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31 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said:

Back in the olden days, when the Amiga 500 was alive, they used to call any of the productivity software (graphics, audio, video, programming and office etc.) "Applications", while smaller programs, for specific purposes were called Utilities.

DOS and early Windows days too. I've never really stopped thinking of them in these terms.

 

Kind of like what is now called a folder was previously in DOS and Win9x as a Directory. I wasn't until the last 5 years or so that I adjusted to calling then folders. 

Edited by MattyW

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I still freeze with indecision and ignorance whenever someone says, "First, open a folder". "WTF does that mean?", I scream in my head.

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Is this kind of computer standard of (non)-function the new normal??

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Threads like this, sadly end up as being dead end streets - historical tacit approval for proprietary software, ie W7 vs W10 - we prefer W7 as example. 

 

Did W7 give you ability to, run the program , to study and change the program in source code form, to redistribute exact copies, and to distribute modified versions. ? No has to be the answer.  Rather a proper look at W7 would reveal that it gave you, (to name a few), Invasion of Privacy, it blocked document formats being standardised, it enforced collusion with media companies, and enabled remote users to take over peoples computers, which is still happening to Windows products today  https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-15/microsoft-issues-urgent-windows-security-fix-after-nsa-tip-off/11869396

 

The emphasis should be to step out of the dead end street and ideally immediately gravitate instead to free software  https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/philosophy.html      finding you now have freedom is real cause for celebration. 

 

Many such distributions can be found here   https://distrowatch.com     As many have indicated Linux Mint is very user friendly and is a good distribution to commence with.   https://www.linuxmint.com/

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, doogie44 said:

Is this kind of computer standard of (non)-function the new normal??

Unfortunately yes.... Windows lost direction when Bill Gates ret go of the reins. Every interface from 8 has been rubbish. The interface in MS Office has been rubbish since the ribbon was introduced. Have to Google where to find basic functions now.

 

Admittedly they're more profitable than ever due to a focus on cloud computing,  though for the average user Microsoft has made rubbish product for some time now.

Edited by MattyW

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31 minutes ago, stereo coffee said:

Threads like this, sadly end up as being dead end streets - historical tacit approval for proprietary software, ie W7 vs W10 - we prefer W7 as example. 

 

Did W7 give you ability to, run the program , to study and change the program in source code form, to redistribute exact copies, and to distribute modified versions. ? No has to be the answer.  Rather a proper look at W7 would reveal that it gave you, (to name a few), Invasion of Privacy, it blocked document formats being standardised, it enforced collusion with media companies, and enabled remote users to take over peoples computers, which is still happening to Windows products today  https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-15/microsoft-issues-urgent-windows-security-fix-after-nsa-tip-off/11869396

 

The emphasis should be to step out of the dead end street and ideally immediately gravitate instead to free software  https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/philosophy.html      finding you now have freedom is real cause for celebration. 

 

Many such distributions can be found here   https://distrowatch.com     As many have indicated Linux Mint is very user friendly and is a good distribution to commence with.   https://www.linuxmint.com/

 

 

 

 

 

Best post this year !!   People are getting far to used to mediocrity and lack of privacy etc etc

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1 hour ago, stereo coffee said:

Threads like this, sadly end up as being dead end streets - historical tacit approval for proprietary software, ie W7 vs W10 - we prefer W7 as example. 

 

Did W7 give you ability to, run the program , to study and change the program in source code form, to redistribute exact copies, and to distribute modified versions. ? No has to be the answer.  Rather a proper look at W7 would reveal that it gave you, (to name a few), Invasion of Privacy, it blocked document formats being standardised, it enforced collusion with media companies, and enabled remote users to take over peoples computers, which is still happening to Windows products today  https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-15/microsoft-issues-urgent-windows-security-fix-after-nsa-tip-off/11869396

 

The emphasis should be to step out of the dead end street and ideally immediately gravitate instead to free software  https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/philosophy.html      finding you now have freedom is real cause for celebration. 

