JBL Synthesis Owners Thread

[Steam]

22 hours ago, Marc said:

I caved .. I've ordered the SDP-55 and 2 x SDA-7120 which can all run Dante. Should be arriving in approx two weeks.

Will report back once they find their homes in the rack.

Did you demo these somewhere?  Or just jumped in?

 

 

[Marc]

1 minute ago, Steam said:

Did you demo these somewhere?  Or just jumped in?

I'd like to say I did demo them ... but they're made by Arcam, and I've come from Arcam processors and amps and have always liked them. So yes, jumped in.

[Steam]

6 minutes ago, Marc said:

I'd like to say I did demo them ... but they're made by Arcam, and I've come from Arcam processors and amps and have always liked them. So yes, jumped in.

Ah...Ok.  I’m curious about the 55 and wondered if a retailer had one on demo somewhere.

[Marc]

2 minutes ago, Steam said:

Ah...Ok.  I’m curious about the 55 and wondered if a retailer had one on demo somewhere.

None in the country yet, the first (mine) is getting loaded onto a plane in the next few days headed this way.

[Grant Slack]

On 16/09/2019 at 8:10 PM, Spizz said:

 

Both models will be available in Australia in early 2020. The JBL Synthesis SDP-55 AV Receiver is expected to sell locally for $9,999, while the SDR-35 is expected to sell for $12,499. Prices will be confirmed when stock arrives.

I wonder where this (bold) price came from. Was it here? It didn't seem to be anywhere near the eventual result of $13k.
 
Note the US price of the 55 is 20% less than the 35. But here, equal. Something is wrong, AFAICT.

 

cheers

Grant

Edited June 2, 2020 by Grant Slack

[Marc]

Seeking clarification for you with AU Distributor, @Grant Slack

"Prices will be confirmed when stock arrives" - which is this week so all should become clear.

[DTJ]

I have been wondering the same re RRP - and why there is not a 20% difference in AU as per the US.

I also wondered where I had read the $10k RRP claim, so thanks for pointing it out here.

 

I called a Melbourne JBL Synthesis dealer ( I am in Brisbane) last week, they basically said they would not know the price until stock arrived, and that was unknown, and that JBL can be notoriously slow sending stock.

 

So any update would be nice. I was banking on them being closer to $10k, or at least 20% less than $13k.

Otherwise you start wondering why you would pt take the "free" amps in the SDP35. The only loss appears to be no balanced XLR. But future resale and flexibility would be vastly improved with the inbuilt amplifiers.

Same box, no amps... should be cheaper.

[Steam]

On 26/05/2020 at 5:57 PM, Marc said:

Seeking clarification for you with AU Distributor, @Grant Slack

"Prices will be confirmed when stock arrives" - which is this week so all should become clear.

Still no update?

[Marc]

The prices as quoted here, https://www.stereo.net.au/news/jbl-announces-two-new-synthesis-av-processor-amplifiers are correct.

[DTJ]

EDIT>... Deleted original post.

I take back my comments. These are $6,000 and $7500 US. I thought they were $4500 and $6000 US.

 

But still seems lie we get shafted here. I still calculate abut $11k pulls up the total cost from the US, all freight, duty, GST.

The AU price and margins seem a bit rich.

 

Interestingly i have a boat and a lot or marine electronics in Australia are not grossly different to that in the US (after converting dollar and GST) - In fact a lot of US buyers import back from legitimate Au stores as it works out well for them compared to US prices. For the liukes of Garmin etc. I guess different business models for different industries.

Edited June 2, 2020 by DTJ
wrong US RRP info quoted.

[Marc]

This conversation again

 

Did you know freight has risen from €1/kg to as much as €9/kg yeah since COVID-19?

 

In the US, dealers buy direct from Harman (where the company is based), where as elsewhere, dealers buy from an importer who has to handle all freight costs, warehousing, marketing, warranty (including employing techs- not covered by manufacturer), staff, and so on. 

 

The direct USD/AUD conversion comes out at $11,030 + GST and Duty = $13,042 + shipping agent/brokerage fees, and who knows what the freight costs are right now.

 

There's got to be some actual profit margin in there so that after all of the above, the importer/distributor who makes it available, submits products (that can't be sold as new) for reviews, exhibits at shows and puts events on, etc, can actually stay in business.

 

You can now see why the distributor of Focal when it changed hands recently increased the AUD RRP by as much as 40%. Without these importers and distributors in Australia, we wouldn't have access to the many brands of the world that we do. It's the cost of living on a wonderful, but remote island. I'm not saying 40% is acceptable of course.

 

But for how many times I've explained this on SN, the same complaint that Australians get ripped off surfaces at least once a week.

[Marc]

 

23 minutes ago, DTJ said:

Interestingly i have a boat and a lot or marine electronics in Australia are not grossly different to that in the US (after converting dollar and GST)

Was that pre-COVID-19, and brand new line just released (that's been costed according to today's market and its challenges)?

