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I recently purchases 2 Atacama Steel stands for my KEF LS50's. 
I want to fill the stands with something to make them inert. 
I have seen that lots of people use sand, but it has to be kiln dried sand or silica sand. 
I live in Cairns. I've checked my local Bunnings, gravel and stone supply yards and several pool supply shops. They have neither.  

Bunnings has a paving sand which is supposed to be dry by reviews say it is wet. 

I understand that kiln dried sand is used with artificial turf, but again I am striking out with a supplier.

If I can't get kiln dried sand what other inexpensive material could I use to fill my speaker stands to render them inert? Could I use fabric? It seems like it should be an easy problem to solve but thus far it is proving not to be. 

 

ps. I will not use kitty litter. 


Best, 
Dameon
 

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The humphead parrotfish can produce 90 kg (200 lb) of sand each year. So the most ecologically friendly option would be to buy one and feed it some coral.

I didn't say that lead was safe, dj.  I said that, because it has no dust, it is possible to handle it in a way that does not affect your health.     Then why not simply dry what you

Yes, that would be the empty bucket version.

If you have light stands (made from Al), @dameonjamie, you should fill the tubes with a light material - such as kitty litter.

 

Steel stands need to be filled with a heavy material.  I personally use lead shot (bought from gun suppliers) - but you can also use:

  • dry sand
  • garnet
  • steel shot
  • steel grit.

Andy

 

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42 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:

I recently purchases 2 Atacama Steel stands for my KEF LS50's. 
I want to fill the stands with something to make them inert. 
I have seen that lots of people use sand, but it has to be kiln dried sand or silica sand. 
I live in Cairns. I've checked my local Bunnings, gravel and stone supply yards and several pool supply shops. They have neither.  

Bunnings has a paving sand which is supposed to be dry by reviews say it is wet. 

I understand that kiln dried sand is used with artificial turf, but again I am striking out with a supplier.

If I can't get kiln dried sand what other inexpensive material could I use to fill my speaker stands to render them inert? Could I use fabric? It seems like it should be an easy problem to solve but thus far it is proving not to be. 

 

ps. I will not use kitty litter. 


Best, 
Dameon
 

 

Not sure if you can access the internals or want this on the outside, but should provide a reasonable amount of damping which is half of what lead shot or sand does.

 

https://www.justritestore.com.au/home/noise-control-products/vibration-damping-and-isolation/pyroteknc-decidamp-cld-1-3mx1m/ro/NSW?gclid=CjwKCAiAuoqABhAsEiwAdSkVVOmSHYJogO3K9YosBJim2aqT3mKWpAi-rr930ok3aWDrPI4zDs9QQhoCoqkQAvD_BwE

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42 minutes ago, buddyev said:

Bunnings sell tubs of garnet used for sandblasting 

https://www.bunnings.com.au/flexovit-10kg-garnet-sandblasting-grit_p6330485


I have heard that you can use this. I have no experience with it so was not certain. Also, do you need to worry about inhaling dust when pouring?

Is this the same? It's a fair bit cheaper. 

Blackridge Sand Blasting Grit Garnet 10kg
https://www.supercheapauto.com.au/p/blackridge-blackridge-sand-blasting-grit-garnet-10kg/385734.html

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55 minutes ago, andyr said:

Steel stands need to be filled with a heavy material.  I personally use lead shot (bought from gun suppliers) - but you can also use:

  • dry sand
  • garnet
  • steel shot
  • steel grit.


Thanks for this. I have seen many references to lead shot. I think my wife would crack me one if she heard me say I wanted to bring lead into her house. 

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14 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:


I have heard that you can use this. I have no experience with it so was not certain. Also, do you need to worry about inhaling dust when pouring?

Is this the same? It's a fair bit cheaper. 

Blackridge Sand Blasting Grit Garnet 10kg
https://www.supercheapauto.com.au/p/blackridge-blackridge-sand-blasting-grit-garnet-10kg/385734.html

I used the Bunnings garnet but this one looks the same.  I two third filled my b&w stands and it made a significant difference. 
as for inhaling the dust, it is quite fine but do it very gradually outside and you could always wear a mask.

 

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27 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:


Thanks for this. I have seen many references to lead shot. I think my wife would crack me one if she heard me say I wanted to bring lead into her house. 

 

 

Aah but lead shot has no dust - so it's impossible to inhale anything toxic!  :)  (Unlike, say, when you fill your car with petrol.)

 

As to handling it:

  • wear washing-up gloves - or latex food-handling gloves ... and discard them after
  • buy a small funnel to use for pouring the shot into the stands - and discard it when the task is complete.

 

Andy

 

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I use crushed garnet frequently and have never noticed any dust when pouring. A plastic kitchen funnel and clean dry tomato tin are your friends!

