Topping Owners & Discussion Thread

[prymortal]

D90 arrived. Initial impressions.
* Filter 1 & 4 are good.

- Mainly using Filter 1.
* There is an improvement in the floor noise, very noticeable, surprisingly how noticeable especially with Youtube, Twitch e.t.c. (Vs SMSL SU-8 Its tiny but noticeable tiny.)

- Turns out this "floor noise" difference is actually the fact the D90 doesn't do all the same sounds the SMSL SU-8 does, To difficult to figure out where but If I had to guess its in 3 areas total: bass (it does sub bass & low mids WELL!!!), Upper Mids. There is a treble difference as well SU-8 is peaky harsh & D90 is Glare soft with treble.
* Turns out the glare was a damaged/unshiedled USB cable I was using.
* Bass has punch.

- Bass & sub bass really does have a punch. Sometimes its like tapping on a speaker sound.
* I suspect that the AKM filters vs ESS filters cause the extra speed/detail I'm hearing, this thing is fast yet detailed without lacking when doing some audio parts I thought i knew.
- Still think its a filter difference for the speed of sound difference.
* Its still AKM soft sounding to me but a step up from the past few AKM Dac's i've heard. (coming direct from SU-8 makes it noticeable)

- If the treble didn't have glare on it (* Turns out the glare was a damaged/unshiedled USB cable I was using.) it'd be up there in top Dacs i've heard to date due to the technical aspects & presentation of sound it does alone.
* My Hd800 at times have reminded me of the L700 with some dynamic mid parts of songs. (speed, punch, power)
- This is still true "reminds" but not used the L700 with the D90 yet....

Holding the Power button while turning on the unit showed me the "hidden menu" which i used to set the unit as a Pure Dac.
In normal options I set it to XLR input only. (to kill the RCA input).
 

Overall it sounds like a Dac.... I'd rate it above my SU-8 but not by much in general.
- I do stand by this, not worth spending the extra $440USD on it over the SU-8 unless you need BT, IIS (I²S) & pre amp. If they sold the D90 cheaper as a Dac only, Then it would be worth it In My Opinion.
Pairs well with the THX amp.
Going to wait, get used to it, then see if i notice anything still.
 

Edited March 1, 2020 by prymortal
details might help. Kept it simple.

[silversurfer]

Still happy with the D90 and was able to sell the Pavane in the meantime.

Agree with the above that Filter 1 and 4 are the most pleasant ones and to have a NOS filter would be great but then again in a blind test I wouldn’t really be able to tell the difference.

Using a SU1 Interface I went back and forth between D90 and Pavane and I just enjoyed the former more. With the setup I have( StaxSR009S/ KGST and HD800S/HDV820)the music is more engaging and most important for me, it has this stunning holographic presentation.

I couldn’t care less about measurements and again agree with something mentioned above: music through this dac puts a smile on my face and makes me kind of happy...and that’s all that matters to me.

[Ittaku]

29 minutes ago, silversurfer said:

Still happy with the D90 and was able to sell the Pavane in the meantime.

Agree with the above that Filter 1 and 4 are the most pleasant ones and to have a NOS filter would be great but then again in a blind test I wouldn’t really be able to tell the difference.

Using a SU1 Interface I went back and forth between D90 and Pavane and I just enjoyed the former more. With the setup I have( StaxSR009S/ KGST and HD800S/HDV820)the music is more engaging and most important for me, it has this stunning holographic presentation.

I couldn’t care less about measurements and again agree with something mentioned above: music through this dac puts a smile on my face and makes me kind of happy...and that’s all that matters to me.

Interesting, as I have the DX7s and almost identical Stax headphone setup but with the Matrix Audio SPDIF converter. Have you tried without the SU-1? The clocks used in the D90 are insanely good and whilst the SU-1 *might* provide some extra isolation, theoretically it will not be doing anything useful for jitter reduction over and above the D90's internal clocks. It may well be that it sounds just as good with USB straight into the D90.

Edited February 29, 2020 by Ittaku

[silversurfer]

Sure, I mainly listen straight into USB port on the D90; the SU1 was useful to feed both dacs with the same signal simultaneously.

The USB input is also better than the Metrum Pavane USB( or the HEX which I had previously).
Not dissing the Pavane but in all it’s NOS beauty it lacks a tad dynamics and can be too laidback.

 

[prymortal]

I fixed my Treble glare issue with a Audioquest Carbon USB cable. Probably any cable would of fixed it in all honesty because the USB cable I was using has a damages, stripped & ungrounded shield.

