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Now that hard drive storage is dirt cheap, I'm converting...


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I've been putting off going "further digital" for many years now since I quite like the act of spinning silver discs.  However, as I said in the title since hard drive space is now so cheap I decided to give it a try so I bought a little 4 Terabite usb hard drive and started ripping.  I have little to no interest in streaming services like Tidal or Spotify so I was really only interested in ripping the wav files from the cds and storing them on my little yellow hard drive.

IMG_1189.thumb.JPG.990cd0c4a58bb482df9990cb18d27aaa.JPG

 

I must admit I was a bit surprised to find out just how much space I had left once I was done with my 4 nights and 3 days of near-constant ripping.  I have about 450 cds (not a big collection I know) and I found that I could fit them all on to the 4 terabite hard drive with more than 3.5 Terabites worth of space left over.   Ah technology, how you've improved.

 

So all of these,

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Plus another 90 or so that were still sitting in the 'to be ripped' pile at the time of picture taking, fit on the little yellow block of plastic in the first pic.  And a whole lot more besides.

Nice!  Efficient!  Lazy! 

 

I like all of these things.

 

Actually I wasn't completely honest above, a big part of the reason I started this line of action was my owning of an Oppo 205, which is more than happy reading any usb sticks and hard drives plugged into it.  So now I can just plug my little yellow hard drive in to the Oppo and leave it there.  Quick, easy (and more importantly lazy) access to all my albums without moving from the comfort of my chair.  I should have known this hobby would get worse for me with time. 

 

Oh well, it was bound to happen eventually.

 

Here's to getting fatter quicker while listening to music.

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I've been putting off going "further digital" for many years now since I quite like the act of spinning silver discs.  However, as I said in the title since hard drive space is now so cheap I decided

Don’t forget to buy another HDD drive and backup your days of work.    

Flac are smaller, so copy quicker over connections and you can fit more on a given size media. But the biggest one is that they have extensive metadata tags. So song title, track number, artist, date,

Now, you could can upsample those files for extra digital fun if you were so incline to absolutely use the remaining space on that drive :) 

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6 minutes ago, jt301 said:

Don’t forget to buy another HDD drive and backup your days of work.

 

 

Yes this is essential

 

the other thing I would suggest is add Roon or similar.  Transformed the way I listen to things.

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13 minutes ago, jt301 said:

Don’t forget to buy another HDD drive and backup your days of work.

 

 

Or consider a small NAS which can also be a media server.

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1 hour ago, Cafad said:

so I was really only interested in ripping the wav files from the cds

 

I have done the same with all my silver discs.  I stored them as flac files.

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8 hours ago, jt301 said:

Don’t forget to buy another HDD drive and backup your days of work.

 

 

I do intend to, actually intended to have done already but forgot.  I think I'll buy a red one this time.

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If you have a iPad/tablet or even a phone, you can download the OPPO app that enables full control, it gives you all the controls that the remote does....and you can navigate alphabetically on the files loaded on the HDD....no need for CA and dedicated USB devices...    this is the beauty of the OPPO, what it does is access the files of the HDD and dumps it into the buffer, you see this happening if your HDD has a LED...   if you have it on the network it can also access files anywhere on the network provided you give access,  I can access my work laptop storage From the OPPO app and play any files from there.....   This is what I bought the OPPO105 for,  purely to access music via storage, it’s a shame that OPPO has cease going down this path, till this day no other manufacture has fully filled the vacuum when they pulled out.  

Edited by Addicted to music
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1 hour ago, Addicted to music said:

If you have a iPad/tablet or even a phone, you can download the OPPO app that enables full control, it gives you all the controls that the remote does....and you can navigate alphabetically on the files loaded on the HDD....no need for CA and dedicated USB devices...    this is the beauty of the OPPO, what it does is access the files of the HDD and dumps it into the buffer, you see this happening if your HDD has a LED...   if you have it on the network it can also access files anywhere on the network provided you give access,  I can access my work laptop storage From the OPPO app and play any files from there.....   This is what I bought the OPPO105 for,  purely to access music via storage, it’s a shame that OPPO has cease going down this path, till this day no other manufacture has fully filled the vacuum when they pulled out.  

This app is / was great.  I say was only because for some reason the BDP media control app is only on android for Oppo 1XX series and not for Oppo 2XX series.

I had the media control app on my iPhone approx a year or so ago, changed to an android phone, went to put it on my new phone and its only available for 103/105.   I am not sure why or why but for 203/205 it seems its an android/iPhone thing , when I googled it the UDP 2XX app is still there but I cant load it on my android phone tablet.

 

When I had my iPhone I found the app great for all you mentioned above but unless I am missing something or searching the playstore it seems for Oppo 2x series its not available. 

