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H.E. Pennypacker

NAD C658 Dirac = Game Changer

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Ok... every ‘this next step will fix it’... horse s***... room correction.

 

I’ve not heard an “endgame” system sound like this (though I’m sure plenty do, I’ve only heard that level at shows and stores) ... simply astounding...

 

I’m still shocked... bass vibrates my chair, but also isn’t there.

 

3D vocals, instruments... separated, but one.

 

In the words of continual sweat shop operators... JUST DO IT!

Edited by furtherpale

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I think you are referring to the C658, please change your title.

 

What is it like with and without Dirac?  Did you pay for the full license?

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1 minute ago, Snoopy8 said:

I think you are referring to the C658, please change your title.

 

What is it like with and without Dirac?  Did you pay for the full license?

I set it a challenge... 
 

I used to have the speakers 1200mm from the wall (from the rear of the speakers), now they are 500mm, they are still 1100mm from the side walls.

 

Without Dirac... Boomy bass, nulls and with flat and lifeless imaging/staging.

 

With Dirac... balanced tone with a HUGE soundstage.

 

 

6B85FAD8-8135-45C5-9648-4A6CCE3FA4A1.jpeg

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You've got a luxman in the mix now too yeh? So nad just being used as a Dac/streamer?

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47 minutes ago, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

You've got a luxman in the mix now too yeh? So nad just being used as a Dac/streamer?

Correct. It is operating as a streamer/dac (Qobuz, Tidal and CD rips) into the Luxman.

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Once you've experienced good room correction, it makes you wonder why people concentrate on everything else and ignore it, and you can never go back to a system without it.

 

Enjoy.

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Game changer? could be, now give me M10 in full width chassis with more power (let’s call it M20 for now) and reasonable price tag and we can even call it end game, I believe I won’t be the only one who would jump on it

2 hours ago, Ittaku said:

Once you've experienced good room correction, it makes you wonder why people concentrate on everything else and ignore it, and you can never go back to a system without it.

 

Enjoy.

 well said, it’s really hard to go back once you experience good room correction

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2 hours ago, Ittaku said:

Once you've experienced good room correction, it makes you wonder why people concentrate on everything else and ignore it, and you can never go back to a system without it.

Unfortunately, there are still many  2 channel purists who refuse to contemplate things like room correction, subs etc..  Their loss!  

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2 hours ago, Snoopy8 said:

Unfortunately, there are still many  2 channel purists who refuse to contemplate things like room correction, subs etc..  Their loss!  

I reckon room correction should start with actually correcting (treating) the room, and the speaker placement. Some issues cannot be fixed by signal processing.

 

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2 hours ago, Steffen said:

I reckon room correction should start with actually correcting (treating) the room, and the speaker placement. Some issues cannot be fixed by signal processing.

 

I’ve done what I can in the room I have. The soundstage was wide with good imaging before hand... but was dead, lifeless and had the problems that frequency response shows.

61A53523-9579-48D5-8CD5-4A1D453B3AA3.jpeg

75386FC6-72D5-4F49-993F-B7A67E7138A2.jpeg

Edited by furtherpale

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6 hours ago, Steffen said:

I reckon room correction should start with actually correcting (treating) the room, and the speaker placement. Some issues cannot be fixed by signal processing.

Agree with sentiment. That is ideal in a dedicated room. In a shared environment, it may not be possible, hence room correction is often the only way to tame some of the issues with the sound, as OP has done.

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16 hours ago, Snoopy8 said:

purists

Yep.  3-6dB 'errors' in the frequency response are super significant.  100 to 400% is no small issue.

 

It much doesn't matter how you get rid of them... as long as you do.

 

Cars with 3 wheels don't go very fast (and are easily beaten by a car with all the wheels working) ..... doesn't matter if it's a million $ sports car, or a 40 year old rust bucket.

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I have a terrible room where treatment is not an option. Dirac in my SHD made the same huge improvement 👍

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2 minutes ago, stiben said:

I have a terrible room where treatment is not an option. Dirac in my SHD made the same huge improvement 👍

It was 50/50 for the SHD... Familiarity with BluOS was the only winner in the end.

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I just read through the manual for the C658. SHD still better for my requirements but a mix of both units would be the bee's knees.