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Goodaye

 

Kiln dried sand is dry,  only moisture it would get is if it wasnt stored properly.

If you were in Melbourne l could supply some.

 

l filled my satnds with concrete, very happy.

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21 hours ago, dameonjamie said:

I recently purchases 2 Atacama Steel stands for my KEF LS50's. 
I want to fill the stands with something to make them inert. 
I have seen that lots of people use sand, but it has to be kiln dried sand or silica sand. 
I live in Cairns. I've checked my local Bunnings, gravel and stone supply yards and several pool supply shops. They have neither.  
 

 

 

Personally, I think you can get away with a grade of sand such as 'play sand' which is available from most hardware mobs including Bunnings. It is washed and sufficiently clean for the kiddies to play in,  and provided that you dry it for a day or so in the hot sun (i.e. pour some out of the bag and onto a concrete surface or the like) it will be sufficiently free of moisture. 

 

I've had this inside my stands for many years will no ill effects and no nasties growing within.  

 

https://www.bunnings.com.au/richgro-20kg-play-sand_p3022506

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2 hours ago, pete_mac said:

Personally, I think you can get away with a grade of sand such as 'play sand' which is available from most hardware mobs including Bunnings. It is washed and sufficiently clean for the kiddies to play in,  and provided that you dry it for a day or so in the hot sun (i.e. pour some out of the bag and onto a concrete surface or the like) it will be sufficiently free of moisture. 

Thanks. It's wet season in Cairns atm. I see zero possibility of a few days of drying in the sun. That's one thing that is making this difficult. 

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3 hours ago, sloper said:

Kiln dried sand is dry,  only moisture it would get is if it wasnt stored properly.

Thanks. I'm in Cairns. Nobody seems to have kiln dried sand. 

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22 hours ago, andyr said:

Aah but lead shot has no dust - so it's impossible to inhale anything toxic!  :)  (Unlike, say, when you fill your car with petrol.)


I don't have faith that lead is safe. I can't find dry sand. I think sand will leak out bit by bit or become moist. I don't want to inhale garnet, ever.

I think I am going to have to break down and buy 2x 7.5kg tubs of Atacama Atabites Inert Speaker Stand Filler. AudioJunction will send me 2x tubs for $218 incl shipping. I have read that speakers sound best with the Atabites in the stands anyway. 

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29 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:


I don't have faith that lead is safe.

 

 

I didn't say that lead was safe, dj.  I said that, because it has no dust, it is possible to handle it in a way that does not affect your health.

 

29 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:

 

I can't find dry sand.

 

 

Then why not simply dry what you can find, yourself (in the oven).

 

29 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:

 

I think sand will leak out bit by bit or become moist.

 

 

How will sand leak out - yet the "zinc coated micro-discs" which make up the Atabite SMD-Z 7HD inert filler, won't?  And it seems to me that the only way dry sand can become moist ... is if you employ an evaporative cooling system in your house.

 

29 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:


I think I am going to have to break down and buy 2x 7.5kg tubs of Atacama Atabites Inert Speaker Stand Filler. AudioJunction will send me 2x tubs for $218 incl shipping. 

 

 

Given this filler weighs 2403 KG/m sq. compared to dry sand which has a typical rating of just 1442 KG/m sq ... what do you think is under the zinc coating, to make it almost twice as heavy as sand?  (Depleted uranium, maybe?  :lol: )

 

btw, given the product blurb talks about weighing " 'X' KG/m sq " ... I can't take anything they claim, seriously.  (Density is normally expressed " KG/cubic m " ... as I'm sure you can understand, a box 1m square will weigh more if filled to a depth of 1m with sand - than with a layer of Atabites Stand Filler only 5mm deep!)

 

Andy

 

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33 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:


I don't have faith that lead is safe. I can't find dry sand. I think sand will leak out bit by bit or become moist. I don't want to inhale garnet, ever.

I think I am going to have to break down and buy 2x 7.5kg tubs of Atacama Atabites Inert Speaker Stand Filler. AudioJunction will send me 2x tubs for $218 incl shipping. I have read that speakers sound best with the Atabites in the stands anyway. 

 

You can also dry it in the oven - buy a sacrificial tray from your local supermarket, crank up that oven, and away you go! 

 

Once dried, sand won't absorb moisture from the air - it needs water to be poured in it to become wet. In such a situation, you'd be more worried about your electronics getting wet than the sand!

 

Re: the potential for sand leaking out, you can avoid this by putting the sand inside small plastic freezer-style bags. You fill the bags loosely, tie them off, and then slide them down inside the posts of the stand. Because you have filled them loosely, they are able to conform perfectly to the inside of the posts, leaving no air gaps. Best of all, there's no chance of sand leakage! It worked a treat for my heavy four-post stands. 

 

I'd take any claims of Atabites being superior with a grain of salt - things have a funny way of sounding better when they cost more ;) Sand/garnet or the like is more than adequate IMHO.

