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Sony VPL-VW590ES / VPL-VW790ES Owners Thread


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Got sick of waiting for all the reviews so decided to pull the trigger on a new 790ES.  Expected delivery and install in a few weeks.  Will post my impressions once I've had some time with it.

First viewing with my 590 last night and I’m shocked by how great it is.    The colors and detail are astonishing, I couldn’t be more impressed. Especially at this price point.    I will

We have had our 790 for just on two weeks now and although not calibrated it is hands down night and day compared to our previous Mitsubishi lamp projector from 7 years ago.   sadly we are w

Got sick of waiting for all the reviews so decided to pull the trigger on a new 790ES.  Expected delivery and install in a few weeks.  Will post my impressions once I've had some time with it.

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19 hours ago, xPLAYRZx said:

Got sick of waiting for all the reviews so decided to pull the trigger on a new 790ES.  Expected delivery and install in a few weeks.  Will post my impressions once I've had some time with it.

 

Congrats!  Looking forward to you thoughts once it arrives.

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A look at the new HDR Enhancer feature and comparison to madVR solution.  Please keep any madVR talk for another thread. (I know DTM is a hot topic at the moment)

 

 

Taken from first look review HERE

Edited by xPLAYRZx
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First viewing with my 590 last night and I’m shocked by how great it is. 
 

The colors and detail are astonishing, I couldn’t be more impressed. Especially at this price point. 
 

I will have to wait to see the 790 my dealer bought, once it arrives, but couldn’t ask for more than this level of performance in my room. 
 

PlayrZ I hope you enjoy your 790 and are as thrilled with its image quality as I am with mine!

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4 hours ago, Sinewave said:

irst viewing with my 590 last night and I’m shocked by how great it is. 
 

The colors and detail are astonishing, I couldn’t be more impressed. Especially at this price point. 
 

 

When you have had a chance to get used to it, I'd be interested to hear how you think the dynamic HDR enhancer works with material such as UHD streaming and other 4K material you may watch. Comments to date have principally  been in relation to extreme cases  on selected discs but it would be good to understand how it performs with material most people would watch. 

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10 hours ago, Sinewave said:

First viewing with my 590 last night and I’m shocked by how great it is. 

Awesome stuff.  Great to hear it's exceeded your expectations, very encouraging. What projector did you replace?

 

My 790 is scheduled to be delivered and installed this coming Friday.  Can't wait :)

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On 03/10/2020 at 7:21 PM, xPLAYRZx said:

Awesome stuff.  Great to hear it's exceeded your expectations, very encouraging. What projector did you replace?

 

My 790 is scheduled to be delivered and installed this coming Friday.  Can't wait :)

My system isn’t very impressive I’m afraid, but there is no doubt of it’s performance.  My last projector was a Panasonic PTAE8000. It took a long time to find something that was orderers of magnitude better.
 

 

Edited by Sinewave
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On 03/10/2020 at 1:39 PM, TP1 said:

 

When you have had a chance to get used to it, I'd be interested to hear how you think the dynamic HDR enhancer works with material such as UHD streaming and other 4K material you may watch. Comments to date have principally  been in relation to extreme cases  on selected discs but it would be good to understand how it performs with material most people would watch. 

So amusingly I only have 2 UHD blue rays, (I just bought 15 more) so I didn’t have much material to test with. But I did try several different settings and tried upscaling 2k blue rays in my Oppo 205 vs the 590 with mixed results. 
 

My room can be pitch black from external light, but as it’s a multi purpose room it’s not a bat cave. I will have to paint the roof black, or put 8x black Viacoustic panels on the ceiling between screen and projector as the light bleed from the screen was astonishing. I will definitely one day post photos of my setup as I’d really appreciate comments on how to improve my *everything*. 
 

my Pana 8000 was only ever used in ‘REC709’, my screen is a Screen Technics with zero gain. 

 

We watched Black Panther on ‘Cinema Film 1 and 2’ and.. I couldn’t se a damn thing. It was so dark. Contrast enhancer on mid, as were the other HDR settings. But on ‘Ref’ it was just about perfect. Actually it was shockingly good to be honest. And I’ve seen the entire Sony range in hi fi stores around the country. 
 

