Jump to content

Steve OD

Rega Cartridge Help!

Recommended Posts

Hi Guys,

I have a Rega RP-1 thats about 5 years old. I recently upgraded the cartridge and belt using the Rega Performance pack. The TT now has the red Bias 2 cart installed.

I installed it myself following instructions provided.

I notice that now my speaker drivers move far more.  The problem happens with music playing at low volumes or even in the outer most groove when no music is actually playing.

I didn’t have this issue with the stock cart. Would I expect this to appear after install of the new cart?

I also notice that the sound of the new cart is very bright. Probably too much so.

Is there anything I can check?

I have read online that possible causes could be TT isolation or need a high pass filter but I dont get why this is only started once new cart is installed.

Any help is appreciated!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm no turntable guru, but my advice would be firstly to double check the alignment, connections, vtf etc, and also your cabling. 

Also, your new cart needs time to break in before it sounds its optimum. Give it some time, say 50 hours give or take. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Steve OD said:

I have read online that possible causes could be TT isolation or need a high pass filter but I dont get why this is only started once new cart is installed.

The new cartridge may have different compliance so the resonant frequency from it's interaction with the arm has moved.  So this may change acoustic feedback, or simply how disturbances (small warps etc) from the record cause the arm/cartridge to react.    If isolation cannot be changed improved, or does not have the desired effect, then yep,  a high pass filter is what you need.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 04/05/2020 at 6:28 PM, Steve OD said:

I notice that now my speaker drivers move far more.  The problem happens with music playing at low volumes or even in the outer most groove when no music is actually playing.

Excessive cone excursion usually caused by rumble.  Check your isolation and if possible move the turntable and see if the problem remains.  In the past I have cured this problem with Harrison Labs inline filters.

 

On 04/05/2020 at 6:28 PM, Steve OD said:

I also notice that the sound of the new cart is very bright. Probably too much so.

A new cart will require some break in time to warm up.  Check your alignment and vertical tracking angle.  You want the cartridge body parallel with the record surface when playing.  The Bias 2 is designed to work with the Rega tonearms so I don't expect you would have any resonance issues.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


On 04/05/2020 at 5:58 PM, Steve OD said:

....I installed it myself following instructions provided.

I notice that now my speaker drivers move far more.  The problem happens with music playing at low volumes or even in the outer most groove when no music is actually playing.

.....

I also notice that the sound of the new cart is very bright. Probably too much so.

Is there anything I can check?

Hello Steve,

 

when you say "installed" did you adjust tracking weight to the notably lower weight that the Bias 2 wants to have? The bright sound can be wrong tracking weight. Maybe double check.

On 05/05/2020 at 9:05 AM, aussievintage said:

The new cartridge may have different compliance so the resonant frequency from it's interaction with the arm has moved.  So this may change acoustic feedback, or simply how disturbances (small warps etc) from the record cause the arm/cartridge to react.    If isolation cannot be changed improved, or does not have the desired effect, then yep,  a high pass filter is what you need.

Yes, that would do it, having a different compliance.

 

Bright sound can also be wrong VTA, as others have mentioned. Steve, is the new cartridge the same physical height (from record surface (when playing) to top of cartridge body)? If not, the arm height needs adjusting until the VTA is right. The usual first-blush guide to checking VTA is that the top of head-shell would be parallel to the record surface when playing a record.

 

The new cart has a much higher output, but that shouldn't make any difference to speaker driver movement, assuming you have turned down the volume to same music loudness as before! ;)

 

The final possibility is a faulty new cart. Do you have a hifi store you can bring the TT in with cart installed and have them check it? Because I tend to agree with the comment that this cart should be well matched to this arm, with no compliance problem. A high pass filter -- if you didn't need one before -- might be a band-aid over a genuine problem.

 

regards,

Grant

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for all the info guys.

I am at a bit of a loss.

 

I have attached pictures of the install. I can't get it much better than this.  The old cart sits alot lower than the Bias 2.  There is no way to adjust the tonearm height on my RP-1 turntable so there nothing I can do there.

Bias setting set to 1.7

I have measured the tracking weight. With the stylus at the same height as it would be sitting on a record, I get 1.8g. Recommended tracking weight for Bias 2 is 1.75g

I wouldn't imagine that there would be any compliance issues as this cart is sold as an upgrade for the RP-1 turntable.

I have tried isolating the best I can but it makes no difference.

 

Perhaps this is just the way it is and a inline filter is required.

I am using a yamaha amp with an inbuilt phono stage. Will this make it hard to put in an inline filter?