 

A bag of play sand, a sacrificial tray, and a few hours of time will leave $200 in your pocket.

 

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16 minutes ago, andyr said:

 

btw, given the product blurb talks about weighing " 'X' KG/m sq " ... I can't take anything they claim, seriously. 

 

 

The claims of "uniform size to give consistent sonic performance" are also interesting... I'd suggest that these are a convenient use for the by-product of some kind of industrial/manufacturing process (where dirty great machines are punching holes through metal) rather than being deliberately sourced and sized for sonic performance. Maybe I'm just a cynical bugger! ;) 

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15 minutes ago, pete_mac said:

 

Maybe I'm just a cynical bugger! ;) 

 

 

You are, Pete (as am I)!  :lol:

 

Andy

 

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I had a feeling that mentioning Atacama Atabites would spice up this thread. Thanks for your help everyone. 

Edited by dameonjamie
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The recommendation I heard, and used, was swimming pool filter sand. I came in a bag and was dry.

I'm really surprised that in Cairns no pool shops carry that.:o

As has been said, if it's wet, just dry it yourself.

From where would the sand leak? If there are small holes somewhere I'd be sealing them with a good silicone/urethane sealant

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23 hours ago, andyr said:

 

I didn't say that lead was safe, dj.  I said that, because it has no dust, it is possible to handle it in a way that does not affect your health.

 

 

Then why not simply dry what you can find, yourself (in the oven).

 

 

How will sand leak out - yet the "zinc coated micro-discs" which make up the Atabite SMD-Z 7HD inert filler, won't?  And it seems to me that the only way dry sand can become moist ... is if you employ an evaporative cooling system in your house.

 

 

Given this filler weighs 2403 KG/m sq. compared to dry sand which has a typical rating of just 1442 KG/m sq ... what do you think is under the zinc coating, to make it almost twice as heavy as sand?  (Depleted uranium, maybe?  :lol: )

 

btw, given the product blurb talks about weighing " 'X' KG/m sq " ... I can't take anything they claim, seriously.  (Density is normally expressed " KG/cubic m " ... as I'm sure you can understand, a box 1m square will weigh more if filled to a depth of 1m with sand - than with a layer of Atabites Stand Filler only 5mm deep!)

 

Andy

 

 

Depleted Uranium, LOL.

 

All of the obvious suggestions have been made in this thread. Perhaps try something which has a plentiful local supply like dead coral.

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13 minutes ago, Telecine said:

 

All of the obvious suggestions have been made in this thread. Perhaps try something which has a plentiful local supply like dead coral.

 

 

C'mon, John - are you insinuating that the Greatest Barrier Reef is dead?  :)

 

Following on with your comment that "All of the obvious suggestions have been made in this thread " ... one that hasn't been mentioned so far is - fill the stands with mortar!

 

One might think that this would be good idea ... but I found in my experiments with using various materials to damp steel tubes, about 20 years ago, that - strangely enough - mortar (ie. sand, cement and a bit of water) does not have a very good damping effect, when used to fill tubes.

 

Damping works best when the material inside the tube is capable of moving slightly, when vibrations on the wall of the tube cause it to flex.  With sand, shot, garnet etc. ... this is possible.  But mortar sets hard inside the tube - and attaches itself to the inside of the tube walls - so is unable to do anything with the vibrations impinging on the tube.

 

Andy

 

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The advantage of sandblasting garnet is that it is about twice as heavy as sand. Coral sand would be even lighter.

 

Lead shot would be best, but I haven’t tried it because it looks like you can’t buy it without a gun license (also, my aim isn’t nearly good enough).

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2 hours ago, andyr said:

Damping works best when the material inside the tube is capable of moving slightly, when vibrations on the wall of the tube cause it to flex.  With sand, shot, garnet etc. ... this is possible.  But mortar sets hard inside the tube - and attaches itself to the inside of the tube walls - so is unable to do anything with the vibrations impinging on the tube.


Thanks for sharing this bit of wisdom. That's not something I've seen anywhere yet. I appreciate that this has come out in the discussion. 

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My pool girl just sent photos of their pool filter sand. I'm not using it. Warnings of cancer and organ failure if inhaled. Another point for Atabites. 

 

 

IMG_0906.jpg

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8 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:

 

My pool girl just sent photos of their pool filter sand. I'm not using it. Warnings of cancer and organ failure if inhaled. Another point for Atabites. 

 

 

IMG_0906.jpg

 

 

Sure - if it's quartz sand.  The Cowboy Junkies' song "Mining for Gold" talks about getting silicosis from mining gold (as you are digging into quartz).

 

My understanding is ... beach sand is not quartz.