I have the Spears and Munsil test disc and will do as much adjustment as possible and report back!
 

Anyone in Canberra getting a professional calibration anytime soon? Put me on the list if there are

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Best results so far were with the Oppo 205 set to ‘Source Direct’ (as always.) 

 

I’ll definitely spend some more time trying out different settings but playing ‘Dark Knight Rises’ UHD: when you pause the IMAX scenes with my screen in its 16x9 configuration you see a wide vertical tilt shot of New York City - you can actually see into hundreds of individual windows in the buildings in exquisite detail and the beautifully subtle shadings of light reflected on the stone facade from one building to another. It’s breathtaking.
 

This is in ‘REF’ with zero calibration so I imagine there’s far more to come. 
 

I’ll be doing proper contrast/gamma/black level adjustments as soon as I have time.
 

I also installed (at great difficulty in my room with its 4 layers of insulation!!) a new 10M run of Kordz PRS Spectra7 active copper 18Gbs HDMI cable as I was concerned my 16Gbs active optical HDMI cable wouldn’t be sufficient for 4K 

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"Reference" picture mode out of the box is apparently excellent on the new models, so your experience would support that.  Sounds like you have identified a few opportunities (and plans) to improve your space.  It'll definitely make a difference, worth doing.

 

Assuming you didn't test the your previous cable before replacing it?  I ask because I'm also likely going to replace my current 12M Wireworld Chroma 7 HDMI, mainly due to the lack/conflicting information available on it's ability to handle 18Gbps over 12M.  I've been recommended the AudioQuest Pearl in a 10M or 12.5M.  I want to be sure I get the full 18Gbps as I do a good bit of gaming on my setup and will likely need the bandwidth.

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We have had our 790 for just on two weeks now and although not calibrated it is hands down night and day compared to our previous Mitsubishi lamp projector from 7 years ago.

 

sadly we are waiting on 4k hdmi switches so we can test the 4k and hdr but the 1080p is glorious for our family. We even had to turn the laser down to 20% it was that damn bright!

 

hopefully we can get it calibrated in 2021 🤪

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6 hours ago, xPLAYRZx said:

Assuming you didn't test the your previous cable before replacing it?  I ask because I'm also likely going to replace my current 12M Wireworld Chroma 7 HDMI, mainly due to the lack/conflicting information available on it's ability to handle 18Gbps over 12M.  I've been recommended the AudioQuest Pearl in a 10M or 12.5M.  I want to be sure I get the full 18Gbps as I do a good bit of gaming on my setup and will likely need the bandwidth.

Ive got chroma 7 and it has little problem  with hi framerate 4k/60  uhd so try it out before buying[ its about 30ft] 😊.  It would be prudent otherwise to  get cabling that is 48gbps compatible for hdmi 2.1 and features it contains like ruipro 8k fibre ; xPLAYRZx  

it will take awhile before games come out that take advantage of 120fs and 8k frame rates so future proofing is a good move :)

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9 hours ago, Sinewave said:

So amusingly I only have 2 UHD blue rays, (I just bought 15 more) so I didn’t have much material to test with. But I did try several different settings and tried upscaling 2k blue rays in my Oppo 205 vs the 590 with mixed results. 
 

Netflix  has quite a bit of 4k UHD material, as has  Prime Video and Stan.

 

9 hours ago, Sinewave said:

But on ‘Ref’ it was just about perfect. Actually it was shockingly good to be honest. And I’ve seen the entire Sony range in hi fi stores around the country. 

 

Nice!  There is a lot to look forward to.

 

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7 hours ago, xPLAYRZx said:

Assuming you didn't test the your previous cable before replacing it?  I ask because I'm also likely going to replace my current 12M Wireworld Chroma 7 HDMI, mainly due to the lack/conflicting information available on it's ability to handle 18Gbps over 12M.  I've been recommended the AudioQuest Pearl in a 10M or 12.5M.  I want to be sure I get the full 18Gbps as I do a good bit of gaming on my setup and will likely need the bandwidth.