It's also a lot cheaper to ship a pallet load of sounders in than it is a pallet of amplifiers, I assume.

[DTJ]

I might be off the mark a little -but not that much...

 

$6k US based on a conversion of 64.5c is A$9,300. A$10,000 if you call if for $0.60 conversion

Freight I might be short on at $300 "assumed". But I also assume the distributor does not import from Harmon 1 carton at a time. I also assume they come on the slow boat (I beleive that is what I was advised), not a plane. Cost may be up since Covid, granted I don't now for sure on these products, but I do know every contractor I deal with that has continued importing during covid (when the product was available to send) by the container, out of Asia or the US, is not reporting significantly increased shipping. But it is maybe increased for some industries, certainly air freight. But I am not seeing it.

Duty is still 5% I believe.

GST is on everything (cost/freight/duty).

So I stand by the vicinity of $11k give or take based on the dollar being 65ish.

I could understand the local cost and mark up if that was raw supply cost, BUT included is A$9300 at full US RRP which already includes whatever margin they apply there built in. ie. I am sure the Harman wholesale cost to the AU distributor is quite a bit less than $6k US. My experience is the US are also notorious for "street prices". So RRP does not seem the norm over there. So something starts to get stinky in my opinion.

But as I said, we are well used to that in Australia, its been going on a long time.

 

However the US direct distribution model may account for some of it, I was not aware of that - too many fingers in the pie here maybe? I am all for retailers having a fair mark up. But maybe in Australia we have a distributor with a hefty mark up that is then doubled for a retailer who also needs a healthy mark up.

 

I can purchase quite expensive marine electronics (cartons comparable or larger to this audio gear), through local AU suppliers at prices comparable to US prices and in some cases just better (allowing dollar conversion plus freight + duty + GST).  Makes it real easy to support the local - they are often within less than 10% of the risky imported scenario, if not equal. I like local (and often buy) as much as the next guy, but only where reasonable. I could say the same for a JVC projector I have. Pretty fairly priced new in AU where I purchased it, and comparable to a US import scenario. Although that was not the case with every AU retailer.

 

I don't think Covid has seen consumer grade purchases inflate unless there was demand and shortage of supply, like a face mask. Day to day non-essential consumer goods don't seem to be effected much - if anything businesses I see fire sale items to keep turnover moving. Bunnings/Aldi and Woolworth etc are clear exceptions... I am sure a few items have had delayed delivery, juts like these units that were due out earlier than now. But that wait should not see inflated RRP prices now they are available. That was a "short" term supply delay, not a massive increased demand delay.

 

But maybe the premium end audio industry just operates on a different level, or maybe our AU distribution model here is expensive as we are too small and have too many people in it.

Maybe local "street prices" here will be below RRP and thus our local deal will look ok in a few months. I don't buy a lot of high end audio, so can't say I am too knowledgeable about what this gear really costs vs list RRP. Some industries seem structured for heavy "discounting" from RRP.

Either way, they cost what they cost. Just my opinion on this compared to other "hobby" type leisure industries electronics I see.

 

PS. I hadn't read this conversation on SN, but it does come up on most forums a bit!. Sorry...

[Marc]

1 hour ago, DTJ said:

But maybe the premium end audio industry just operates on a different level, or maybe our AU distribution model here is expensive as we are too small and have too many people in it.

I think this is a good point that probably accounts for a lot of it. 
I guess we're getting off topic and I'm breaking my own "no politics or economics" rule - but I get fired up as I know many of these distributors on a personal level, and to imply price gouging or "ripping off consumers" fires me up, as there's nothing further from the truth.

 

Anyway, let's move on

 

I'm literally in the middle of wiring the SDP-55 up as we speak .. hoping to make noise tonight.

[DTJ]

Agreed. I guess the higher prices than what were predicted just got me thinking about where its all going.

And I don't begrudge anyone in business a margin - I have a business, do many friends. I guess you just like to think (as a consumer) the manufacturers try to get the product to market in a competitive way, for all countries.

 

Look forward to the reports back when it is all up and running.

Cheers.

[Grant Slack]

5 hours ago, Marc said:

The prices as quoted here, https://www.stereo.net.au/news/jbl-announces-two-new-synthesis-av-processor-amplifiers are correct.

Hello Marc,

 

thank you. That link is the same link where this poster would have found the prices of $9,999 and $12,499, and the same link where a week ago prices of $12,999 and $12,999 were quoted. Today it is $12,999 and $14,999 on the same link. Maybe someone was feeding you provisional prices.

 

Please let us know how installation and impressions go. And maybe a photo or two.

 

Regards,

Grant

[Marc]

20 minutes ago, Grant Slack said:

Hello Marc,

 

thank you. That link is the same link where this poster would have found the prices of $9,999 and $12,499, and the same link where a week ago prices of $12,999 and $12,999 were quoted. Today it is $12,999 and $14,999 on the same link. Maybe someone was feeding you provisional prices.

