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New project - TG’s Faital 3 way classic 15”


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8 hours ago, Janus77 said:

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Ok, that was the last thing I needed the workshop to complete.  Now it’s finishing at home.  :)  (In 2021, I’m away for 10 days now, then another 3 days camping afterwards)

 

 

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I’m so excited! Can’t wait for you to hear them and see/hear what you think!!!

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Woohoo!!   for reference, that’s a 60 inch TV.  It’s a bit difficult to get a perspective on that photo.  The entertainment unit is 2m wide.  

Howdy folks, ordered and paid yesterday for the tweeters, crossover components and various bits and pieces from Jantzen Audio, I went for the more basic kit with fabric tweeters and the lower (but sti

Well, the wood screws provided appear to be a slightly narrower head diameter than the holes on the 15" woofer.  Enough to have a listen, but a couple have just screwed straight through flush on the w

I couldn’t help myself.  Sprayed the grill frames black (just to ensure the light wood colour wouldn’t show through the fabric, and another thick layer of poly on the front baffles.  Hopefully in 10 days when I return the poly will have cured properly.  The test piece I did is very hard now, it seems to take some time to cure properly even though it’s dry to the touch within hours.  

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  • 2 weeks later...


Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, aris said:


Stay focussed!

 

Happy New Year 2021!


Wanna buy a watch? (Or mostly finished speaker). ;)

Edited by Janus77
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Back home today, away again from Monday though.  Polyurethane seems to have cured nicely in my absence.  Think I need a couple more coats though.  

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Ok folks, time to get my head back in the game.  Returned from camping on the South Coast this afternoon.  Popped my head in to look at the carnage that is my workshop/aunt's living room, no idea what to do next..

 

Thinking it through:

1. Sanding cabinets back so corners are nice etc.

2. polyurethane cabinets ready for vinyl

3. check baffle fitment with vinyl cutouts installed for a dry run, adjust (sand sides of baffles) if required.

4. Spray rear baffles black, coat of poly over the top probably.

5. install felt (scratch that, do it later per Aris advice to avoid the drill messing up the felt when drilling wire holes)

6. measure wire lengths for each driver to crossovers

7. work out how to mount the grill frames, do i use the clips, or crank it up a notch and get magnets? (Brian the frames are very strong, should be fine without any mid horizontal support spar).  drill for clips/magnets.

8. finish the front baffles, polish polyurethane, and clean up driver rebates which are full of poly.

9. drill bottom of cabinets for castors

10. vinyl cabinets, then install castors.

11. mount crossovers and binding posts to rear baffles, glue on felt.

12. drill mid and tweeter boxes to run wires from drivers to crossovers (Should i use a flexible glue or something to fill the holes once the wires are in so they're sealed, any advice?)

14. install felt, glue in rear baffles.

13. install acoustilux foam and wool

14. glue in front baffles.

15. drill and screw in drivers.

 

First draft, will give it some thought.  Happy for any thoughts/advice :)

 

Not long now folks, pretty pumped

 

 

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21 minutes ago, Janus77 said:

 

5. install felt (scratch that, do it later per Aris advice to avoid the drill messing up the felt when drilling wire holes)

 

same for any holes that may hit the felt eg castors & terminals 

 

21 minutes ago, Janus77 said:

6. measure wire lengths for each driver to crossovers

 

leave a bit more length than minimum especially at the driver but also at the terminals. think ahead eg if a xover component fails and you need to take out and resolder etc. 
 

21 minutes ago, Janus77 said:

12. drill mid and tweeter boxes to run wires from drivers to crossovers (Should i use a flexible glue or something to fill the holes once the wires are in so they're sealed, any advice?)

 

a quick set flexible filler. avoid hot glue gun as the seal can break open with a little wire movement. 


also don’t forget to twist wire pairs. Mine I forgot so had to go back and twist somewhat after. 
 

