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Posted (edited)

Howdy,

 

I'm scratching around looking for some new sub-woofers for my movie room (no 2 channel duties).  I've got a couple on the list, but they're both overseas, so would like to look at more accessible options.  Also, if anyone has any experience in dealing with the two companies I'll mention, let me know.

 

What I'm after -

 

  • 2 of the same model.  It's okay if one is a slave, providing it will be driven to full capacity (I doubt this is a common option with manufacturers though);   
  • 18" drivers;
  • Budget $8,000 for both;
  • Max. height 83cm each.

 

What I haven't got my head around yet -

 

  • Do they all come with DSP?  (My current one doesn't, but it's a cheapie);
  • Is there an external unit that can handle DSP and, if so, is this a better option?

 

I'll be using a Marantz 7705 processor.  I've had the room measured by Red Spade Audio and have identified that the best result will be with two units in specific locations.

 

I'm currently looking at -

 

 

Edited by Kaynin

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hi kaynin.... re seatons... you'd be easier getting one from the moon :D 

 

JTRs are beasts ! what sort of room have you got planned ? 

 

I would very seriously look at couple of local options. krix definitely look at that ... for a dedicated room I personal think they can mix it with anything ...

 

other one have you considered at all osborne ? they are quite awesome... be custom made to fit any setting and he uses the top quality focal drivers and quality amps... so local support is not an issue. 

 

I last experienced twins of these in a home theatre and were superb for the money.... 

 

ps just as a point.... if 2nd is a slave ... you dont want it exactly same size and capability as idea of a slave is to counter the main... and if exactly same and working to counter they can actually defeat and work against each other... id be trying to work in unison instead :) 

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Posted (edited)
43 minutes ago, betty boop said:

hi kaynin.... re seatons... you'd be easier getting one from the moon :D 

 

JTRs are beasts ! what sort of room have you got planned ? 

 

I would very seriously look at couple of local options. krix definitely look at that ... for a dedicated room I personal think they can mix it with anything ...

 

other one have you considered at all osborne ? they are quite awesome... be custom made to fit any setting and he uses the top quality focal drivers and quality amps... so local support is not an issue. 

 

I last experienced twins of these in a home theatre and were superb for the money.... 

 

ps just as a point.... if 2nd is a slave ... you dont want it exactly same size and capability as idea of a slave is to counter the main... and if exactly same and working to counter they can actually defeat and work against each other... id be trying to work in unison instead :) 

 

Yeah this is what I've heard about Seatons.  I shot off an email a few days ago and haven't heard back...

 

JTR look good on paper, but I've never heard any.  I'll send an email and see what initial contact is like, including leadtimes.

 

The room is already established as movies only, no 2 channel.  3.8m (W) x 5m (L) x 9' ceilings.  LP is 4m from subbies.

 

Yeah good idea with Krix.  I associate them with HT but didn't even cross my mind!  I've check out their website.

 

Yep Osborn is on the list, but I don't think he uses an 18" driver.  I have a T12 which will be moved on soon, so am familiar with what they can do.  Certainly awesome drivers and Redgum amps do the job, plus great cabinets.  I'm not sure if they come with DSP.

 

 

Re: slave comments - okay I don't think I understand the concept now!  If the slave is the same size/capability, but in a different location in the room, wouldn't that be able to counter a room issue?  Of note, I have one seating position that experiences a drop in db, so a second subbie in a different position has been identified to address that issue.  I was thinking a slave would achieve that?

Edited by Kaynin
Ceiling height.

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Peter at DeepHz has the PSA V1800 on run-out special @ $1850 - don't let the price fool you, these are serious stuff. Not sure if PSA in the US will supply some of their really serious stuff direct if you want insane slam. I understand Peter is not expecting new PSA stock anytime soon. Note PSA is run by one of the founders of SVS.

 

JTR are great, but shipping back for warranty would be $$$

 

There's no way I'd recommend Seaton gear - great when working, but support is problematic at best, non-existent at worst.

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Posted (edited)

beat me to it.. peter is very genuine and wont give you any B.S.

 

do krix do 18" hmm not sure.

 

your room is  just under 1500 square feet so only a mid sized room.

Edited by hopefullguy

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Should have added that the AV7705's Audyssey XT32 does a great job of dual sub integration - don't think you need separate DSP when not integrating into a stereo system.