 

Please let us know how installation and impressions go. And maybe a photo or two.

 

Regards,

Grant

At all times, since the first time that article was published, it stated next to the price - ""Prices will be confirmed when stock arrives".  It was provisional yes, at the time of writing as indicated. It was updated at least three times which again, at that time, the indication seemed more accurate. 

 

I'm beginning to think it's not worth mentioning prices at all until the stock hits dealers in Australia in future, as being provisional it's always possible it will change. 

[Marc]

Anyway, the price distraction aside - installation has gone relatively smoothly aside from a lengthy firmware update which brings with it the full Dirac Live Bass Management. I've had a steep learning curve on Dante this evening, and have just set up the channel routing. I must admit, it's nice to just connect a Cat6 cable between pre and amps, rather than a bunch of RCA or XLR cables. 

 

For some reason one of the amps was being assigned as the Master clock, which I've now worked out how to assign the SDP-55 as the Master.

There is no literature or tutorial on how to configure the SDP-55 specifically for Dante, and I'm now going to check my channel assignments. If I've managed to get it right, it'll be Dirac Live time in the morning and hopefully making some noise.

Loving the on-unit Menu system, more than the OSD. That said, the best way to set it up is though a browser and just hitting the IP address from a laptop. Super quick and easy.

 

There's a touch of what appears to be transformer hum from the SDA-7120 amps, which I'll look further into tomorrow. Once the cabinet is closed it probably won't be audible but I generally leave the cabinet open when watching movies just for additional airflow.

 

Progress though.

[Marc]

OK a challenging start. For the life of me I can't get sound out of Dante. I've done all the channel routing (not to be confused with Channel Mapping, which you can't do on the SDP-55 and below) but all I can get is scary crack and pops through speakers. There's no JBL support literature for this yet, and Dante don't offer support for third-party hardware manufacturers. I'm at the mercy of waiting on a couple of emails sent to Harman support overnight.

In the meantime, I think I will revert back to trusty XLR connections which kinda sucks, as I upgraded all my amps at the same time to take advantage of Dante networking.

[fury]

Hey @Marc,

 

Assume you've got Dante Controller running on your PC, and Dante Virtual Soundcard (DVS)?

 

You need to be running DVS and have it running, and then choose it as your soundcards output.

 

You then need to set up the relationship between PC output and Amp input in Dante Controller similar to the below:

 

 

If you are wanting to send specific apps/software to Dante from your PC (as opposed to everything) then you need Dante Via.

 

Let me know if you need help, can always remote in if required.

Edited June 3, 2020 by fury

[Marc]

Thanks @fury. I don't think the local PC is required in this case for anything other than to config the Dante Controller, which I've done.

There's no ongoing relationship between the PC and AV system once the Dante config has been set.

 

 

I've routed the channels as above, but only getting horrible pops and crackles - which from my reading means a clock issue. I've set the processor (SDP-55) as Master, so not entirely sure what else I can do at this point.

 

[fury]

Ahh it's Dante between the processor and amps.... not from a PC as a source.

Got it.

 

I would have thought Output 1/2 from the SDP-55 would be Front L/R...

The manual doesn't appear to list any info about Dante which is quite odd.

I would have thought they'd offer some form of mapping between the Pre and Amps.

 

Dante will elect its own master clock if you don't.

I assume you have within the "Clock Status" tab above?

 

Can you double click the event log in the lower right and show us what it says?

This may help identify if there's a Dante issue.

 

Dante has always been quite straight forward in my usage of it.

You could always try and route Dante Via (i believe you can get a trial license) to each Amp output to confirm its operation....

You can also go the other way and have the Pre send audio to output via your PC's speakers.

If either of the above work then it may help highlight where the issue lies.

 

Failing that, wait for JBL support to assist...

[DTJ]

Hi marc,

any updates on how the sdp-55 is going?

[Marc]

Dante is still broken and has been acknowledged by Arcam/Harman/JBL as broken - I'm disappointed as Dante was the only reason I upgraded my entire suite of electronics.

 

With each firmware update the SDP-55 has been getting better otherwise, but I keep it there hoping Dante will magically work soon.

In the meantime I bought a Trinnov Altitude16 and its amazing (but not Dante, yet).

 

You can follow the development of the SDP-55 here: https://www.avsforum.com/threads/jbl-synthesis-sdp-55-16ch-9-1-6-atmos-surround-sound-processor.3090298/

[Marc]

The SDR-35 review is in, and only echoes my thoughts on the SDP-55.

https://www.stereo.net.au/reviews/jbl-synthesis-sdr-35-av-receiver-review

 

Granted, Dante is still broken, but most of the bugs are now gone. It's a stellar pair of products.