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Thanks for the explanation, that was something I’ve been struggling with. I had the conduits there as I was originally going to get book shelves but they suddenly weren’t available in the colour i chose so had to go with the SR900’s

 

Now to get some more speaker wire and work out moving the SR900’s.

 

I’m thinking maybe it would be worthwhile eventually getting additional seats in front of the step and hopefully should make it all better.

 

Once i get the new PJ and AVR I’ll get the local shop (West Coast Hifi) to tune it all in and hopefully should improve things no end.

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I'd recommend 7.1.2 - your room is deep enough for it. Depending on screen size, consider moving your seating forward a little (about 0.5m).

I'd go the other way. 5.1 to 7.1 is not that big an improvement from a listening perspective. Having 3D overhead is a big improvement. 

Not true - as long as the fronts and rears are at the same angle (or as close as possible) then depending on your room layout you may end up with one pair on ceiling and one pair high up on the wall.

Yeah cool, I think you need to sort out the seating before the speaker position. And think about the primary seating position, being in either the front or rear row, as this will change the location of the side surrounds. 
I reckon if you put a row in front, you will sitting in those most of the time, and if that’s the case, layout the speakers for that row, with the side surrounds at 90 degrees to the front row, of just behind. 
Also need to be thinking about the height of the head rests in relation to the speaker height, make sure that you can seat every speak from each seat, so don’t mount them too low. Also you will need to see all of the screen from the rear seats, so don’t about the height of the front row seats. 
With that front row I place, having rear surrounds on the back wall makes a lot of sense, as does .4 for atmos. 

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3 hours ago, lufc001 said:

That said have a read of this thread. Basically says to put them where i have them now ??‍♂️

 

https://www.avforums.com/threads/ideal-placement-of-bipole-surround-speakers.1817142/

 

So much conflicting information out there!

Don't use bipoles - that is old way of thinking.

Unless you use them as surrounds (not rear surrounds) BETWEEN 2 rows of seating so that each driver of the bipole is facing at each row of seating.

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4 hours ago, lufc001 said:

That said have a read of this thread. Basically says to put them where i have them now ??‍♂️

 

https://www.avforums.com/threads/ideal-placement-of-bipole-surround-speakers.1817142/

 

So much conflicting information out there!

Yeah for sure, 100% on conflicting info.

 

 I try to stick with the manufacture recommendations on this kinda thing. If you look at the Aria 900 user manual, linked below, page 28 it states;

”Do not place surround speakers too far behind the listening point, as this will lead to degraded sound perception from them. Aim for placement along the side walls for more enveloping sound effects”

 

https://www.focal.com/sites/www.focal.fr/files/shared/catalog/document/notice_aria900.pdf 


the Dolby Atmos Home Theatre Install Guide has them left and right of the listening position.

 

https://www.dolby.com/siteassets/technologies/dolby-atmos/atmos-installation-guidelines-121318_r3.1.pdf


And that with what I experienced with my system, listening to 5.1 audio with my SR900 in a similar position to yours, and then using a in wall at 90 degrees to my head, there is no way I am going back. 
 

If you do go 7.1 for the ear level speakers, you will need something on the side wall anyway.

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30 minutes ago, niterida said:

Don't use bipoles - that is old way of thinking.

Unless you use them as surrounds (not rear surrounds) BETWEEN 2 rows of seating so that each driver of the bipole is facing at each row of seating.

 
Yeah spot on the SR900 that he has would be ideal for 2 rows of seats being used as side surrounds.  

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So... sell the SR900's for some nice Focal In-walls looks to be the way to go then?

 

Thinking 2 x Focal 300IW6 for the SL and SR then 4 x 300ICW6 for the in ceiling speakers?

Edited by lufc001
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7 hours ago, lufc001 said:

So... sell the SR900's for some nice Focal In-walls looks to be the way to go then?

 

Thinking 2 x Focal 300IW6 for the SL and SR then 4 x 300ICW6 for the in ceiling speakers?

 

You can always test placement of the left and right surrounds with what you have and compare it to them being on the rear wall. Try moving the SR900 to the left and right of the seat position, recalibrate the receiver and have a listen. You could sit the speakers on top of something (a box) to get them to approximate ear level and try it. Listen to something that has a good surround track and compare before and after. That will tell you if you are on the right track. If you think that its better move them there, if not leave them as is.

 

I wouldn't be replacing the SR900 at this stage, as they are a fantastic surround speaker, and especially if you are going to be putting in two rows of seating, as @niterida mentioned. 

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Yeah thats actually a good idea, I’ll just go buy some more speaker wire as I’ve ran out. I think having them at ear level will be an improvement nonetheless. 

 

Currently they are firing out above ear level by 500mm.