 

 

I have attached  a pdf of HDMI test results - it was done a couple of years ago but  could still be relevant.  I  only use active optical HDMI for all equipment connections.   Probably not necessary for   for all  connections but it does seem to give the best picture and fastest HDMI sync times. 

HDMI CABLES PERFORMANCE EVALUATION & TESTING REPORT #1 ~ 50FT 15M+ LENGTH CABLES v3 SML.pdf

Edited by TP1
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OK, so my 790 was delivered and installed last Friday. Since then I’ve managed to put just over 20 hours on it, much of that time spent fiddling with all the settings (as you do).  Also watched a movie (Alita), some Netflix (HD & 4K HDR) and YouTube along with some gaming (Gears 5 & COD)

 

For context, I’m coming of another Sony, the VPL-VW520ES (which is also for sale in the classified section at a cracking price).  Video chain is 790 > 10M Audioquest Forest HDMI > Anthem AVM60. Screen is 130” 16:9 1.3 gain.  Sources are Panasonic UB9000 and Xbox One X.

Never really reviewed a projector before so I’ll try and keep it short-ish –

 

SDR.709  – 11/10

Any SDR.709 content I viewed looked amazing.  Contrast, colour and brightness are all improved.  I think “pop” is the word all the kids are using to describe this.  The colour is just next level, I’m hesitant to use the word “colour volume” because that’s not it, but the quality of the colour is another tier up on anything I’ve seen before. It really is stand out and one of the most noticeable differences I have found so far.

 

SDR.2020 – 9/10

Again, excellent.  All the benefits of SDR with wider colour space.  Do recommend.  Currently switching between this and HDR for movies.

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HDR.2020 – 8/10

Before I comment on HDR performance, let me preface this with my general view on HDR on projectors…. it’s crap.  I also hate having to use different profiles for different content, adjust anything on a per movie basis, blah, blah.  It’s ridiculous.  You put the movie in, press play and it should look amazing. Period.

 

Now that we have that out of the way, how does the 790 do with HDR content.  Not terrible.  Although there are very little controls you have over how the projector handles HDR, what it does do with it’s magical X1 chipset and “enhancement” isn’t all that bad.  I did compare this to the Panasonics HDR optimizer settings using the movie Oblivion, both Low (350 nit) and High (500 nit) luminance projector settings and thought the Sony did a better job of the tone mapping, at least to my eyes. 

 

Although the Sony did appear to throw away more highlight detail, it maintained a much better APL in the process.  When you flick back and forth, any lost highlight details didn’t really add anything to the scene.  So “technically”, yes you lose more details but gain a better viewing experience. The purists will not agree. 

 

Netflix and YouTube HDR content did seem to fair a little better compared to UDH Blu Ray.  Not sure why, perhaps just the content I chose but it was overall very good. 

 

Gaming – 9/10

Excellent for gaming, everything looks beautiful.  Input lag reduction feature seems indistinguishable from the 520 but that’s probably just me, apparently it’s improved.  I have no way to verify this.   Seems to handle all the content you throw at it.   Most games have the ability to fine tune your video/HDR settings on a per game basis, along with the consoles ability to have an independent HDR calibration makes for a much better HDR gaming experience.

 

A few things I like/dislike.

 

Like

Independent settings for SDR and HDR

Amazing SDR and gaming performance

Usable HDR performance

Laser light source (you know you want it)

Instant on/off

Out of the box colour (Reference mode is almost perfect)

Noticeable uplift in overall sharpness (probably DFO)

 

Dislike

Price

Fan noise/tone (I find this louder/more distracting that 520 on low lamp mode even on low laser settings)

Slower than expected HDMI sync times (although this may just be my specific combination of devices)

Price

 

Overall I’m very happy with the purchase, there is much to like about this projector, it is certainly a step up from previous models.  I will obviously be spending a lot more time with the 790 and hope to continue improving and experimenting with different settings.  I also imagine we will see further refinement via firmware changes into the future.  Who knows, I might be wowed by HDR yet!imageproxy.php?img=&key=6052995cfa95af68imageproxy.php?img=&key=6052995cfa95af68imageproxy.php?img=&key=6052995cfa95af68imageproxy.php?img=&key=6052995cfa95af68imageproxy.php?img=&key=6052995cfa95af68

Edited by xPLAYRZx
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I also had a crack at a few photos of the images produced by the Sony so I could share.  Not as easy as I thought as it really is difficult to capture the full range and colour accurately.

