o2so Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 HI guys, my Benz Ace still sounds great but I feel like a change of flavour. Looking for possibly more presence at the frequency extremes, but maintaining the great transparency of the Ace. I would not dislike a touch more punch, too. Budget is not great, say $1,500 tops. Any words of advice? I heard great things of teh Hana SL, and I wonder if anyone has compared it to the Ace. Could Also upgrade to a Glider however I wonder if it wouldnt sound pretty much the same as the Ace. Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Citroen Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Lyra Delos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gryffles Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Self promotion but this would exceed your Ace in all areas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monts71 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Hi, maybe phono pre options could also be solution. Rather endless really.....I personally enjoy Supex 901 mc/ shure passive sut. Oldies but goodies. All the best with your quest:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o2so Posted October 16, 2019 Author Share Posted October 16, 2019 3 hours ago, Citroen said: Lyra Delos it costs $2,500, but thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o2so Posted October 16, 2019 Author Share Posted October 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Gryffles said: Self promotion but this would exceed your Ace in all areas costs $500 too much mate. But thanks for the plug 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o2so Posted October 16, 2019 Author Share Posted October 16, 2019 57 minutes ago, monts71 said: Hi, maybe phono pre options could also be solution. Rather endless really..... I personally enjoy Supex 901 mc/ shure passive sut. Oldies but goodies. All the best with your quest:) Thanks, it makes sense but I am happy with my PS Audio converter, which also allows me to do digital room correction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhythm Willie Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 How about a Soundsmith Carmen Mk11? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monts71 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Thanks, it makes sense but I am happy with my PS Audio converter, which also allows me to do digital room correctionPS converter, never experienced but guessing extremely capable. I’ve had the privilege of listening to Kiseki Purple Heart NS mc cartridge on hi-end system & maybe one that will deliver your requirements but not on the cheap list. Worth looking at reviews & considering saving your penny’s for this magic piece of audio equipment. https://krispyaudio.com.au/products/kiseki-purple-heart-ns-mc-cartridge.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Citroen Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 11 hours ago, o2so said: it costs $2,500, but thanks They come up here secondhand every now and then for around your budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vwo60 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 15 hours ago, o2so said: HI guys, my Benz Ace still sounds great but I feel like a change of flavour. Looking for possibly more presence at the frequency extremes, but maintaining the great transparency of the Ace. I would not dislike a touch more punch, too. Budget is not great, say $1,500 tops. Any words of advice? I heard great things of teh Hana SL, and I wonder if anyone has compared it to the Ace. Could Also upgrade to a Glider however I wonder if it wouldnt sound pretty much the same as the Ace. Thanks in advance! You will not regret buying another Benz cartridge, I bought the glider then went on to buy a Gull-wing, The Glider SL is below your budget and is a fine cartridge. http://www.decibelhifi.com.au/benz-micro-glider-sl-mc-phono-cartridge/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decky Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) Clearaudio Concept MC. Very happy with it. https://www.theaudiotailor.com.au/collections/latest-products/products/clearaudio-concept-mc-cartridge Edited October 16, 2019 by Decky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o2so Posted October 16, 2019 Author Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, vwo60 said: You will not regret buying another Benz cartridge, I bought the glider then went on to buy a Gull-wing, The Glider SL is below your budget and is a fine cartridge. http://www.decibelhifi.com.au/benz-micro-glider-sl-mc-phono-cartridge/ Have you ever had a chance to compare this to a Micro Ace L? I heard there is not much difference in presentation, if any at all. Edited October 16, 2019 by o2so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rantan Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 44 minutes ago, o2so said: Have you ever had a chance to compare this to a Micro Ace L? I heard there is not much difference in presentation, if any at all. I am pretty sure that there is a Benz house sound signature, which I stress is certainly no bad thing, but if you are seeking a change I think it is better going with another brand. Perhaps a Hana SH/SL or a Dynavector DV-10X5. Either would leave you a lot of cash in your pocket and do a great job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryO Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) While only hearing various entry level Benz carts (below$2500 rrp) for short periods of time I would say Rantan is correct and also to my ears they have a 'house sound signature'. The Hana SL is quiet different and as best as I could explain is far more open and detailed, which I prefer. I reckon the person to ask is Greg @Doppelgangerwho from memory has had both, as well as many many other lovely carts, phono stages and TT's. If you want to sample the Hana sound at a entry level price then might be an idea to contact @chimchimster who just yesterday came back from OS with a new TT which had a Hana EL cart fitted, which I understand he intends to soon move on. Out of curiosity o2so do you miss the Wilson Benech stand mounts? cheers Terry Edited October 17, 2019 by TerryO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o2so Posted October 17, 2019 Author Share Posted October 17, 2019 24 minutes ago, TerryO said: While only hearing various entry level Benz carts (below$2500 rrp) for short periods of time I would say Rantan is correct and also to my ears they have a 'house sound signature'. The Hana SL is quiet different and as best as I could explain is far more open and detailed, which I prefer. I reckon the person to ask is Greg @Doppelgangerwho from memory has had both, as well as many many other lovely carts, phono stages and TT's. If you want to sample