My work around now is having the Oppo hooked up to my home internet and accessing my files via the network function on the player.

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8 minutes ago, 08Boss302 said:

This app is / was great.  I say was only because for some reason the BDP media control app is only on android for Oppo 1XX series and not for Oppo 2XX series.

I had the media control app on my iPhone approx a year or so ago, changed to an android phone, went to put it on my new phone and its only available for 103/105.   I am not sure why or why but for 203/205 it seems its an android/iPhone thing , when I googled it the UDP 2XX app is still there but I cant load it on my android phone tablet.

 

When I had my iPhone I found the app great for all you mentioned above but unless I am missing something or searching the playstore it seems for Oppo 2x series its not available. 

My work around now is having the Oppo hooked up to my home internet and accessing my files via the network function on the player.

The Oppo 205 App for Android doesn't work. Gets completely stuffed displaying the menu list of albums. 

 

I still have it and was getting help from Oppo support but ran out of patience and reverted to an old iPhone as a whole of house remote. 

 

Maybe they got rid of it in the Play store.

 

Edit: Gone, no longer there. 

Edited by DrSK
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8 minutes ago, DrSK said:

The Oppo 205 App for Android doesn't work. Gets completely stuffed displaying the menu list of albums. 

 

I still have it and was getting help from Oppo support but ran out of patience and reverted to an old iPhone as a whole of house remote. 

 

Maybe they got rid of it in the Play store.

 

Edit: Gone, no longer there. 

I think they did. Not sure why they wouldnt invest a litte more into the 2XX series app for Android.  Shame really.  You can still get the 1XX series app in the play store though.

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15 minutes ago, Addicted to music said:

My apologies guys, I don’t have the 205, but that’s great to know that the 205 doesn’t work with android.

Not really, it's the first relevant reason I've been given to get an i-device yet. 

 

Bugger!

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21 minutes ago, Cafad said:

Not really, it's the first relevant reason I've been given to get an i-device yet. 

 

Bugger!

I see it as a reason not to buy Oppo, but I get like that :) 

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18 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

I see it as a reason not to buy Oppo, but I get like that :) 

I respect your moral stand sir, but I am afraid that I am not made of stuff as stern.  For the opportunity to select songs more quickly and sort through files more thoroughly I will swallow my pride and hand some of my hard earned to the big, bad, devotion-demanding beast that Apple has become.  

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18 minutes ago, Sonichifi said:

@Cafad What program do you use to bring your CD's to flac?

I know it wasn't directed at me, but I use Exact Audio Copy, and sometimes even just Asunder (on linux)

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Well done @Cafad. While I would like to think it was visionary thinking on my part the sad truth is I ripped my CDs many years ago after my kids got into my CD collection. They were unusually quiet, and when I did eventually find them they were rolling CDs across the back cement patio and using them like ice skates and frizbee. Luckily some time before  I had packed my vinyl collection safely away.

 

Post ripping, I found that I was listening to more music, which is for me what it is all about, and listening to more of my catalogue.

 

My kids are now big and have moved on from destroying my CD collection to destroying my sanity. Having said that, they do enjoy music and utilise my ripped music collection. The other day I heard my son playing and enjoying Paint it Black by the Rolling Stones so things have come full circle.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Sonichifi said:

@Cafad What program do you use to bring your CD's to flac?

As of yet, none.  I've just ripped them as wav files.  I haven't dived in to the whole file type issue yet, been quite successfully ignoring it actually since it hasn't applied to me until now. 

 

Damn, one more thing I now need to pay some attention to.  The list just keeps getting longer.

 

Is there any advantage to flac files over wav files?  Since space isn't an issue and I'm happy with the sound from my cds I was just going to keep things simple and stick with wav files.  Unless there is a reason I shouldn't.

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12 minutes ago, Cafad said:

As of yet, none.  I've just ripped them as wav files.  I haven't dived in to the whole file type issue yet, been quite successfully ignoring it actually since it hasn't applied to me until now. 

 

Damn, one more thing I now need to pay some attention to.  The list just keeps getting longer.

 

Is there any advantage to flac files over wav files?  Since space isn't an issue and I'm happy with the sound from my cds I was just going to keep things simple and stick with wav files.  Unless there is a reason I shouldn't.

some say that flac files as they require more cpu power to extract are inferior to wav files so if space isnt a problem wav has less potential downside.

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If you use Exact Audio Copy which seems to be the most popular the default option is Flac. It seems to be the most popular file type so I assume that may make it the best but that is not always the case. Google has a lot on it and it seems to be a readable format on most devices except I think for apple. Just found tis on the net

 

"WAV and other uncompressed formats are excellent for working on, so are used in editing tools, but FLAC uses LOSSLESS compression, meaning, by definition, there is no difference in the sound when it is played back, and is simply stored in a more efficient manner. This means you can store more music on a hard drive."