 

Enjoy

 

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50 minutes ago, xPLAYRZx said:

SDR.709  – 11/10

Any SDR.709 content I viewed looked amazing.  Contrast, colour and brightness are all improved.  I think “pop” is the word all the kids are using to describe this.  The colour is just next level, I’m hesitant to use the word “colour volume” because that’s not it, but the quality of the colour is another tier up on anything I’ve seen before. It really is stand out and one of the most noticeable differences I have found so far.

 

I thought  the laser light source was one  factor that would make colour pop more, and  also add to the image stability.  Sony scaling  from regular video to 4K is the best in the business and the image usually has  more resolution than what would be produced by 2K displays.

 

As a matter of interest, what output resolution do you have the source equipment  set to?

 

Edited by TP1
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Not sure on the specifics for each device, but output would be maxed on all of them, so 4K, 12bit, etc. where possible.  Fairly certain the projector sees 3840x2160 for almost all content. 

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49 minutes ago, xPLAYRZx said:

Not sure on the specifics for each device, but output would be maxed on all of them, so 4K, 12bit, etc. where possible.  Fairly certain the projector sees 3840x2160 for almost all content. 

 

I suggest  setting the outputs  to source direct if possible. You will find that the Sony projector's upscaling of non-4k material is superior to  those of the source devices.  I have done this and get better results.  Apple TV 4K has no source direct option but I  change the output resolution manually for 1080P material and the improvement through the projector doing the scaling is immediately noticeable. 

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2 hours ago, xPLAYRZx said:

Not sure on the specifics for each device, but output would be maxed on all of them, so 4K, 12bit, etc. where possible.  Fairly certain the projector sees 3840x2160 for almost all content. 

Interesting. I tried that but decided on ‘Source Direct’ output from my Oppo 205, so that 2k blue rays are sent to the Sony for upscaling there.

 

Some of those photos look amazing! Great work. I just saw a 760 on a massive 2.35:1 screen with an anamorphic lens and wasn’t blown away by it compared to my 590. Your Alita shots look stunning though. 
 

I’m trying to decide on a new screen so I’m comparing all my options. BTW - Circa $800 for calibration in Canberra. 

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I don't watch many standard blu rays anymore (probably should), mainly UHD, so never really bothered looking/changing settings for upscaling on the Pana.  Will certainly review them now that it's mentioned.

 

I haven't personally seen a 590, but is probably 9/10 of the 790 performance.  If the out of the box colour in Reference mode is similar/same as the 790, I don't know if there's $800 worth of improvement to be had.  Personally I'll be holding off on a calibration. With a few minor tweaks to grayscale using the menus, I'm more than happy with the picture.  Perhaps if I ever go down the road of a Lumagen or similar in the future, then I'll look at getting everything calibrated.

 

What size/ratio screens do you have shortlisted?

Edited by xPLAYRZx
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Well this is a huge consideration for me. I’d love to know what others think. 
 

my issue (not really a big problem as I absolutely love them) is that my main speakers are so huge that I have to project into the gap between them. 
 

The right speaker is just about as far right as it can go due to the door to my theatre being there. The left can move a few CM I suppose. Then I can *just* fit a 110” 16x9 screen. Up from my current Screen Technics 100” 

632755FE-90FF-44F5-BC8B-F19DE51866EF.jpeg

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I suppose now with my magnificent 590 I’ll have to move the i93s elsewhere and get 2 Krix in wall speakers and a 120” acoustically transparent screen. This is the logical step I suppose. 
 

I specifically went in to my local serious hi fi store today to see the new screen technics material (I may get a grey screen?) and the electronic masking in action but really was not impressed at all. 
 

what do serious enthusiasts here do? Obviously almost all my material is 2.35:1 but my favorite discs have some 70mm content in them (like Dark Knight for example) and I can’t imagine compromising on that dramatic effect of It switching to 16x9 several times during the film.