the Hana sound at a entry level price then might be an idea to contact @chimchimster who just yesterday came back from OS with a new TT which had a Hana EL cart fitted, which I understand he intends to soon move on. Out of curiosity o2so do you miss the Wilson Benech stand mounts? cheers Terry Thanks for the tip mate, makes sense. However no matter where I look Benz carts have the best specs out there, and by a good margin. Should we trust specs? I have now a different room and different set up from when I had the Wilson Benesch speakers. The room is smaller and I can only do near field listening (about 1.4m). I find the m8audio Rocket, with their sub (and DSP room correction to manage it), are excellent in my set up and in fact far superior to the WB. M8audio is not that well known yet because they are new, but their products are true gems that best speakers of the same size that are three times the price (e.g. read B&W 805 D3 for instance, whose treble is piercing and disproportionately strong compared to the rest of the band). This is partly due to the fact they have no distribution or retail mark ups. If you are in teh market for new speakers, you should most definitely consider m8audio (they will have a room at the hifi show). BTW I am not affiliated to them in any way or measure. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mr Thorens Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 I moved from a Benz Glider to Ortofon Quintet Bronze. The Ortofon has similar smooth and wide sound, slightly less micro detail but quite a bit more weight and more solid bottom end. I’ve compared the Quintet Bronze to Cadenza Red in store audition, the Cadenza Red has better detailing and dynamics again and I would place it above the Glider as I remember it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryO Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 Agreed o2so specs are very important, but I would say not as important as ears. cheers Terry 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doppelganger Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 (edited) I have, over the last few years, used the Hana EL and SL as well as the Benz Ace, Glider and Wood. In terms of the Benz, moving up the range gets a little better at each step in terms of refinement and retrieval of more detail. There is definitely a common sound signature across this three Benz carts which is not a huge surprise as they are essentially the same cartridge in different bodies. I found the step up to the Wood from the Glider to be a bigger jump in quality than from the Ace to the Glider. The Hana SL is a very nice sounding cartridge. More detail than the Benz Ace (similar to the Glider though) and perhaps slightly better balanced from top to bottom. Not the most impactful bottom end though. A couple of others worth thinking about, although I don’t know what arm you’re mounting on so can’t comment on compatibility, would be as follows: Van den Hul DDT-II Special - highly detailed with a fabulous top end. Majors on neutrality. Not as smooth as Hana in the lower registers. Sonic signature is closer to the Dynavector Karat range than the Benz or Wood - more about fleetness of foot than holistic gravitas. Ideally matched to a low mass tonearm (8g - 10g). ZYX Bloom R50 - the current model is a iii but I’ve only heard the i. Very smooth top to bottom. More warmth than the Benz or Hana with a deeper but more rounded bass than both of those. Lightweight cart with medium compliance so matches a broad spectrum of arms. EAT Jo No.5 - this is a cracking cart. Has some warmth and majors on bass impact without missing the detail of the VdH. Probably my pick in this price range, it is actually built around the Ortofon Quintet Black with some Cadenza Red influence and encased in a very heavy moulded body. Weighs 15g so needs a medium to high mass arm that can handle that weight. Let me know if you want to listen to any of the three I mention as they are all still in rotation in my system, as is the Benz Wood. Edited October 17, 2019 by Doppelganger 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o2so Posted October 17, 2019 Author Share Posted October 17, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Doppelganger said: I have, over the last few years, used the Hana EL and SL as well as the Benz Ace, Glider and Wood. In terms of the Benz, moving up the range gets a little better at each step in terms of refinement and retrieval of more detail. There is definitely a common sound signature across this three Benz carts which is not a huge surprise as they are essentially the same cartridge in different bodies. I found the step up to the Wood from the Glider to be a bigger jump in quality than from the Ace to the Glider. The Hana SL is a very nice sounding cartridge. More detail than the Benz Ace (similar to the Glider though) and perhaps slightly better balanced from top to bottom. Not the most impactful bottom end though. A couple of others worth thinking about, although I don’t know what arm you’re mounting on so can’t comment on compatibility, would be as follows: Van den Hul DDT-II Special - highly detailed with a fabulous top end. Majors on neutrality. Not as smooth as Hana in the lower registers. Sonic signature is closer to the Dynavector Karat range than the Benz or Wood - more about fleetness of foot than holistic gravitas. Ideally matched to a low mass tonearm (8g - 10g). ZYX Bloom R50 - the current model is a iii but I’ve only heard the i. Very smooth top to bottom. More warmth than the Benz or Hana with a deeper but more rounded bass than both of those. Lightweight cart with medium compliance so matches a broad spectrum of arms. EAT Jo No.5 - this is a cracking cart. Has some warmth and majors on bass impact without missing the detail of the VdH. Probably my pick in this price range, it is actually built around the Ortofon Quintet Black with some Cadenza Red influence and encased in a very heavy moulded body. Weighs 15g so needs a medium to high mass arm that can handle that weight. Let me know if you want to listen to any of the three I mention as they are all still in rotation in my system, as is the Benz Wood. Thank you Greg, much appreciated and very helpful. I use a Mitchell technoarm which is a medium mass of 11g. Anyone in OZ sells the EAT cart? Edited October 17, 2019 by o2so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doppelganger Posted October 17, 2019 Share Posted October 17, 2019 2 hours ago, o2so said: Thank you Greg, much appreciated and very helpful. I use a Mitchell technoarm which is a medium mass of 11g. Anyone in OZ sells the EAT cart? I got mine from the UK. Not aware of any Oz retailers. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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