Edited by JD1
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I went through this process a few months back. Was boring but once done its great as everything is now in FLAC file format and available to me for use on my phone and other devices/components around the house.

Its also nice to have everyrthing in order, so while ripping my CDs I also entered them into Discogs so I had a proper live catalog.  I have around 800cd's reduced from over 2000. I am spewing I didnt do this when I had the full collection so at least I had the files. Oh well.  Havent put the LPs in discogs yet, thats another pile of work i'll get to one day.

 

To rip the CD's I used DB Poweramp.

No reason other than it seemed easy to use and I could direct the file to where I wanted and also choose level of compression, I use monkey media gold edition as it also has an app on my phone I can sync with very easily in a drag and drop scenario or via wifi - For the file size I chose uncompressed which might have been overkill but its done now.  It also found my album artwork or let me choose my own, and has a few side programs like a file converter which I found useful.

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2 minutes ago, frednork said:

some say that flac files as they require more cpu power to extract are inferior to wav files so if space isnt a problem wav has less potential downside.

 

It's such a small amount, it really does not matter.  You can convert losslessly back and forth between the two formats, so again, it just doesn't matter from that point of view either.   flac just seems more modern to me, than .wav files. 

 

Just a note, there are still players out there that don't understand flac (my car for example) and so, conversion to .mp3 still happens from time to time, but it's one way only :)  I keep the flac originals.

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30 minutes ago, Cafad said:

Damn, one more thing I now need to pay some attention to.  The list just keeps getting longer.

Goodbye simplicity, hello complication.

 

Have fun amigo.

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24 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

 

It's such a small amount, it really does not matter.  You can convert losslessly back and forth between the two formats, so again, it just doesn't matter from that point of view either.   flac just seems more modern to me, than .wav files. 

 

Just a note, there are still players out there that don't understand flac (my car for example) and so, conversion to .mp3 still happens from time to time, but it's one way only :)  I keep the flac originals.

It may not matter to you, it does to others. I havent tested this myself.

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37 minutes ago, frednork said:

It may not matter to you, it does to others. I havent tested this myself.

Probably a leftover "problem" from back when cpu's were much less powerful and struggled with music.  These days, even a raspberry pi has power to spare.

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I looked at this a while back. Someone please correct me if I am wrong, from memory .....

 

FLAC vs Wave : The content a.k.a music is the same (PCM encoded) it is only the container that differs. Metadata ( song, track, artist, composer etc) became important over time for many people and FLAC and Wave were both excellent compared to other formats. There are free programs and commercial programs that can edit Metadata. This helps with managing your library e.g some of my rips have 'Various Artists' as the artist name, so when I search for a band it can not find a match even though I have plenty of songs by that band.

 

There is a fair bit of angst and confusion around compression. The music samples can be compresses e.g MP3 (lossy compression). FLAC and WAVE can have their music samples uncompressed and it is usually the default setting for ripping programs. We are long past the days of compressing music to save HDD space. The file itself can be compressed (loss-less compression) I would not worry about this.

 

FLAC seems to be more portable / universally supported on products, but I have not really noticed this. I think iTunes may even play Wave.

 

If you do get stuck, there are programs that will convert between FLAC - WAVE so you will not have to re-rip you CD collection.

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2 minutes ago, Cruncher said:

I looked at this a while back. Someone please correct me if I am wrong, from memory .....

 

FLAC vs Wave : The content a.k.a music is the same (PCM encoded) it is only the container that differs. Metadata ( song, track, artist, composer etc) became important over time for many people and FLAC and Wave were both excellent compared to other formats. There are free programs and commercial programs that can edit Metadata. This helps with managing your library e.g some of my rips have 'Various Artists' as the artist name, so when I search for a band it can not find a match even though I have plenty of songs by that band.

 

There is a fair bit of angst and confusion around compression. The music samples can be compresses e.g MP3 (lossy compression). FLAC and WAVE can have their music samples uncompressed and it is usually the default setting for ripping programs. We are long past the days of compressing music to save HDD space. The file itself can be compressed (loss-less compression) I would not worry about this.

 

FLAC seems to be more portable / universally supported on products, but I have not really noticed this. I think iTunes may even play Wave.

 

If you do get stuck, there are programs that will convert between FLAC - WAVE so you will not have to re-rip you CD collection.

 

Pretty much as I understand it... 