Aris

 

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Realised the glue provided for the crossovers will work well for filling the holes drilled for the wires. 
 

not much done tonight, need to get a clear game plan in my head.  I braided the wires and had a look at the front baffles, looking good, I need to fill 1 section on the baffle where the ports are, I nicked it slightly when cutting the circles out.  Wondering if I keep pouring poly in there or maybe areldite is better with a bit of red die to help it blend in then poly over the top.  
 

need to get down there during daylight hours and set up on the balcony to sand the cabinets properly and get them ready.  Do some test fitting of the front and rear baffles and ensure it’s all going together nicely.  Hopefully I can work out my plan of attack soon, feeling a bit too relaxed after several weeks of holidays.

 

think I’ll line the seams of the mid driver box with a flexible filler just to make sure they’re air tight.  

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3hrs at the “workshop” tonight.  

Sprayed 1 rear baffle black.  Will give it another coat tomorrow and then a very light sand before a few coats of poly. 

 

Sanded 1 front baffle so it’s smooth and even.  looks ugly but it’s much smoother to touch than the other.  Next is a 1200 grit and then 2000 both wet to bring up a gloss.  

 

Put a flexible silicon filler on the mid box seams to ensure they’re air tight.  
 

lot of work for a couple of boxes!

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Next up is drilling mid and tweeter boxes for speaker wire, dry fit crossovers to measure wire lengths, drill for castor installation, and then glue in felt.  

 

I think I’ll install the tweeter box after gluing in the front baffle to ensure it’s butted up tightly. 
 

need broad headed screws for the castors, and have decided to buy 4 600mm quick grips from Bunnings for gluing in the baffles.

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Polishing the poly with a 1200 grit wet on an orbital sander.  I’d gone through the first layer in some spots when I hand sanded at 400 grit.  Is this ok, do I keep going finer and finer until it’s all polished or do I need to apply another coat once it’s all smooth and just polish that coat so I don’t get through under to the next coat?

 

the photo clearly showing the coats is in a reflective position, it’s only reflecting light there’s no whitish tinge

 

 

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You shouldn't be undoing all your good work by taking off too much lacquer.  I would try a very fine sand at best and then a final coat, you need to stop at some point.

 

With the final coat sometimes less is more.  Don't try and put too much of a coating on the finish.

Edited by PKay
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1 minute ago, PKay said:

You shouldn't be undoing all your good work by taking off too much lacquer.  I would try a very fine sand at best and then a final coat, you need to stop at some point.

 

Thanks PK, i should have sanded in between coats of poly i guess.  I'll do a fine sand and then a final coat once it's all smooth, then polish that final coat with a fine grit.  My woodworking teacher recommended applying the poly with a cloth not a brush, might do that for the final coat.

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1 minute ago, Janus77 said:

Hmm, guess i just keep polishing and if i need to apply another coat, so be it.

 

You could but we want to see the final product and you took off way too much time for the rest of us 🙂

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1 minute ago, Janus77 said:

 

Thanks PK, i should have sanded in between coats of poly i guess.  I'll do a fine sand and then a final coat once it's all smooth, then polish that final coat with a fine grit.  My woodworking teacher recommended applying the poly with a cloth not a brush, might do that for the final coat.

Ah that makes sense.  I thought you would have been doing a very light sanding with the steel wool between coats.

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2 minutes ago, PKay said:

Ah that makes sense.  I thought you would have been doing a very light sanding with the steel wool between coats.

 

Someone (it might have been you) gave me advice to sand with steel wool in between.  Which i did a few times.  I think the larger issue was the uneven application caused by the brush i was using.  Probably could have ended up with a more even finish with less work if i'd used a cloth or something like that.

 

Anyway, nothing lost at this point, will rub a final coat on once i have them nice and smooth, then give it another 2000-3000 grit wet sand to take any little edges off.

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As you said, could be that applying too thick because of application method means more needs to be sanded off to get an even finish than I experienced. 
 

