chewstation Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) Hi all, I am very new to audio! Seeking advice for my PC desktop setup, primary uses are going to be for movies, games and wanting a high clarity/detailed music listening experience. Requirements: - I've previously used studio monitors and they produce an ear piercing constant screech that I couldn't deal with anymore. Aiming to minimise that to an almost unaudible hum from 1ft away would be ideal. - Must be compatible with a sub i have lying around (Klipsch SW-350) (pic below) Speakers of interest: - Klipsch R41/51M - Klipsch R-41/51PM - triangle br02 - kef x300a - wharfedale diamond 9.1 I'm not sure if the above statement regarding hissing will exclude the active bookshelves? But the ones I previously had were 8" so... However, I believe if i go the passive route (cheaper speakers as well) I'd have to look for an amplifier - what suggestions do you guys have? And what would connectivity look like between the PC > Bookshelves > Sub? The powered model configuration looks very simple - however i'll mention again, skeptical of hiss. Cheers! Edited January 18, 2021 by chewstation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Go listen to some. Unplug the source and listen for hiss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewstation Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share Posted January 17, 2021 2 hours ago, Bengineer said: Go listen to some. Unplug the source and listen for hiss. I wonder if the environment will have an impact on what I hear. For example an audio store showroom versus my home with PC/Graphics card whining away next to it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Yeah it does. But there is a lot to consider. First and foremost, active speakers with their built in Amps can have a hiss that you can't get rid of. So if you can at least hear them with no source connected, you can get an idea. Good clean power into the speaker can help, but won't eliminate that hiss. Everything else is controllable. Hiss from dirty USB power from your PC is mangeable and you can eliminate it. Hiss from the inherant design of the speaker you can't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewstation Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share Posted January 17, 2021 Ah gotcha. The last pair of monitors I had only had a faint hum and very minor hiss with no audio source when setup away from my PC. when I brought it upstairs and setup on my desk the noise was too much. And that’s still no audio signal. If I had known it would scale that bad I wouldn’t have bought it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussievintage Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 This thread is surprising to me. I did not realise that powered monitors suffer from problems with noise so much. Is it perhaps a lack of shielding? Good "computer" speakers with in-built amplifiers and sub-woofers that I have used did not have noise problems. I think it will help to distinguish between hiss, and computer noise pickup, and hum pickup, i.e. what is the type of noise, as that will help find and eliminate the cause. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 If it changed from one powerpoint to the other than it is susceptible to the power it recieves. That is mangeable, power conditioners / better powerboards etc can help there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 minute ago, aussievintage said: This thread is surprising to me. I did not realise that powered monitors suffer from problems with noise so much. Is it perhaps a lack of shielding? Good "computer" speakers with in-built amplifiers and sub-woofers that I have used did not have noise problems. I think it will help to distinguish between hiss, and computer noise pickup, and hum pickup, i.e. what is the type of noise, as that will help find and eliminate the cause. Good computer speakers definately do too. It's purely to the way they implement the amp and shield it. Most suffer from it to some degree. Some you can hear from 1m away, some need to be 30cm away. Then on top of that if you don't feed them a clean signal, it shows. My USB input from the PC was very noisy on some amps. Changing to the front USB port helped (runs on a different power rail), adding in a iFi iDefender did the job, broke the power rail on the USB to the DAC. I then fed the DAC a separate power input. Interestingly, same PC, no conditioners. USB straight into the Questyle CMA Twelve. Dead silent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewstation Posted January 18, 2021 Author Share Posted January 18, 2021 So is an external amp eg topping pa3 going to be less susceptible to noise compared to an active monitor? I had a pair of edifier 1855db that were dead silent. So I was surprised the presonus E8s were so troublesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Generally yeah. As the amplifier isn't inside the cabinet. I have a pair of Edifiers about 15 years ago, horrible hiss. Returned them for the Harmon Kardon soundsticks, which you could only hear the hiss with your ear to it. My KEF LS50W II you can only hear the hiss with your ear against the driver. From 80cm away, nothing. All comes down to quality of the speaker design, how clean the power in, the DAC signal and a pinch of luck. They *all* hiss, it's just at what distance do you hear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussievintage Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 It still sounds to me as though your "hiss" is my "noise". Hiss is wide bandwidth white(ish) noise. Buzzes and high frequency stuff coming from being too near a computer, is noise. I mean, yes they all make "noise" it is just useful to make the