 

except the default for flac I have often seen to be compression level 5.  Don't confuse this with lossy compression.  It is lossless, and very similar to the way a zip file is compressed.  Using less compression MAY make the file faster to decompress, but as I was saying, most processors these days romp it in with power to spare. 

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22 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

Probably a leftover "problem" from back when cpu's were much less powerful and struggled with music.  These days, even a raspberry pi has power to spare.

Nope, more like when trying to extract every ounce of sq out of any given setup. 

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55 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

Probably a leftover "problem" from back when cpu's were much less powerful and struggled with music.  These days, even a raspberry pi has power to spare.

It's audible whether I play it with an Atom or a 20-core Xeon. CPU power has very little to do with it.

 

FLAC is a better format for archiving. Metadata, CRC, compression. Unless you can't convert FLAC is infinitely preferable for making sure you've a good, reliable copy of your data.

 

Whatever is native to your end device is best for playback, as it means no extra work. WAV is often a good proxy for this though there are zero devices that'll take 16-bit WAV as a native format. It is closer. 

 

My main rig runs an Amanero USB interface, that's a 32-bit PCM interface. There's a palpable difference in converting as such pre playback.

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38 minutes ago, frednork said:

Nope, more like when trying to extract every ounce of sq out of any given setup. 

Doesn't work like that.  Having a cpu sit idle with nothing to do won't make sq better.

 

5 minutes ago, rmpfyf said:

It's audible whether I play it with an Atom or a 20-core Xeon. CPU power has very little to do with it.

Since it is exactly the same data, it's lossless remember, how can it sound different if the cpu is not having trouble processing it?

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57 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

Since it is exactly the same data, it's lossless remember, how can it sound different if the cpu is not having trouble processing it?

'not having trouble' doesn't mean 'no latency'. Not how CPUs work.

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24 minutes ago, rmpfyf said:

'not having trouble' doesn't mean 'no latency'. Not how CPUs work.

piffle, it's the same data and it sounds exactly the same.  Anyone can prove it by simply playing both wav and flac versions of the same file.  The OP can decide for himself.

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5 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

piffle, it's the same data and it sounds exactly the same.  Anyone can prove it by simply playing both wav and flac versions of the same file.  The OP can decide for himself.

 

Piffle yourself. 

 

Anyone playing it and getting no difference is winning. Anyone that can hear a difference can leverage it. That someone can or cannot hear it isn't a proxy argument for what happens at OS or CPU level. 

 

Offloading processing for lower CPU latency is around as old as computing, nothing new revolutionary or hidden about it. It's particularly relevant in modern CPUs owing for a number of reasons, mostly related to power consumption. The 'same data' argument has not a lot (ie. nothing) do to with this much. If your rig sounds identical with the same file played with any power supply, any CPU speed or C state, any amount of tasks running, any... thing as long as the data is the same, then good for you. Plenty of reasons to suggest there are differences in processing that audibly effect the output on a number of systems for various reasons though if for whatever reason it's all below your threshold of sensitivity then you're winning. I mean this sincerely.

 

My library is stored FLAC because it's a (far) better archive format. I don't generally playback FLAC for critical listening. Horses for courses.

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2 minutes ago, rmpfyf said:

 

Piffle yourself. 

 

Anyone playing it and getting no difference is winning. Anyone that can hear a difference can leverage it. That someone can or cannot hear it isn't a proxy argument for what happens at OS or CPU level. 

 

Offloading processing for lower CPU latency is around as old as computing, nothing new revolutionary or hidden about it. It's particularly relevant in modern CPUs owing for a number of reasons, mostly related to power consumption. The 'same data' argument has not a lot (ie. nothing) do to with this much. If your rig sounds identical with the same file played with any power supply, any CPU speed or C state, any amount of tasks running, any... thing as long as the data is the same, then good for you. Plenty of reasons to suggest there are differences in processing that audibly effect the output on a number of systems for various reasons though if for whatever reason it's all below your threshold of sensitivity then you're winning. I mean this sincerely.

 

My library is stored FLAC because it's a (far) better archive format. I don't generally playback FLAC for critical listening. Horses for courses.

  Why not just let the OP try it for themselves?

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6 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

  Why not just let the OP try it for themselves?

You missed the bit in what you've quoted where this is almost literally written... or the  many other posts on this forum by myself and many others many times?

 

9 minutes ago, rmpfyf said:

Plenty of reasons to suggest there are differences in processing that audibly effect the output on a number of systems for various reasons though if for whatever reason it's all below your threshold of sensitivity then you're winning. I mean this sincerely.

 

As stated before intended for the OP, @Cafad if you've interest consider converting the lot to FLAC - should your hard disk start feeling sad enough to much on your files, there's features in FLAC that will let you know if you've still got good copies. Can't do that with WAV.

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