 

Many such distributions can be found here   https://distrowatch.com     As many have indicated Linux Mint is very user friendly and is a good distribution to commence with.   https://www.linuxmint.com/

 

 

 

 

 

Whilst I barely comprehend the nuts and bolts of what you're talking about, I can see a similarity between audio and computers. In both worlds you have a band of aficionados who are more knowledgeable than the rest of the population, whose enthusiasm is looked upon as "weird" by that same population and who sit back and wonder why the rest of the world appear unable to comprehend what they are trying to say. Personally, I "get" audio. Computers, I don't. Wish I did, but every time I try to get more into them my eyes eventually glaze over and I find myself writing playlists in my head. And then I fire up my system and all is right with the world.

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37 minutes ago, JukKluk2 said:

Whilst I barely comprehend the nuts and bolts of what you're talking about, I can see a similarity between audio and computers. In both worlds you have a band of aficionados who are more knowledgeable than the rest of the population, whose enthusiasm is looked upon as "weird" by that same population and who sit back and wonder why the rest of the world appear unable to comprehend what they are trying to say. Personally, I "get" audio. Computers, I don't. Wish I did, but every time I try to get more into them my eyes eventually glaze over and I find myself writing playlists in my head. And then I fire up my system and all is right with the world.

That's an interesting comparison, because the reaches of proprietary software with similar needs to take away your freedom,and to a degree replace that with controlling and observing you, very sadly also extend to audio equipment.

 

as an example of those that do this.  https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeanbaptiste/2019/08/28/apple-apologizes-for-eavesdropping-on-customers-keeping-siri-recordings-without-permission/

 

On a brighter note, there are many who steadfastly refuse to cross the customer relationship boundary by on-selling your information etc , and can be relied on to fully respect your privacy. 

 

The DIY community on this forum and many other forums, are in some ways the left of audio politics, as well as the majority of manufacturers with good ethics. It's just a few, like the example above that lean to the right, with ulterior motives, we need to be cautious of when we choose hifi products.  

Edited by stereo coffee

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1 hour ago, stereo coffee said:

 very sadly also extend to audio equipment.

It wasn't that aspect that I was making comparisons with, it's the small, elite cognoscenti comparison that I had in mind.

I think that I already made clear that my knowledge of computers (and by inference the software and its extensions) is so shallow that not even a meniscus can form.

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I think it's passing strange that an ignoramus can work an analogue hi-fi system (I am the living proof) but few 'ordinary' people have the slightest idea how to sort out a digital foul-up, in my opinion. Even if they do, they are left pondering the play of the digital gods more often than not--all the way from operating systems down to networks and bits.

 

Not that one is getting bitter and twisted in one's old age, No! One merely observes...

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35 minutes ago, doogie44 said:

I think it's passing strange that an ignoramus can work an analogue hi-fi system (I am the living proof) but few 'ordinary' people have the slightest idea how to sort out a digital foul-up, in my opinion. Even if they do, they are left pondering the play of the digital gods more often than not--all the way from operating systems down to networks and bits.

 

Not that one is getting bitter and twisted in one's old age, No! One merely observes...

The modern world gets much more complicated every year.  The education system is struggling with the depth, and breadth, of the education required.  Year 10 was once a "good education", now it is more acceptably Year 12 - and they cram more into it.     Specialisation has to start much earlier in education, or else the ordinary student cannot cope.

 

My opinion is that modern design spends too much time on adding features and functionality, and not enough on making the technology more robust, self-healing,  and able to be treated as a black-box, where you do not need to understand what goes on inside.

 

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On 15/01/2020 at 8:02 PM, ThirdDrawerDown said:

Welcome to Windows 10.