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4 hours ago, lufc001 said:

Yeah thats actually a good idea, I’ll just go buy some more speaker wire as I’ve ran out. I think having them at ear level will be an improvement nonetheless. 

 

Currently they are firing out above ear level by 500mm.


Yeah cool, try as many places as you can. Nothing wrong with experimenting ?

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When i went to buy the speaker wire today from the shop I was told that the Denon amps may have issue playing streaming services on HEOS whilst playing anything in the main zone. With your X6700 do you find an issue with this at all?

 

The extra power and 13 channels is one of the reasons I’m upgrading so if you cant do this may just get the X3700H

Edited by lufc001
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30 minutes ago, lufc001 said:

When i went to buy the speaker wire today from the shop I was told that the Denon amps may have issue playing streaming services on HEOS whilst playing anything in the main zone. With your X6700 do you find an issue with this at all?

 

The extra power and 13 channels is one of the reasons I’m upgrading so if you cant do this may just get the X3700H


I don’t use HEOS, but I know the older versions couldn’t do TV audio to anything but the main zone. Where the 6700 does that. I can check it out later and see if it lets me. Will report back.  

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Thanks I’m really interested to know if you play content in the main zone if it stops Spotify (for example) being played in zone 2/3. I’d be surprised if thats the case tbh as it would make the whole feature pretty pointless.

Edited by lufc001
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Ok, so I have tested and it works as expected. 
 

i reconfigured my speakers, so that 7.1.2 was assigned to main zone, and 2 speakers for zone 2, by reassign the top rear speakers to zone 2. 
 

I can play a atmos sound track from my shield in the main zone, and play music via HEOS in zone 2 at the same time. The movie came from the 7 ear level speakers, the sub and the top front speakers, and music came out of the top rear speakers. Which is what I expected.  
 

Keep in mind that if you are doing 7.1.4 in the main zone. You will need an external amp to run zone 2. But if you are doing 5.1.4 or 7.1.2 the 6700 won’t need an external amp for zone 2. 
 

Hope that helps/

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That’s great, thanks for that. 

 

I’ll be doing 5.1.4 and just 5.1 in the immediate future once i get the new PJ and amp. I then need to get the atmos speakers.

 

I was told at my local store they (local rep) are trying to get rid of all their Focal products as they may be leaving the market in Australia also?

 

Not sure if there is anything I’ve read online to that accord. 

 

If there is any truth in that might be best to import the Focals from UK and save on GST. I was recommended Krix in ceiling speakers but would rather stick with Focal tbh

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2 hours ago, lufc001 said:

That’s great, thanks for that. 

 

I’ll be doing 5.1.4 and just 5.1 in the immediate future once i get the new PJ and amp. I then need to get the atmos speakers.

 

I was told at my local store they (local rep) are trying to get rid of all their Focal products as they may be leaving the market in Australia also?

 

Not sure if there is anything I’ve read online to that accord. 

 

If there is any truth in that might be best to import the Focals from UK and save on GST. I was recommended Krix in ceiling speakers but would rather stick with Focal tbh


Please consider 7.1 as well. As I stated before, I would rather have 7.1.2 over 5.1.4. But with that 6700 you can run 7.1.4 and then your zone2 from a small amp.

 

I reckon your local rep is full of it. Focal have been in Australia for years, both in home and car audio markets, and they appointed a new distributor last year (maybe year before). There is no way they would be pulling out of ANZ. Normally when you here things like that is due to the local shop having other factors at play, this reseller market has a lot of political forces at play. 

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That would make sense but i'll see what I can get close to when i am ready to get the speakers. I've been recommended Krix speakers so many times there so would expect some sort of relationship with them.

 

I've never heard of Krix before so no idea if they are any good.

 

Also another factor in being an issue for 7.1.2 is that I have a sliding door which runs past where my Surround L speaker would go and that wall also is not cavity. It really impedes my options.

 

I'll be moving the SR900's to 90 degrees of listening position today and testing.

 

I did notice when I went to my local shop yesterday they had another brand of speaker mounted like I have my rear surrounds in a 5.1 configuration and when i spoke to them it was suggested what i had set was correct.

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4 hours ago, lufc001 said:

I've never heard of Krix before so no idea if they are any good.

 

They are crap - I have absolutely no idea why nearly every commercial cinema in Australia uses them. ?

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4 hours ago, lufc001 said:

That would make sense but i'll see what I can get close to when i am ready to get the speakers. I've been recommended Krix speakers so many times there so would expect some sort of relationship with them.

 

I've never heard of Krix before so no idea if they are any good.

 

Also another factor in being an issue for 7.1.2 is that I have a sliding door which runs past where my Surround L speaker would go and that wall also is not cavity. It really impedes my options.

 

I'll be moving the SR900's to 90 degrees of listening position today and testing.