 

My stereo is on my TV so the one area the C658 wins outright is the optional MDC adding HDMI in and out with ARC. But more $$$

 

I run a HT processor at fixed volume to the SHD's RCA input.

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13 hours ago, Snoopy8 said:

Agree with sentiment. That is ideal in a dedicated room. In a shared environment, it may not be possible, hence room correction is often the only way to tame some of the issues with the sound, as OP has done.

2nd that. The bass traps, carpet, absorbers didn’t do much that I could hear. Room correction through DEQX is a big change. 

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On 23/11/2019 at 4:37 PM, furtherpale said:

In the words of continual sweat shop operators... JUST DO IT!

Edited 19 hours

Have ordered one, looking forward to it!

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On 24/11/2019 at 3:08 AM, furtherpale said:

I’ve done what I can in the room I have. The soundstage was wide with good imaging before hand... but was dead, lifeless and had the problems that frequency response shows.

61A53523-9579-48D5-8CD5-4A1D453B3AA3.jpeg

75386FC6-72D5-4F49-993F-B7A67E7138A2.jpeg

 

There's a whole lot more treatment that could be done for this room. Those thin foam absorbers won't do much. They could instead be the outer layer of the "real" absorbers - that entire front wall could have 1 foot thick absorbers (acoustic fibreglass or better) floor to ceiling, and 2 feet thick on the sides out to about 2m from the front wall where the curtain starts, plus cloud traps in the corners, and one could go even further than that. The enormous difference this kind of treatment makes would blow the socks off any audiophile. It really cannot be overstated. OP got a taste of this with Dirac but DSP cannot fix some of the problems room effects introduce. Room treatment is the only thing that can really do a good job of it.

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1 minute ago, b0dhi said:

 

There's a whole lot more treatment that could be done for this room. Those thin foam absorbers won't do much. They could instead be the outer layer of the "real" absorbers - that entire front wall could have 1 foot thick absorbers (acoustic fibreglass or better) floor to ceiling, and 2 feet thick on the sides out to about 2m from the front wall where the curtain starts, plus cloud traps in the corners, and one could go even further than that. The enormous difference this kind of treatment makes would blow the socks off any audiophile. It really cannot be overstated. OP got a taste of this with Dirac but DSP cannot fix some of the problems room effects introduce. Room treatment is the only thing that can really do a good job of it.

Rental unfortunately.

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Just now, furtherpale said:

Rental unfortunately.

 

Me too, but it can be done without any alterations at all. The batts are self-supporting, plus some 3M temporary hooks to prevent them toppling forward, and that's 90% of the job done.

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1 hour ago, b0dhi said:

 

There's a whole lot more treatment that could be done for this room. Those thin foam absorbers won't do much. They could instead be the outer layer of the "real" absorbers - that entire front wall could have 1 foot thick absorbers (acoustic fibreglass or better) floor to ceiling, and 2 feet thick on the sides out to about 2m from the front wall where the curtain starts, plus cloud traps in the corners, and one could go even further than that. The enormous difference this kind of treatment makes would blow the socks off any audiophile. It really cannot be overstated. OP got a taste of this with Dirac but DSP cannot fix some of the problems room effects introduce. Room treatment is the only thing that can really do a good job of it.

Unrealistic in most settings, the OP is happy, tools down and enjoy the music I say!

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10 minutes ago, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

Unrealistic in most settings, the OP is happy, tools down and enjoy the music I say!

Yup... I get to build a custom listening room when we build the Canberra house (as in somewhere around 6m x 10m)... still astonished at what Dirac has done for a 4 x 3 room.

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39 minutes ago, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

Unrealistic in most settings, the OP is happy, tools down and enjoy the music I say!

I understand it's unrealistic for many people, but on the other hand the number of high end systems I've seen in dedicated entertainment/music rooms with little to no treatment is astounding. That's like buying a Ferrari and only driving it back and forth in your driveway.

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1 minute ago, b0dhi said:

I understand it's unrealistic for many people, but on the other hand the number of high end systems I've seen in dedicated entertainment/music rooms with little to no treatment is astounding. That's like buying a Ferrari and only driving it back and forth in your driveway.

I’ll be upgrading to a high end system when the custom room is built (it will be designed properly and treated).

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