 

I suggest this proves that lead shot is in fact safer to use - as you can't inhale its dust - as long as you don't touch it ... you are not getting 'lead poisoning'!  :)

 

Andy

 

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1 minute ago, andyr said:

My understanding is ... beach sand is not quartz

i'm not drying out beach sand in my oven. it will just get wet again because that's what it wants to do and rust out my stands. if everyone took beach sand there would be nothing left for turtles.

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12 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:

i'm not drying out beach sand in my oven. it will just get wet again because that's what it wants to do and rust out my stands.

 

Sand is not hygroscopic ... so it will not absorb water from the air (let alone from inside a sealed tube).

 

12 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:

if everyone took beach sand there would be nothing left for turtles.

 

Aah, so you're a greenie?  :lol:

 

3 minutes ago, dameonjamie said:

I think a bag of uncooked rice is the safest, least expensive, most non toxic, most non corrosive choice, most ethical choice. 

 

Absolutely amazing!  You eschew kitty litter ... yet you choose rice?

 

I hope it's brown rice.  :lol:

 

Andy

 

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29 minutes ago, andyr said:

Sand is not hygroscopic ... so it will not absorb water from the air (let alone from inside a sealed tube).

sand is mined from quartz. if you inhale it your organs will fail. that might be ok at @andyr's house of lead but organ failure at my house is frowned upon. 

 

31 minutes ago, andyr said:

I hope it's brown rice. 

Apparently jasmine and basmati uncooked rice will last 4-5 years. I think I've cracked it. 

 

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1 hour ago, dameonjamie said:

My pool girl just sent photos of their pool filter sand. I'm not using it. Warnings of cancer and organ failure if inhaled. Another point for Atabites. 

 

 

IMG_0906.jpg

 

Pool filter sand yes... but the recommendation for various other types of sand still stands, without the health risk.

 

 

1 hour ago, dameonjamie said:

i'm not drying out beach sand in my oven. it will just get wet again because that's what it wants to do and rust out my stands. if everyone took beach sand there would be nothing left for turtles.

 

As Andy mentioned, sand is not hygroscopic...

 

 

1 hour ago, dameonjamie said:

I think a bag of uncooked rice is the safest, least expensive, most non toxic, most non corrosive choice, most ethical choice. 

 

...but rice is... hence the commonplace recommendation to put a wet phone inside a bag of uncooked rice to help absorb all of the water. Bad idea if you're worried about your filling material attracting water and potentially developing bacterial growth or mould etc.

Edited by pete_mac
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1 hour ago, pete_mac said:

 

...but rice is... hence the commonplace recommendation to put a wet phone inside a bag of uncooked rice to help absorb all of the water. Bad idea if you're worried about your filling material attracting water and potentially developing bacterial growth or mould etc.

 

 

Good point, Pete!  :thumb:

 

1 hour ago, dameonjamie said:

 

sand is mined from quartz. if you inhale it your organs will fail. that might be ok at @andyr's house of lead but organ failure at my house is frowned upon. 

 

 

As a Type 1 diabetic, Dameon, my pancreas has already failed (36 years ago).  So "(further) organ failure at my house is also frowned upon"!  :lol:

 

You say that "sand is mined from quartz ".  Of that I have NFI ... but, if you care to search for it, another definition of 'sand' ... is that it is parrot fish excreta (parrot fish chew coral).

 

But - and I repeat - my recommendation for fill material is lead shot ... not sand.  As long as you handle it 'responsibly'.  :thumb:

 

Andy

 

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2 hours ago, dameonjamie said:

My pool girl just sent photos of their pool filter sand. I'm not using it. Warnings of cancer and organ failure if inhaled. Another point for Atabites. 

 

 

IMG_0906.jpg

 

You can contract silicosis from silica dust. Sand isn't dust though or we would all be dead from visiting the beach.

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11 minutes ago, andyr said:

 

Good point, Pete!  :thumb:

 

 

As a Type 1 diabetic, Dameon, my pancreas has already failed (36 years ago).  So "(further) organ failure at my house is also frowned upon"!  :lol:

 

You say that "sand is mined from quartz ".  Of that I have NFI ... but, if you care to search for it, another definition of 'sand' ... is that it is parrot fish excreta (parrot fish chew coral).

 

Andy

 

 

The humphead parrotfish can produce 90 kg (200 lb) of sand each year. So the most ecologically friendly option would be to buy one and feed it some coral.

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17 minutes ago, sir sanders zingmore said:

Do they have the one without the garnet?

 

Yes, that would be the empty bucket version.

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9 hours ago, Telecine said:

 

Yes, that would be the empty bucket version.

 

 

Haha!  :thumb:

 

On special - at half price.  :lol:

 

Andy

 

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HI,

 

I know you have concerns about paving sand, but that's what I used and it was totally dry. Specifically I used Jointing Sand from Bunnings, and as long as it's been stored out of the weather it should be fine.

 

N

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