distinction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussievintage Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 8 minutes ago, Bengineer said: As the amplifier isn't inside the cabinet. An amp inside a speaker cabinet can still be built with a metal enclosure for shielding. Typical plastic or wood speaker cabinets won't make much difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussievintage Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 32 minutes ago, Bengineer said: Then on top of that if you don't feed them a clean signal, it shows. My USB input from the PC was very noisy on some amps. Changing to the front USB port helped (runs on a different power rail), adding in a iFi iDefender did the job, broke the power rail on the USB to the DAC. I then fed the DAC a separate power input. Ground loops when using PCs and laptops with externally powered devices can be troublesome and allow the noise to be much worse as you describe. All depends on which devices are grounded, or double insulated and ungrounded, and how you combine them. Same problems happen when using a PC to record music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruc3 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 I recently just got a pair of Adam A5X and they are active. There is some hiss, but if I keep the volume controls on the monitors to moderate db I cant hear the hiss from my seated position about 1 metre away. In day to day use, the hiss basically is non-existent. As far as I know, all active monitors at least have some hiss. Maybe you should consider "passive" speakers if you don't want hiss. I am pretty sure the Kef LS50 passive version was silent when I had them paired with a Peachtree Nova, but I sold them off as I didn't want to do the whole integrated amp thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewstation Posted January 18, 2021 Author Share Posted January 18, 2021 Any opinions on the speakers I have listed? Looking to get something this week topping pa3 on the way at the moment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussievintage Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 4 hours ago, bruc3 said: As far as I know, all active monitors at least have some hiss. Why? Most are just class D amplifiers in a speaker box. Should be silent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruc3 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 15 minutes ago, aussievintage said: Why? Most are just class D amplifiers in a speaker box. Should be silent. Ok, I am probably wrong then, I was basically just parroting what I have been reading on line, and also every active monitor I was considering earlier seemed to have someone reporting hissing so assumed it was just the nature of active monitors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_B Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 I had a very annoying background hiss when I had a pair of Fostex active speakers plugged in to a decent PC soundcard (3.5mm on the card to RCA on the speakers). Added a DAC that runs from the PC USB to the DAC and RCA's from DAC to speakers and ALL FIXED! So it can depend I think.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 30 minutes ago, aussievintage said: Why? Most are just class D amplifiers in a speaker box. Should be silent. Find me an active speaker that doesn't. I have $4000+ KEF sitting here and its audible at like 15cm, maybe 30cm in a quiet room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruc3 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 8 minutes ago, Mr_B said: ALL FIXED! So it can depend I think.... Silent even with your ear held up against the speaker? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Yeah, source related hiss/static is separate issue. That would present itself on any revealing or sensitive gear. Nothing plugged in buy the power hiss, thats the killer 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussievintage Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Mr_B said: I had a very annoying background hiss when I had a pair of Fostex active speakers plugged in to a decent PC soundcard (3.5mm on the card to RCA on the speakers). Added a DAC that runs from the PC USB to the DAC and RCA's from DAC to speakers and ALL FIXED! So it can depend I think.... Yes, so it NOT the active monitors that are hissing. It is noise being introduced from the noisy soundcard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicprObe Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 2 hours ago, Bengineer said: Find me an active speaker that doesn't. I have $4000+ KEF sitting here and its audible at like 15cm, maybe 30cm in a quiet room. Behringer MS20 If the analog input hisses, use the optical link and onboard DAC. 30 minutes ago, aussievintage said: Yes, so it NOT the active monitors that are hissing. It is noise being introduced from the noisy soundcard. Remember the olden daze when we had CRT monitors!? THEN you'd really get some weird stuff going on..............in both direction! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rand129678 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 7 hours ago, Bengineer said: My KEF LS50W II you can only hear the hiss with your ear against the driver. From 80cm away, nothing. Super impressive that. And confusing why some of the biggest pro audio studio monitor makers still haven't solved this. JBL, KRK, Neumann, Dynaudio, Adam Audio all had audible hiss from 1m away - the models I demo'ed anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengineer Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 I know right. What's more impressive is they aren't for nearfield. So the need to ensure low hiss wasn't there! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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