Which NAS and associated software for streaming server and file storage?

[barbz127]

Seconding the APS Smart UPS - I bought a second hand 1500va unit, replaced the batteries and added a $100 management card.

 

Runs the modem, 2 x NAS, wireless, etc for 45 minutes before a controlled shutdown.

 

The only downside is power issues tend to happen at 2am in the morning so I have found myself having to come in and shut things down when the power goes bad (last week mains dropped from 240v down to 170v for 4 hours) just to shut the beeping up.

 

[Guest rmpfyf]

On 21/08/2020 at 10:18 AM, barbz127 said:

Seconding the APS Smart UPS - I bought a second hand 1500va unit, replaced the batteries and added a $100 management card.

 

Runs the modem, 2 x NAS, wireless, etc for 45 minutes before a controlled shutdown.

 

The only downside is power issues tend to happen at 2am in the morning so I have found myself having to come in and shut things down when the power goes bad (last week mains dropped from 240v down to 170v for 4 hours) just to shut the beeping up.

 

Beeping should be configurable?

[mjs]

I had a CyberPower UPS for some time that was good over a long time, however the battery was eventually on the way out and the damn thing would start beeping at odd times as a fault notification. Replacement  batteries didn't seem to be able to be available, so I replaced it with an Eaton 5S, seems ok. 

[gwurb]

I used to have a 4 bay QNAP. It was fine. I found that it needed a bit of technical know how. I was running it as RAID 6. Then something failed on the RAID and the system wouldn't repair itself. The drives themselves were fine. I spent multiple sessions with QNAP support. They had to remote into the device. It all left me with little faith in their system. I changed to FreeNAS and used the same drives. This was 4 or so years ago. All the drives have continued to work on FreeNAS. Maybe QNAP implementation reliability has improved? 

 

At the same time I've used Synology routers for about 5 years and their software is so much simpler to use! I don't know if you would get a weird failure on Synology system, but right now I would have more trust in Synology over QNAP. 

 

I found that with QNAP ram and CPU were always under utilised. I tried running extra services. The simpler ones didn't use a lot of resources. The more complex like virtual machines were terribly slow on the model that I had. To go to a model that had good virtualisation support was going to be expensive, and I came to a conclusion that it's best to leave the NAS to be a file storage and have a separate machine for other things. 
 

Mirror is fine. An alternative would be RAID6 with 4+ drives. For really simple needs Mirror+backup is probably sufficient.

 

I prefer WD Red Pro (skip the non Pro) or WD Ultrastar. Backblaze Seagate data makes me place WD ahead of Seagate. 
 

I've had Cyberpower PFC Sinewave for about 5 years. If that was to completely fail (more than a battery replacement) then I would look at Cyberpower or APC.

 

I use MusicBrainz Picard for tagging.

[gregmacc]

1 hour ago, gwurb said:

I used to have a 4 bay QNAP. It was fine. I found that it needed a bit of technical know how. I was running it as RAID 6. Then something failed on the RAID and the system wouldn't repair itself. The drives themselves were fine. I spent multiple sessions with QNAP support. They had to remote into the device. It all left me with little faith in their system. I changed to FreeNAS and used the same drives. This was 4 or so years ago. All the drives have continued to work on FreeNAS. Maybe QNAP implementation reliability has improved? 

 

At the same time I've used Synology routers for about 5 years and their software is so much simpler to use! I don't know if you would get a weird failure on Synology system, but right now I would have more trust in Synology over QNAP. 

 

I found that with QNAP ram and CPU were always under utilised. I tried running extra services. The simpler ones didn't use a lot of resources. The more complex like virtual machines were terribly slow on the model that I had. To go to a model that had good virtualisation support was going to be expensive, and I came to a conclusion that it's best to leave the NAS to be a file storage and have a separate machine for other things. 
 

Mirror is fine. An alternative would be RAID6 with 4+ drives. For really simple needs Mirror+backup is probably sufficient.

 

I prefer WD Red Pro (skip the non Pro) or WD Ultrastar. Backblaze Seagate data makes me place WD ahead of Seagate. 
 

I've had Cyberpower PFC Sinewave for about 5 years. If that was to completely fail (more than a battery replacement) then I would look at Cyberpower or APC.

 

I use MusicBrainz Picard for tagging.

Thanks gwurb ... It's not the first time I've heard that Synology's software is more "intuitive" than QNAP's. The majority of the responders to this thread seem to favour Synology ... not that that proves anything ... just an observation.