 

I did notice when I went to my local shop yesterday they had another brand of speaker mounted like I have my rear surrounds in a 5.1 configuration and when i spoke to them it was suggested what i had set was correct.


So Krix is a well known Adelaide based brand, yes they are pretty good, however I believe that they import their drives from China and make the cabinets locally. 
Considering that you already have Focal Aria in the system, why wouldn’t you stay with the same brand, with the same driver and tweeter technology across the board. And these are all made in France buy a company that makes the entire product, not just parts of it. Also Moving to another brand will change the sound signature between front and rear, and this doesn’t make sense to do. 
 

about the left surround, yeah makes sense about the door, your layout didn’t really show that. Makes sense to try a few locations anyway. 

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I'd pretty much discounted Krix from the moment i was quoted them, rather keep all the same speakers.

 

I've moved my SR900's so they are now at 90 degrees of listening area and at ear level. I've then measured (with a tape measure) distance to all speakers, set that in the AVR3312 and used an SPL meter (iphone app variety) to set each speaker channel level to 75dB as listening postition.

 

Sure this isnt the most accurate but I think its atleast done the measurements more accurately than Audyssey.

 

After doing all of this my system sounds a lot better. I think i should have enough wire to move the speakers back to the rear position and see how the system sounds but suffice to say big improvement so far.

 

I'm going to test it out with a full movie tonight once the kids are in bed.

 

On another note, do you set your SR900 crossover at 80Hz or 90Hz? I've got them set to 90Hz currently.

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Nice!. 
 

Just remember with audyssey that it will make allowances for frequency response changes due to the room.

 

The SR900 is 85Hz to 28kHz, and low point is 67Hz, so I would be setting at 80Hz, but 90 is cool too.  
 

Let us know how you go.  

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I already ran the Audyssey setup a few months back so left all those settings, and i just modified the distances and the channel levels today.

 

Did a bit more googling and most of what I’ve found suggested bipoles should go on back wall in a 5.1 setup (and not not at 90 degrees) at approximately  600mm above ear level.

 

I’ll move them back tomorrow and see how it compares.

 

Also need to move my PJ screen tomorrow as I’ve decided its too low.  Good job I’m covering school holidays!

 

 

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Moved the SR900's to the rear wall and the result is even better. I am wondering if i would be best to lower them somewhat maybe 300mm down from where they are now so they are 300mm above listning position.

 

Also moved my PJ screen higher and reset all the lens memory. Everything looking and sounding a lot better now.

 

It does raise the question though is the .4 too much for my room for Atmos? I'm wondering if i should just get the 2 x 300ICW6's and see how they go? There is nowhere to demo. 

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On 08/01/2021 at 6:24 PM, lufc001 said:

Moved the SR900's to the rear wall and the result is even better. I am wondering if i would be best to lower them somewhat maybe 300mm down from where they are now so they are 300mm above listning position.

 

Also moved my PJ screen higher and reset all the lens memory. Everything looking and sounding a lot better now.

 

It does raise the question though is the .4 too much for my room for Atmos? I'm wondering if i should just get the 2 x 300ICW6's and see how they go? There is nowhere to demo. 

 
How did you go with the SR900 location? Try some more places?

 

On the .4, I don’t think it’s too much for your room.  My room is slightly bigger and it works great.
 

With your lounge on the rear wall, directly above could be considered top middle or top rear, and there is a large gap of no speakers between the front sound stage and your rear speakers on the rear wall. So .4 makes more sense for you?


Having said that, and as I said before I would rather have 7.1.2 over 5.1.4 any day. 

Edited by Monster11
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I dont have many other places to put them. I do think they need to be lower by 300mm or so I think so they match the fronts.

 

Then in conjuction with the Atmos I think it will sound great. After modifying all the distances manually and setting volume levels manually to 75dB it certainly packed more of a punch than it ever has. I think my PB-1000 sub is happier.

 

My wife keeps saying it's too lound but I think i can dial that out ?

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Yeah WAF is important.

 

Mine made a comment the other day about how much clearer that the monsters are behind here her when she is gaming with the new speakers installed. I think it freaks her out a bit. That a win right?

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On 03/01/2021 at 5:18 PM, lufc001 said:

So here is my plan, started to do something fancy in Sketchup then couldn't be bothered as it was taking too much time.

 

I do have conduit run in the walls either side of the couch however if i moved the SR900's there would that improve things and also would i put them at listening height or a bit higher. So far they are about 500mm higher on the back wall.

 

Im also upgrading to the Epson 4k TW9400 projector to replace my Panasonic 8000. I've also got a 130" cinemascope screen.

projector-plan.jpg

With a room of this size/layout, you really should move the couch forward before thinking of 7.1 or atmos - you can always build a plinth for it to extend the step if you have to

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