[Ittaku]

15 minutes ago, silversurfer said:

Sure, I mainly listen straight into USB port on the D90; the SU1 was useful to feed both dacs with the same signal simultaneously.

So would you say the sound is basically identical with and without the SU1? I expect it would be.

[silversurfer]

Yes, and I was also keen to try the I2S port but it was too etched, really carving down to the bone of the music...figuratively speaking.

Generally fewer cables is best and the D90 USB is really all you need....and a good USB cable, of course.

[lordcloud]

After further listening........the D90 now just sounds wonderful. 

 

It's far more transparent than my previous DAC (modified MHDT Labs Balanced Pagoda), and the sound presentation switches according to what I'm listening to. It's very insightful, laying every little detail out there. If the soundstage is shallow, it's because it's in the recording. If it's deep...... recording.

 

I don't think this is the dac for someone who wants to hear their music with added anything, though I'm not sure that this DAC is the pinnacle of transparency either. Speculation on my part of course, but I wonder how much more information it could retrieve with an over engineered power supply. 

 

But regardless, I plan on keeping it as i think it would be incredibly difficult to best it for sheer transparency, at or around its price point. Transparency is definitely what this dac is about.

[lordcloud]

I'm currently listening to CD through the i2s connection (1 meter Audioquest Ocean) and I love it. The first day though......it sounded like **** and i thought something was wrong.

[Hi-Fi Whipped]

Two user reviews in a couple of weeks appear to have killed the thread, usually this is where things really ramp up.

 

proof that most people in the thread would rather speculate and try to out do each other using thier big audio brains than talk about the actual real world performance of product.

 

congrats to those who actually purchased the product and appear to be enjoying it.

[TerryO]

Anymore feedback on the D90 from those who have purchased one?

 

cheers,

Terry

[Suopermanni]

If anyone can wait until May, I will be in possession of one!

[was_a]

On 01/03/2020 at 5:04 PM, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

Two user reviews in a couple of weeks appear to have killed the thread, usually this is where things really ramp up.

 

proof that most people in the thread would rather speculate and try to out do each other using thier big audio brains than talk about the actual real world performance of product.

 

congrats to those who actually purchased the product and appear to be enjoying it.

I have no idea what this means. Two positive user opinions? That's the 'proof' ???

And why did 8 people LIKE this!

I blame the lockdown.........

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 18, 2020 by was_a

[muon*]

7 minutes ago, was_a said:

I have no ideal what this means. Two positive user opinions? That's the 'proof' ???

And why did 8 people LIKE this!

I blame the lockdown.........

 

Please help remedy this with LIKES. I'm aiming for 16!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

His speculation around others speculation is very speculative

 

Edit: sorry to say most of those likes happened pre virus days.

Edited April 16, 2020 by muon*

[muriwai]

Noob question 

what cord connector does i2s use?look like?

[kelossus]

2 minutes ago, muriwai said:

Noob question 

what cord connector does i2s use?look like?

There is no real industry standard connector but the D90 uses a hdmi cable.

[muriwai]

7 minutes ago, kelossus said:

There is no real industry standard connector but the D90 uses a hdmi cable.

So the “socket “ on the Dac looks/is same as a hdmi socket?and then does the pre amp/integrated amp that the dac connects to have a socket that says i2s?

[kelossus]

1 minute ago, muriwai said:

So the “socket “ on the Dac looks/is same as a hdmi socket?and then does the pre amp/integrated amp that the dac connects to have a socket that says i2s?

I2S is a digital input. This would usually come from a CD transport or maybe even a streamer these days?

 

Digital Source >>>> I2S output>>>>>> DAC's I2S Input>>>>>> DACs analogue output>>>>>>Preamp/Integrated Input

Edited April 16, 2020 by kelossus

[Ittaku]

Just spotted this ad an it might be the new king of affordable DACs.

 

https://shenzhenaudio.com/products/topping-e30-dac-ak4493-xu208-32bit-768k-dsd512-touch-operation-with-remote-control-hi-res-decoder

 

Featurewise at least, it would be hard to top this for a USB powered DAC that supports USB, coax and optical in at that price.