 

 

Windows 10.gif

My W10 PC is running in under 60sec

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Guest Muon N'

Win 7 on my 7 year old low end PC...........27 seconds :ninja:

 

Edit: Pentium G3450, no 'i' anything xD

Edited by Muon N'

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On 15/01/2020 at 4:53 PM, JukKluk2 said:

 

Never a truer word spoken.

 

As someone who has very little understanding of the various iterations of Windows all that I can say is, after getting on well with Windows 7 I found the change to 10 a major headache. 7 was, after using the previous ten years worth of Windows, pretty intuitive for a know-nothing like me. 10 was a PITA from day one for me. I have now got used to it. Sort of.

I also have to say that I have absolutely no idea what anyone is saying when they talk about "using" 10, nor understood what was upgraded when each new version came out. How do you use Windows, in the sense of an activity? In my ignorance I see it as  just a backdrop upon which the programmes that you use are contained within. I have much doubt that I am even making sense to the computer literate and am simply proving my statement that starts this paragraph.

I'll shut up now.

 

On the contrary, that makes perfect sense. The operating system should be the enabler that lets you do the things that you want to do without getting in the way. Its the right way to think about it.

 

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And thank goodness they were. In the US, the missile defence system has just in 2019 changed from floppy discs.

 

Not 3 1/2 inch discs. 5 1/4 inch. The big ones. 

 

The software is proven, hardened, bug-free or all bugs are known. I like that in a missile system. Leave the latest Win 10 to non-critical use cases, such as accessing social media or enabling google/Facebook consumer tracking.

 

Need to mention, if you haven't run a Windows 10 update this week, best to do so now. There's a nasty gap just been found, ready to be exploited. Editd for clarity: automatic update does and has handled it; you can run Update manually if you wish.

Edited by ThirdDrawerDown

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1 hour ago, ThirdDrawerDown said:

Not 3 1/2 inch discs. 5 1/4 inch. The big ones. 

The big floppy disks were 8".   :)   5 1/4 came later

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I didn't start till 5.25 and microdisks were out... 93 or so. Not long before CD's came in.

 

Creative sold a bundle including a 2x CD-ROM drive, SoundBlaster 16..... And Lemmings  :)

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40 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

The big floppy disks were 8".   :)   5 1/4 came later

Ah yes, I remember saving up to buy my very own 8" floppy to store my school lunchtime computer club programming efforts.  Good times... good times...

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Just now, krebetman said:

Ah yes, I remember saving up to buy my very own 8" floppy to store my school lunchtime computer club programming efforts.  Good times... good times...

Due to the small size of most programs - we were running CP/M on Z80 CPUs - you could leave one 8" floppy in the drive permanently, using it almost like a hard drive.

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16 minutes ago, aussievintage said:

Due to the small size of most programs - we were running CP/M on Z80 CPUs - you could leave one 8" floppy in the drive permanently, using it almost like a hard drive.

I had to take it and run, as we had a fancy multi-user system running MP/M (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP/M) so the floppy disk drive was a bit like the fridge in a share house!

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Microsoft have stated they have finished supporting Windows 7 but I am still receiving updates.  I am not updating until l can purchase a new light weight ultrabook with 1TB SSD and 5G, hopefully later in the year.

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Well today we are going to install a old core duo at my 80yo mothers place so she can get on the internet.

She needs a email address.

 

So  its Win 7Pro  on a old core duo, l will make sure l set up Netflix as well.

Will also set it up for remote sessions, for technical support from myself or one of the kids.

 

Will use the KISS method.

 

regards Bruce

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Win 7 SP1 +  office + AVG + (Firefox open to type this) =  51 processes  (a few processes have been disabled).  2.72 GB Ram used.

 

Win 10 (non enterprise) + office + AVG = ???

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1 hour ago, keinesorge said:

Win 7 SP1 +  office + AVG + (Firefox open to type this) =  51 processes  (a few processes have been disabled).  2.72 GB Ram used.

 

Win 10 (non enterprise) + office + AVG = ???

LibreOffice saves some coin

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