Otherwise, I’d just suggest a lighter touch when sanding maybe? Don’t know if that helps, but I think I was going too far in my middle coat and backed off on the amount of sanding/force required. 
 

I’m with Pkay,  super keen to see the finished product and hear your impressions :cool:

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Thanks Ash. 

 

I've decided to do a wipe on poly after i finish sanding.  I mix 50/50 mineral turps with the brush on poly, should result in a smooth finish and then i can polish with a 2000 grit to get a proper shine. 

Wait and see.

 

Hoping to have 1 speaker completed this weekend, and the 2nd by the following weekend.  Progress going to be a bit slower now compared to pre Christmas.  Doing my best! :)

Edited by Janus77
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Dust is the enemy. If you want to see your eyeballs in it you take the timber to 2000 grit. Then take the dust off each coat with fine steel wool and wash with damp cloth. Never paint where you sand.  Use a spare room with heaters on to paint in. At the end of the day you will likely end up with some dust in the final coat. You will see it but others will see a thing of great beauty.

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Anyone feel like coming over to cut some felt,  had enlisted help which is now asleep on the couch.  4 cuts in..

 

 

 

82CCCE2C-64C0-43AB-BEB7-C0CAB7DF2DFB.jpeg

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First injury of the build last night, good result really although you'd think i'd have learnt to use scissors safely by now.

Just glad it wasn't the table saw!

 

Progress (dry fit only)

 

4CE0F1F1-B54C-4AB5-86D4-2DEF4140D8F2.jpeg

Edited by Janus77
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11 hours ago, Janus77 said:

had enlisted help which is now asleep on the couch

 

Yeah, know that one.

 

The thump of my hay baler echoing around the hills is a sign for the whole district to evacuate to the beach.

 

1 hour ago, Janus77 said:

First injury of the build last night, good result really

 

 

There's a bit of blood in my builds, too. It's actually good value; the sweat and tears just become distant memories after time.

 

Hope it's not going to slow you down too much (and you're OK).

 

What glue did you decide on for the felt?

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Yeah, it's a small cut.  I'm a bleeder though :)

 

I've purchased some Dunlop vinyl adhesive as recommended by Aris to glue the felt.

 

Next to do:

wipe on poly on face and rear baffles

drill cabinets for castors

glue in felt.

 

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29 minutes ago, BioBrian said:

Wire holes?

Mid and tweeter box holes for wires between driver and crossover 

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11 minutes ago, Janus77 said:

The wipe on poly I made up works a treat, super gloss!

 

 

3824FAE4-C651-42B7-8D5A-A7E509F2C337.jpeg

Sensational finish - in the home stretch now.

 

What application did you use? Never heard of wiping on lacquer before.

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Mix "brush on" oil based poly 50/50 with mineral turpentine.  I purchased a paint applicator at Bunnings.   Used an old empty bottle to make the mix.  Lid on it will last quite a while, then i just pour it onto the surface and spread it out with the applicator.

 

https://www.bunnings.com.au/shur-line-handi-painter_p1670161

 

Works beautifully, hard foam handle, then soft foam and soft bristles which are about 5-6mm long.

 

Glad i did the 10 coats of brush on first, I think that gives it a much stronger and thicker coating, but the wipe on is far superior for finishing, because it's more runny than the straight brush on, it levels out when you spread it to give a nice even gloss.

I'll hit it with steel wool once cured, then another 2 coats, then some 2000 grit, then i'll add some automotive polish and see how it comes up.

 

 

 

F5F839F8-7B34-40A7-ABD8-0BF6BE48C874.jpeg

 

Edited by Janus77
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Quick question for those more experienced.

 

I need to drill holes to screw the castors in.  I'd like them right up in the corners, however that will mean i'm drilling parallel with the ply lamination rather than through the layers.  My gut says this is a bad idea.  Just want to confirm with others that i should be securing screws perpendicular to the ply lamination layers?