I'm very keen to keep things as simple as possible. All I need (think I need) is hard wired network connectivity via the router to my desktop PC, X2 televisions and network streamer (all in separate rooms) ... with some sort of storage/server/backup provision (2 bay NAS with mirror + backup ?). My photo and music file libraries are not large and are not growing at a rapid rate, and I have a few hundred important documents and ebooks. I  don't store videos ... they get downloaded, played and then deleted. We binge-watch streamed TV  and to be honest Chrome casting does us just fine for that. I suppose It would be handy to stream TV via the network when it is all finally set -up. I have only the vaughest idea of what virtual machines and Plex are and doubt that I will ever need them. Roon is a possibility but again not very likely at this stage. I can see how UPS would take some system integrity anxieties away from the whole deal.

 

 

[Westsurf]

Synology 918+ user here with approx 12 Tb of music and films. The system is set up with SSD caching to allow for faster database access. 
 

Roon and Plex both installed on the Synology using a Oppo 203 as endpoint for everything. Performs effectively flawlessly. 
 

Roon is installed on an external USB3 SSD drive Attached to the NAS for speed. I have noticed though that memory usage by Roon is reasonable high constantly.  As such,  I’d consider is increasing the RAM from the base 4Gb. However, as I’m thinking of moving Roon onto an Intel NUC for direct USB to a DAC I’ll probably focus on that. Just need to get a DAC better than the Oppo. 

Edited August 23, 2020 by westsurf

[Demondes]

On 20/08/2020 at 6:17 PM, oots said:

I have a 2 bay Synology that's about 5 years old,hasn't skipped a beat.It's been on 24/7 all that time,but what I'm most impressed with is the support from Synology. I still get emails and notifications regarding OS updates after all this time. Synology don't seem to have the same degree of so-called "planned obsolescence" that many manufacturers have adopted,and for me this speaks volumes. One very happy customer!!

I am a long time fan of Synology 10 years and 5 Synology’s 

currently have a DS918+ 4 bay (with m2 cache) and an older DS1515 5 bay as backup, auto syncing when both are on.

 

if you were just starting out and didn’t have a huge amount of video and audio files a 2 bay NAS could be enough.   Just remember to get redundancy on a 2 disk NAS you would lose 1/2 disk space if mirroring 2 drives or you could go JBOD and have no redundancy.   so you definitely would need a second copy of any files you didn’t want to lose.  This could be a simple external USB HDD plugged into the Synology.

 

there is a rare chance that any NAS has a failure at the RAID controller level and you lose all your data if you don’t have a second copy on some other disk or device.
 

 

 

 

[Demondes]

2 minutes ago, westsurf said:

Synology 918+ user here with approx 12 Tb of music and films. The system is set up with SSD caching to allow for faster database access. 
 

Roon and Plex both installed on the Synology using a Oppo 203 as endpoint for everything. Performs effectively flawlessly. 
 

Roon is installed on an external USB3 SSD drive Attached to the NAS for speed. I have noticed though that memory usage by Roon is reasonable high constantly.  As such,  I’d consider is increasing the RAM from the base 4Gb. However, as I’m thinking of moving Roon onto an Intel NUC for direct USB to a DAC I’ll probably focus on that. Just need to get a DAC better than the Oppo. 

Roon will run on DS918, but the library should be on an SSD, otherwise I find it will just stop now and then.  I had to increase the RAM to 8gb and had 2 M2 drives as read write cache but still had the library running on HDD and there were occasional hiccups. With 275000 files (mostly Flac) the library DB is big and then you can add in links to Qobuz or Tidal albums you like.

 

I ended up with an old Mac Mini running Roon headless sitting on top of the Synology in a spare room, with all the music on the DS918.  The connection to the music system in other room is via Ethernet.

 

 

[Demondes]

14 minutes ago, westsurf said:

Synology 918+ user here with approx 12 Tb of music and films. The system is set up with SSD caching to allow for faster database access. 
 

Roon and Plex both installed on the Synology using a Oppo 203 as endpoint for everything. Performs effectively flawlessly. 
 

Roon is installed on an external USB3 SSD drive Attached to the NAS for speed. I have noticed though that memory usage by Roon is reasonable high constantly.  As such,  I’d consider is increasing the RAM from the base 4Gb. However, as I’m thinking of moving Roon onto an Intel NUC for direct USB to a DAC I’ll probably focus on that. Just need to get a DAC better than the Oppo. 