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8 minutes ago, Quark said:

Peter at DeepHz has the PSA V1800 on run-out special @ $1850 - don't let the price fool you, these are serious stuff. Not sure if PSA in the US will supply some of their really serious stuff direct if you want insane slam. I understand Peter is not expecting new PSA stock anytime soon. Note PSA is run by one of the founders of SVS.

 

JTR are great, but shipping back for warranty would be $$$

 

There's no way I'd recommend Seaton gear - great when working, but support is problematic at best, non-existent at worst.

 

Thanks Quarky.

 

I've had a look at the DeepHz website and saw those PSA's on special.  I haven't heard of them, and to be honest, judged them by price.  I might make a call to Peter and pick his brains.  

 

Yeah I'd be prepared to pull the trigger on JTR, but without local dealership I become wary.  This is why I'm keen to seek out local options that have dealership support.  I'll contact them and see what they say.

 

Thanks for the comments re: Seaton, I think that's enough to turn me off.  Pity, it looks like nice gear...

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2 minutes ago, Kaynin said:

The room is already established as movies only, no 2 channel.  3.8m (W) x 5m (L) x 7" ceilings.  LP is 4m from subbies.

a good sized room, but not something i necessarily think HAVE to have 18"ers kaynin. I also wouldn't lock into driver size. many drivers can be smaller and just as or more capable depending on type and how utilised.

 

given room size.... I wouldn't be going all out for output. instead for depth & control. in my setup honestly one 15" is quite good enough for both...

 

5 minutes ago, Kaynin said:

Yeah good idea with Krix.  I associate them with HT but didn't even cross my mind!  I've check out their website.

 

yeah local option... must consider...if i was doing a dedicated movie room be no 1 contender :) 

 

6 minutes ago, Kaynin said:

Yep Osborn is on the list, but I don't think he uses an 18" driver.  I have a T12 which will be moved on soon, so am familiar with what they can do.  Certainly awesome drivers and Redgum amps do the job, plus great cabinets.  I'm not sure if they come with DSP.

dont get caught in the 18" trap.... the T16 are a good thing but he has a step up in the monumental subwoofer. the setup ive Experienced is with two of those ... fantastic .... measured very well in room too...

 

you dont need DSP... leave that to the av processor to dial both in and use something like audyssey xt32 with proper dual sub measuring setup and eq and will dial them both in a treat !

 

9 minutes ago, Kaynin said:

Re: slave comments - okay I don't think I understand the concept now!  If the slave is the same size/capability, but in a different location in the room, wouldn't that be able to counter a room issue?  Of note, I have one seating position that experiences a drop in db, so a second subbie in a different position has been identified to address that issue.  I was thinking a slave would achieve that?

this is a more tricker thing than commonly understood... the ideal setup is front back with dual subs.... but how many people manage this...  and in this setup you dont want two identical instead id go eg an 18" up front or even 16" id probably use your existing T12 down back.... depends really so  much on room and positioning...so really hard to say... unfortunately a null if room related is not going to be fixed by subs... eg if sitting middle of room and there is  null can add as many subs as want you are still going to get a null in the middle of the room... 

 

in a room size you have ... i myself would suggest keeping the T12... and get one really good sub as the main one... use audyssey to dial in both and you should get a great result....

 

 

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10 minutes ago, hopefullguy said:

beat me to it.. peter is very genuine and wont give you any B.S.

 

do krix do 18" hmm not sure.

 

your room is  just under 1500 square feet so only a mid sized room.

 

A second vote for Peter, that's good to see.  

 

I'll have a look at the Krix website and see what they have to offer, I haven't even ventured there yet...although I do remember their HT set-up at the SN show a year or two ago...wow!

 

Yep, mid-sized room.

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Just now, Kaynin said:

Yeah I'd be prepared to pull the trigger on JTR, but without local dealership I become wary.  This is why I'm keen to seek out local options that have dealership support.  I'll contact them and see what they say.

id pass on that ...just for that reason....

 

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1 minute ago, Kaynin said:

 

Thanks Quarky.

 

I've had a look at the DeepHz website and saw those PSA's on special.  I haven't heard of them, and to be honest, judged them by price.  I might make a call to Peter and pick his brains.  

 

Yeah I'd be prepared to pull the trigger on JTR, but without local dealership I become wary.  This is why I'm keen to seek out local options that have dealership support.  I'll contact them and see what they say.

 

Thanks for the comments re: Seaton, I think that's enough to turn me off.  Pity, it looks like nice gear...

I'm running a couple of smaller PSA S1500s in a slightly larger room - you're welcome to come around for a demo.