 

It just means i'll have to leave a 24mm gap between the edge of the cabinet and the edge of the castor base (the screw will then be in about 6mm from that point)


1st photo: how I’d like them mounted

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2nd and 3rd: how I think I need to mount

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Edited by Janus77
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Apart from running risk of splitting timber you won't get as much purchase screwing with the grain like that. It changes the dynamics of the screw in the timber. It's very easy to overtighten  and lose the thread in the timber. You might get away with it initially if thing go well but long term it could rear it's  ugly head.

Talk to your  woodwork teacher he may have a solution.  Experiment on some scrap pieces.

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I wonder whether you would consider making a base plate, screw the wheels into it and then using some sort of adhesive to glue the base plate to the speakers.  The only downside would be it would be difficult to remove if you ever changed your mind about the castor wheels and it may change the look but then the castor wheels won't look great anyway.

 

I would seriously consider some sort of fixed feet and getting some Herbies Gliders before you do any drilling.  https://herbiesaudiolab.com/collections/loudspeaker-rack-decoupling-and-isolation/products/giant-fat-glider

 

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Thanks for the advice.   Got impatient and forged ahead.  
I decided to just drill the bases with a paper made border guide to ensure I drilled through the ply layers.  
 

I don’t have access to the instructor now and if I want to I can organise some spikes to maybe lift the speakers off the castors if it gets to that.  
 

getting close one the first!!!!

Edited by Janus77
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Dry fit rear with crossovers to measure wire lengths for cutting.  

well I’m getting excited!

 

4C0D63E7-D7DF-4528-B1BC-29D1A04CA854.jpeg

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I've cut all the felt, and have a bit over a square metre left over.  Should i make some cutouts to put on the inside face of the front baffle too?  Pictures don't indicate that there's any felt on there, although there could be and i'm just unaware?

 

Close people, so close.  I'm pretty keen to finish them so i can listen, and also because i'm getting tired of spending all my spare time building speakers - this is not a married with young kids man's game.  The alternative would be to take a more relaxed approach, and we could all look forward to seeing them completed in late 2021.. hell no.  I'm away weekend of 23rd Jan, i'll put all my efforts into having them completed before then.

 

To do:

1. Front section of the cabinet felt glue in

2. Solder wires to crossovers and binding post tabs.  (just occurred to me that i've probably made my life a little difficult by gluing in the mid driver wire through the mid box already - ah well i'll add it to the list of 100 things i'd have done slightly differently)

3. Vinyl the cabinet

4. Attach crossovers to rear baffle and glue in rear baffle after installing acoustic foam

5. Glue in front baffle

6. Glue in tweeter box

7. Screw in Castors

8. Drill front baffle for grill frames, glue in sockets and plugs, attach mesh cloth

 

Thanks for all the support and encouragement people :)

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On 12/01/2021 at 5:33 PM, Rob Wright said:

Dust is the enemy. If you want to see your eyeballs in it you take the timber to 2000 grit. Then take the dust off each coat with fine steel wool and wash with damp cloth. Never paint where you sand.  Use a spare room with heaters on to paint in. At the end of the day you will likely end up with some dust in the final coat. You will see it but others will see a thing of great beauty.

 

Rob it sounds like you have some experience with polyurethane finishing.  I've wiped on 1 coat with the 50/50 turps mix.  It's glossy but still not completely even.  when you said take the timber to 2000 grit, do you mean do this in between each coat, or just use steel wool in between and then wipe and apply again?  Thinking 3 coats of wipe on should be enough.

Should i polish it for the final finish or just leave it with the wiped on gloss?  I'd rather polish it so it's a little more of a finished look, but that said the 2000 grit i used before didn't bring up a gloss finish, not like the current gloss of the wipe on.  I've seen videos on youtube where they use automotive polish to bring up the gloss.

Maybe a 2500-3000 grit wet polish on the final coat, and then automotive polish?

 

What do you think?

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