Yes this method works well, otherwise you could reserve 1 internal drive slot for ROON to run on a 1 disk SSD volume, but you lose some redundancy with only 3 drive HDD volume for the music files.
 

yep Roon is a memory hog.  Synology likes 8Gb and the old 2010 Macmini in my case likes 16Gb otherwise it hits the limit at 8Gb

Edited August 23, 2020 by Demondes

[Westsurf]

7 minutes ago, Demondes said:

Roon will run on DS918, but the library should be on an SSD, otherwise I find it will just stop now and then.  I had to increase the RAM to 8gb and had 2 M2 drives as read write cache but still had the library running on HDD and there were occasional hiccups. With 275000 files (mostly Flac) the library DB is big and then you can add in links to Qobuz or Tidal albums you like.

 

I ended up with an old Mac Mini running Roon headless sitting on top of the Synology in a spare room, with all the music on the DS918.  The connection to the music system in other room is via Ethernet.

 

 

The database is on an SSD ... shared folder mounted exclusively on an external USB3 SSD.. you are correct though that the occasional hiccups occur. Not often but just enough to be annoying. 
 

I have too much material to consider losing an internal drive on a cost basis of replacing say 4Tb drives with three 6TB or greater drives. Let alone the rebuild time to accomplish the transition. 
 

The best solution is to move Roon to a headless NUC which will, eventually, also fulfil direct USB Audio to DAC. 

Edited August 23, 2020 by westsurf

[Guest rmpfyf]

4 hours ago, gwurb said:

Backblaze Seagate data makes me place WD ahead of Seagate. 

 

You're missing out on something good - the current Seagate Ironwolf drives are generally excellent, and have been replacing my WD's as they come out of service. There's an extended data set that comes out of the Ironwolf's when plugged into a Synology NAS; works quite well. Goes considerably deeper than the usual SMART metrics.

[mjs]

Just a bit more info on my earlier post where I said I had a 4-bay Syno, it’s a DS918+ with 4 x 6 TB Seagate Ironwolf HDD. I have RoonServer on an external SSD drive to avoid another box being on 24/7. Works ok, but tbh, I also use RoonServer on a Mac Mini which has a bit more grunt. 

[jamesrc]

I am running a Synology DS715 with 2 x 12Gb Red drives.  It also stores Time Machine backups and all my photos. It has been pretty much bullet-proof.  I run Roon on a separate server.  (In the background on the right)

 

Negatives.:

I am really not convinced that you could ( or should) try to run Roon on this device. It seems that people just get into strife with underspeccing the hardware for Roon.  I think you need to commit

Synology seems incapable of working automatically with Roon to update the data base if you add new music.  You have to manually rescan the disk.  Very quick, but it is just one more step. The QNAP seems to be more seamless.

[gregmacc]

14 minutes ago, jamesrc said:

The QNAP seems to be more seamless.

... so you run a QNAP NAS? ... in another system perhaps? ... or is that the separate server in the background you refer to?  

[jamesrc]

13 minutes ago, gregmacc said:

... so you run a QNAP NAS? ... in another system perhaps? ... or is that the separate server in the background you refer to?  

Shoddy work on my part. 

 

I meant to say, that by repute the QNAP relationship with Roon is more seamless. 

 

I love the Synology interface and can live with having to find the button to rescan the database in the Roon software.  I hope that is clearer

[gregmacc]

1 minute ago, jamesrc said:

Shoddy work on my part. 

 

I meant to say, that by repute the QNAP relationship with Roon is more seamless. 

 

I love the Synology interface and can live with having to find the button to rescan the database in the Roon software.  I hope that is clearer

 ... thanks ... all good 

[mjs]

Yeah, I seem to have to force a rescan on the NAS files as well, bit of a nuisance

[Guest rmpfyf]

5 hours ago, jamesrc said:

I am running a Synology DS715 with 2 x 12Gb Red drives.  It also stores Time Machine backups and all my photos. It has been pretty much bullet-proof.  I run Roon on a separate server.  (In the background on the right)

 

Negatives.:

I am really not convinced that you could ( or should) try to run Roon on this device. It seems that people just get into strife with underspeccing the hardware for Roon.  I think you need to commit

Synology seems incapable of working automatically with Roon to update the data base if you add new music.  You have to manually rescan the disk.  Very quick, but it is just one more step. The QNAP seems to be more seamless.