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6 minutes ago, Quark said:

I'm running a couple of smaller PSA S1500s in a slightly larger room - you're welcome to come around for a demo.

definitely well worth doing, quark has a really nice room and get a good chance to experience these :) 

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5 minutes ago, Quark said:

Should have added that the AV7705's Audyssey XT32 does a great job of dual sub integration - don't think you need separate DSP when not integrating into a stereo system.

 

Ahhh, makes sense.  Thanks, great advice.

 

I haven't checked on the 7705 capability yet, but I hope to using my Audyssey pro cal kit.  I'd expect it will be compliant.

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1 minute ago, Kaynin said:

 

Ahhh, makes sense.  Thanks, great advice.

 

I haven't checked on the 7705 capability yet, but I hope to using my Audyssey pro cal kit.  I'd expect it will be compliant.

pretty sure 7705 moved to the app only like 8805, but i think its still xt32 and with good dual sub capability :) 

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@Quark  @betty boop  @hopefullguy

 

sorry, 9' ceiling, not 7 - still mid-sized of course...

 

 

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15 minutes ago, betty boop said:

a good sized room, but not something i necessarily think HAVE to have 18"ers kaynin. I also wouldn't lock into driver size. many drivers can be smaller and just as or more capable depending on type and how utilised.

 

given room size.... I wouldn't be going all out for output. instead for depth & control. in my setup honestly one 15" is quite good enough for both...

 

 

yeah local option... must consider...if i was doing a dedicated movie room be no 1 contender :) 

 

dont get caught in the 18" trap.... the T16 are a good thing but he has a step up in the monumental subwoofer. the setup ive Experienced is with two of those ... fantastic .... measured very well in room too...

 

you dont need DSP... leave that to the av processor to dial both in and use something like audyssey xt32 with proper dual sub measuring setup and eq and will dial them both in a treat !

 

this is a more tricker thing than commonly understood... the ideal setup is front back with dual subs.... but how many people manage this...  and in this setup you dont want two identical instead id go eg an 18" up front or even 16" id probably use your existing T12 down back.... depends really so  much on room and positioning...so really hard to say... unfortunately a null if room related is not going to be fixed by subs... eg if sitting middle of room and there is  null can add as many subs as want you are still going to get a null in the middle of the room... 

 

in a room size you have ... i myself would suggest keeping the T12... and get one really good sub as the main one... use audyssey to dial in both and you should get a great result....

 

 

 

Thanks mate, excellent.  

 

Okay, negotiable on the 18" drivers...no smaller than 16" though  😬

 

Good to know DSP not required...

 

Paul from RSA ran some sweeps and we identified the best results for 4x seating positions was two subbies at the front sound stage, one next to the left channel and one next to the right (same as your set-up).  It was identified that the - best - set-up was one up the front and one at the rear, but only measured best for 2 seats.  Bearing in mind my seating isn't dead centre in the room.  I don't think that's practical, so best option for 4 seats measured was two up the front at the L & R sides.

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21 minutes ago, betty boop said:

id pass on that ...just for that reason....

 

 

Yeah, true, not worth the heartache.  

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Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Quark said:

I'm running a couple of smaller PSA S1500s in a slightly larger room - you're welcome to come around for a demo.

 

That would be awesome, it would give me some real world perspective instead of specs on a data sheet.  I'll shoot you a PM.

Edited by Kaynin

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6 hours ago, hopefullguy said:

do krix do 18" hmm not sure.

 

 

Their Volcanix is 12"...doesn't really excite me...

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if 18" does it for you dont settle for less or you will have regrets of not trying.

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I'm over to Quark's tomorrow, which will give some needed perspective...

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Maybe look at the higher end Paradigm models?  Fantastic quality product with good local support.  Their top flight 15 inch models kick serious butt for HT in my experience.  Not sure if will fit in your budget though...

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3 minutes ago, POV said:

Maybe look at the higher end Paradigm models?  Fantastic quality product with good local support.  Their top flight 15 inch models kick serious butt for HT in my experience.  Not sure if will fit in your budget though...

id second this ... paradigm subs are superb they are very much in the clean, clear controlled and go low. they are amazingly well made and finished as well...

 

again two by 15s is something be very suitable given room size. 

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3 hours ago, Kaynin said:

 

Their Volcanix is 12"...doesn't really excite me...

 

I was more thinking their cyclonix :D right on budget for a couple ....

 

https://www.krix.com.au/cyclonix-active/

 

Cyclonix-Active_V2-500x500.jpg

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