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Sorry that was an old photo with my 10” subs. I now have 2x 15” Rythmik subs and 4x 10” at the rear.

 

these are the Krix in walls that match my Epicentrix centre speaker

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21 minutes ago, Sinewave said:

move the i93s elsewhere and get 2 Krix in wall speakers and a 120” acoustically transparent screen. This is the logical step I suppose. 

I think this makes the most sense.  I couldn't comment on the performance of transparent screens as I've never owned one but I'm sure there must be some quality options out there. Ratio's are personal preference, for me it has to be 16:9 for gaming.  If you go to a 120" you'll still have a good amount of real estate for 2.35:1 material.

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16 minutes ago, Sinewave said:

what do serious enthusiasts here do? Obviously almost all my material is 2.35:1 but my favorite discs have some 70mm content in them (like Dark Knight for example) and I can’t imagine compromising on that dramatic effect of It switching to 16x9 several times during the film.

I went with a 140” 2.35:1  screen from Oztheatre.  I previously had a 110” 16x9 screen which was easily big enough for 16x9 material.  The 140” CinemaScope screen does 16x9  material at roughly the same size as before (slightly larger), but  CinemaScope material is  gloriously projected onto the big screen without compromise.  I would guess that the  full 2.35:1 image on the 140” screen would be double the size of that on the 16x9   110” screen , and 16x9 material is about the same. There is definitely a lot of. Wow factor in a big CinemaScope screen

In your  room, I would look to put in the biggest cine screen possible but you would need to do something about the tower speakers.  I think you would get equally good audio results with top notch stand mounts just below the screen , each augmented. by a  subwoofer ( not LFE)

 

The only other alternative  to a smaller screen ( which I suspect you will outgrow) is  an Acoustically transparent screen with speakers behind 

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This article is what alerted me to it. It is an excerpt of the review of the Sony 760ES/885ES by Widescreen Review in June 2018, in which acoustically transparent screens are discussed.

 

"the 885ES images were very impressive indeed. They remained impressive  on different projection screen materials also. The woven (not punched) acoustically transparent Enlightor Neo screen material from Seymour-Screen Excellence revealed the supremely sharp images as well as subtle changes in luminance/shading that make images seem highly natural looking as well. Something I didn’t expect was sharpness to be as obvious with a woven screen compared to a solid-coated screen material. It is worth re-mentioning, that the SMPTE’s testing of perforated cinema projection screens revealed that the additional resolution of 4K images was not visible to the audience when projected onto perforated projection screens as used in most cinemas around the world. So anyone wishing to use an acoustically transparent projection screen with any “real” 4K or UHD projector needs to select  the material for the screen very carefully so they are able to “see” the resolution these projectors can deliver to screens capable of delivering that resolution to your eyes."

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Update my HDR score to a 8/10 for the 790.  Watched a few more movies (Aquaman, Bad Boys for Life) and yeah..... it's good, surprisingly good.  I really don't have high expectations for HDR content but the 790 is slowly changing my mind.

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2 hours ago, xPLAYRZx said:

Update my HDR score to a 8/10 for the 790.  Watched a few more movies (Aquaman, Bad Boys for Life) and yeah..... it's good, surprisingly good.  I really don't have high expectations for HDR content but the 790 is slowly changing my mind.

I have noticed that movies mastered in 4K give better results  than those  that use 2K masters.    ( The 2 movies you mentioned above are 2K masters).  However, since CGI is  usually done in 2k,  movies with a lot of CGI would look a bit weird  with 4K masters because they would make the CGI look even more fake.

 

Try Planet Earth 2  ( Disc) and the new streaming show from Apple TV+  "Tiny World".   They should set a benchmark for what is achievable from 4K HDR.  There are a number of movies that are mastered in 4K  as well as re-mastered old movies with 4K transfers.  One such movie, Hunt for Red October was dreadful on  bluray but the remastered 4K /HDR transfer is definitely worth watching.

 

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