Nice to see another Mikrotik user

[DavoTheGreat]

I've used several Synology models over the years, all have been very reliable. Mine runs Plex server in a Docker container for my music, TV shows and movie collection, which we mostly access via an Apple TV. It's reliable and Wifey never complains so that's three big ticks for me.

 

One note about hard drives - be careful what you choose depending on where you intend on housing your NAS. I used to run 2x 8TB Seagate Ironwolf drives, never had a fault but they're really noisy... and since I use my NAS for surveillance as well as Plex, the grinding 24x7 was too much. Recently swapped out those drives for 3x of the new generation 6TB Ironwolf drives instead and they're much quieter. I don't notice any performance difference - both options easily read and write at full rate Gigabit and I don't have a need for 10Gbps to care what happens beyond that.

 

Also, USB backup HDDs are great but only if you have two that you regularly cycle and keep one well away from the NAS (like at a relative's house - Hyper Backup supports encryption). If your USB backup HDD is connected to your NAS and you suffer a power spike or some other damage, you can kiss it goodbye too. I also use BackBlaze in write only mode for my photos as an extra layer, just in case. It's cheaper than most other Cloud storage options.

[jeffhk]

Another vote for Synology with Minimserver. My first Synology NAS was still going strong after 7 years, never missed a beat, then I decided to upgrade to a newer model, no problems with that so far either. Also another vote for Seagate Ironwolf drives, they have good monitoring features via the Synology software and reliability has been good for me.

[WINEDS]

 

[MattyW]

Building myself a new NAS soon too. I'm just waiting on quite a few parts direct from China. Overall cost is 1.5k so the same as one of the better Synology NAS but with a whole lot more processing power for Docker and virtual machines where necessary.

 

8 core 16 thread AMD Ryzen 7 1700 Pro

32GB RAM, 3x 4TB 3.5" Toshiba 7200RPM NAS  drives, 1TB M2 SSD for caching

8x 2.5" Hotswap bay case + 500W 80+ Gold PSU

 

Going to use UnRAID on it.... With some luck I'll get Roon server, Plex server and VyOS or Vyatta running in Docker containers. VyOS or Vyatta should be fine for use as a combined Firewall, Proxy server + web content filtering.

 

I just hope I can figure it out. I've never used Docker before. It has the potential to be the most useful bit of kit I've ever run in my home if I can get my head around it.

Edited September 15, 2020 by MattyW

[todagt]

2 hours ago, MattyW said:

Building myself a new NAS soon too. I'm just waiting on quite a few parts direct from China. Overall cost is 1.5k so the same as one of the better Synology NAS but with a whole lot more processing power for Docker and virtual machines where necessary.

 

8 core 16 thread AMD Ryzen 7 1700 Pro

32GB RAM, 3x 4TB 3.5" Toshiba 7200RPM NAS  drives, 1TB M2 SSD for caching

8x 2.5" Hotswap bay case + 500W 80+ Gold PSU

 

Going to use UnRAID on it.... With some luck I'll get Roon server, Plex server and VyOS or Vyatta running in Docker containers. VyOS or Vyatta should be fine for use as a combined Firewall, Proxy server + web content filtering.

 

I just hope I can figure it out. I've never used Docker before. It has the potential to be the most useful bit of kit I've ever run in my home if I can get my head around it.

I just went a similar route myself.

Although after a fair bit of testing and consideration I opted for FreeNAS (soon to be TrueNAS core) as the OS mainly for native the ZFS.

I was also concerned with relying on just a USB stick to store the OS for the UnRaid solution.

Tomorrows job is to try and get a roon server working on it.

Plex is up and running sweet tho

Edited September 15, 2020 by todagt

[MattyW]

29 minutes ago, todagt said:

I just went a similar route myself.

Although after a fair bit of testing and consideration I opted for FreeNAS (soon to be TrueNAS core) as the OS mainly for native the ZFS.

I was also concerned with relying on just a USB stick to store the OS for the UnRaid solution.

Tomorrows job is to try and get a room server working on it.

Plex is up and running sweet tho

Interesting....  So UnRAID runs off a USB stick?  I might get a small M2 SSD and use in an external case... Or better yet mount it internally running off an motherboard USB header.

[todagt]

Now there's an idea, still, I will revisit UnRaid once ZFS is supported natively.