 

Thanks

Capture.PNG

IMG_8058.JPG

IMG_8059.JPG

IMG_8062.JPG

IMG_8063.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Steve OD said:

Thanks for all the info guys.

I am at a bit of a loss.

 

I have attached pictures of the install. I can't get it much better than this.  The old cart sits alot lower than the Bias 2.  There is no way to adjust the tonearm height on my RP-1 turntable so there nothing I can do there.

Bias setting set to 1.7

I have measured the tracking weight. With the stylus at the same height as it would be sitting on a record, I get 1.8g. Recommended tracking weight for Bias 2 is 1.75g

I wouldn't imagine that there would be any compliance issues as this cart is sold as an upgrade for the RP-1 turntable.

I have tried isolating the best I can but it makes no difference.

 

Perhaps this is just the way it is and a inline filter is required.

I am using a yamaha amp with an inbuilt phono stage. Will this make it hard to put in an inline filter?

 

Thanks

 

 

Not sure about your model, but I was told they insert shims/spacers under the arm to raise it to adjust VTA.

 

I don't think you should think of the speaker movement as a problem per se.  It may be the cartridge has extra compliance and reacts differently with the tonearm, but still within what is considered OK.   It may be that on a different system, one of the components will have frequency response limited to a higher frequency than yours goes down to, so not everyone will see the speaker pumping.  Or maybe even some people just wouldn't notice it.

 

An all in one amp may indeed make it hard to use an in-line subsonic filter, unless it happens to have external links between it's preamp and power amp, as some do.  You could buy a separate phono preamp however - and maybe get a sound improvement as well.  You can get a reasonable sounding one for well under $100, and of course the sky's the limit.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Try the old belt.

 

ron

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


10 minutes ago, rondine said:

Try the old belt.

 

ron

Good suggestion Ron, but same result :(

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There would be no compatibility problems with a all Rega set up. You should not see woofers move without infrasonic bass being produced is your support still stable? Forget brite or cartridge run in it is not related to your problem. It is near impossible to create infrabass to move a speaker cone playing a blank groove on a flat record. Filters a just a red herring look elsewhere. Refit the old (or any other cartridge) that worked before this will verify if your electronics are ok or if new cartridge faulty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Richard Tremain said:

You should not see woofers move without infrasonic bass being produced is your support still stable? Forget brite or cartridge run in it is not related to your problem. It is near impossible to create infrabass to move a speaker cone playing a blank groove on a flat record.

 

That's the thing, records are not perfectly flat and support platforms a seldom perfectly stable.  Both could be causing the OPs "problem".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes but it seems he did not have a problem with his support or records previously, this is not a problem that needs overthinking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Thanks again for all your input.

I took some time to troubleshoot today.

I replaced the cart with the original Ofton cart.

It seems that the woofer movement exists with the old cart but is alot less. Obviously I didn’t notice this previously.

So by installing the more sensitive cart the woofer movement is much more pronounced and way more noticeable same volume (not loud at all) on same records. 

Now something interesting is that the woofer movement coincides with any movement of the record. 

My platter is not dead flat and has very slight wobble. (Not sure if that is normal) when playing some records the tone arm moves vertically but also slightly horizontally.

It is at this little “dip” that causes the woofers to move.

Some records are worse than others.

 

Is the platter supposed to be dead flat?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah it should be pretty flat. Have you tried changing the mats? I have a P1 with a Bias 2 on it and it sounds great. Mine came with a Rega Carbon on it though. It might be a height issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Hi Steve, Cartridge sensitivity is not cause any problem as output to spk not any different just volume position changes.

The platter without mat should have zero visible wobble, the Linn Sondek (in use for 45 yrs ) is a popular T.T. it has a

some what imperfect felt mat yet it does not cause woofer excursions. You now need an inspection from a dealer

who is Highly Experienced in T.T.and vinyl NOT forum opinions including mine!

To address your other problem the reason your arm does not have any height adjustment is because Rega think it does not make any difference! which is ridiculous. I have vague memories that with the single bolt fixing arm of there being a 2mm steel spacer you could use. With the later 3 screw fixing type i believe there is a moulded adjuster Rega makes i have not seen this. There is also a superior infinitely VTA adjuster available from Michell Engineering after seeing your photos i doubt i would even bother setting it up with out a arm height adjuster.

Edited by Richard Tremain
additional info

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Classifieds Statistics


    Currently Active Ads

    Total Sales (Since 2018)

    Total Sales Value (Last 14 Days)

    Total Ads Value (Since March 2020)
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...