Quote

Spec:
PCM
USB :44.1kHz-768kHz  16bit-32bit
OPT/COAX : 44.1kHz-192kHz  16bit- 24bit

DSD (Native) 
USB :DSD64-DSD512 
OPT/COAX :Not supported

DSD (DoP)
USB : DSD64-DSD256
OPT/COAX :Not supported

Output Voltage：2Vrms@0dBFS
THD+N：<0.0003% @1kHz A-weighting
Noise：<2uVrms @A-weighting
Crosstalk：-130dB @1 kHz
SNR：>121dB @ 1kHz
Dynamic Range：119dB @1kHz
Channel Balance：<0.3 dB

Features:

1. AK4493 DAC chip
AK4493 is a new generation of premium model AK4490 from AKM.
-11 3dB :Distortion
1 26dB* :Dynamic range
DSD :Support DSD512
PCM :Support 768k
* This data is based on the MONO mode of chip, not equal to specs of E30.

2.Support DSD512 and PCM32bit/768kHz
E30 uses 2nd generation XMOS XU208, USB supports up to PCM32bit768kHz and DSD512, which is far
more than CD and SACD. We also customize the driver (for Win7 and above) from Thesycon to get a better performance with your computer.

3.AK41 18 receiver 
AK4118 is currently the S/PDIF receiver with lowest jitter, compatible with optical and coaxial connection that support up to 24bit/ 192kHz.

4.Commonly used inputs
E30 supports USB, optical and coaxial inputs which cover a variety of commonly used occasions, such as computer, mobile phone OTG,digital turntable and media player, TV and set-top box.

5.5V power supply, anytime and anywhere
Using 5V power supply, E30 can easily access the working power supply anytime and anywhere in nowadays. You can power the E30 by USB port of computer, mobile phone charger or portable charger. When using portable charger, E30 turns into a portable DAC and bring the Hi-Res music around.

6.DAC filter mode
E30 is capable of providing 6 filter modes under PCM decoding,2 filter modes under DSD decoding, which slightly adjust the details. (Note: it is not the same as EQ function.)

7.Auto turn on/off
E30 has the function of auto turn on and off. It will automatically enter into stand by when the input signal is lost or unavailable in 1 minute. Once detecting any signal of inputs, it will turn on and switch to this input.

8.DAC + Pre-amp application
E30 has built-in volume control function that can adjust the volume from -99dB to 0dB by using the remote control, so you are able to directly connect E30 to power amplifier or active speakers, and control the volume of E30 through remote control.

9. Pure DAC apptication
E30 is able to fix to maxmum output level so that it can be worked as a pure DAC. In this mode, DSD signal will bypass the DATT Soft Mute and 02 Modu-lator to provide you a pure/direct DSD performance.

 

[Ittaku]

Looks like ASR is already all over this one with measurements.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/topping-e30-dac-review.12119/

[Ittaku]

And looks like SMSL has a ~competing product for even less. This cheap space is getting very interesting...

 

https://shenzhenaudio.com/collections/decoder-dac/products/smsl-sanskrit-10th-mkii-ak4497-24bit-384khz-dsd256-sk10-mkii-high-end-dac-decoder

 

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/wolfx700-measurement-of-smsl-sanskrit-10th-ak4493-edition.10830/

 

Blink and you'll miss these new DACs coming out, as I did.

Edited May 7, 2020 by Ittaku

[keinesorge]

Given the youtube feedback, this is one DAC i'd be keen on trying.

Thankfully, "upgraditis" is no longer a thing.

 

For now. 

[eman]

Topping E30 Says can power by mobile phone charger.

It's going to need a 3.5mm ? Adapter cable though ?

Looks like it has a round input which phones don't have now.

 

Had my eye on a Topping D50s , plus some sort of power supply.

 

Is Topping competing with itself with these two ranges or is there a design focus I'm missing ?

[Ittaku]

5 minutes ago, eman said:

Topping E30 Says can power by mobile phone charger.

It's going to need a 3.5mm ? Adapter cable though ?

Looks like it has a round input which phones don't have now.

 

Had my eye on a Topping D50s , plus some sort of power supply.

 

Is Topping competing with itself with these two ranges or is there a design focus I'm missing ?

The E30 can be powered from the USB from the PC, the barrel connection is an "optional extra" if you want to use an external linear power supply.

 

Topping is continually replacing its old line and has multiple niches to suit all flavours; the E30 uses 1x AK chip instead of the 2x ESS as used in the D50s, and the D50s has bluetooth. So they're all slightly different feature and flavours.

Edited May 10, 2020 by Ittaku

[gwurb]

https://soundnews.net/sources/dacs/topping-e30-dac-review-entry-level-overachiever/
 

that is one source that talks about E30 and highlights some differences between the 2.