's what it was! Twas only after the two co-emperors fell out and began making competing products (with each other) that the Resistance was able to get a workable foothold. To this day there are probably people who have an opinion on SMPS' that were forged in the crucible of that conflict.

 

Do we all remember how snooty the sales staff were in those days?

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Goodaye all

 

You take any review with a pinch of salt, use it as a guide in your purchase.

 

Check out other reviews and sources.

Find out if there is any issues with that model or earlier models.

Find out about there customer support.

 

Lastly, listen, inspect and sniff it.

(yes l did say sniff it)

 

regards Bruce

 

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Very long time since i read any review, except out of curiosity in regards to the reviewer.

 

Although I do find Stereophile helpful sometimes when looking for speaker impedance charts.

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11 minutes ago, Ittaku said:

This right here is the most useful part of stereophile by far.

Agreed.

 

And every review is subjective in describing sound, but it can help but lots of caveats need to be observed and considered. Going just on measurements alone is not enough, as we often see with ASR.

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On 10/08/2020 at 5:39 PM, muon* said:

Someone recently posted here after buying an amp based on the excellent ASR reviews it received.

 

Did not end well.

 

Edit: last time I looked at the thread he was now looking for an amp that will sound good in his system.

Link?

 

Poor amps, they usually get blamed for unlikeable sound. :no:

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IMO unless you're taking the gear home, you're always buying blind.
Demo'ing in person doesn't really tell you much about how something will sound in your system (unless they have similar electronics/speakers in-store), let alone reading what some guy thinks about it.

Reviews should be viewed as a form of entertainment. It's quite hard to ever come across a bad review in this hobby, which really says something.

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