Cabling conundrum

[Astronutter]

I just bought a length (yet to arrive) of a high performance balanced interconnect. My system is fully balanced source to amp.

 

in the absence of a second length of the same high performance balanced interconnect, I am wondering where the new cable will be best used? Between my one of my sources (Dac or phone stage or 2nd CD player) and Pre-amp or between the pre-amp and power amp?

 

maybe it doesn’t matter, maybe it does -I’d appreciate your thoughts.  Buying a second length is not an option at this time.

 

I can of course try it and let my ears make the decision, but my cabinet is tightly packed and its a bugger to swap cables around.

 

thanks for reading

[Ittaku]

I would say put it in the lower voltage/signal run since that would be the most prone to deterioration and interference. In your setup that would be pre to power amp, (unless your phono to phono stage is balanced.) It also means that all of your sources would benefit from it being there.

[Decky]

How do you define "high performance" ? 

[Ittaku]

36 minutes ago, Decky said:

How do you define "high performance" ? 

"Expensive" is the only way to define it in the audiophile world since most interconnects measure almost identically, or don't have any measurements at all.

[Astronutter]

Expensive by my standards, but the reviews I’ve read all point to this being a really good cable. Still performance may vary from system so I won’t know until I try it.  The suggestion of pre to power sounds sensible as then all components get a benefit.

 

the phono is balanced all the way from the cartridge to the power amp.

[Marc]

1 hour ago, Ittaku said:

"Expensive" is the only way to define it in the audiophile world since most interconnects measure almost identically, or don't have any measurements at all.

Not relevant to the topic. Please start a topic or contribute to one of the many others in The Great Debate, if you must.

[Decky]

1 hour ago, Astronutter said:

Expensive by my standards, but the reviews I’ve read all point to this being a really good cable. Still performance may vary from system so I won’t know until I try it.  The suggestion of pre to power sounds sensible as then all components get a benefit.

 

the phono is balanced all the way from the cartridge to the power amp.

I would definitely reward the phono signal with fancy wire - hoping that the said wire has decent impedance characteristics and shielding. Keep in mind that balanced cable configuration removes a lot of problems simply by its nature (dual differential signal path). However, same impedance rules apply as for any other SE cable - low C; low R; moderate L. 

[needlerunner]

Just curious to why you would only buy a single cable to start with. You must have had some idea at the time of It's intended  use, prior to purchase?

[jeromelang]

That fancy wire may have higher capacitance making it unsuitable for phono use.

[audiofeline]

I would put the best cable as close as possible to the source - that way you are extracting the best possible signal for the other components to deal with.  If the best goes downstream it may make a difference but it's still getting a lower-quality signal to process. 

 

It also depends what your current "weakest link" cable is.  Ultimately, experimentation will be your best guide. 

 

Edited September 15, 2019 by audiofeline

[A9X]

10 hours ago, Astronutter said:

the phono is balanced all the way from the cartridge to the power amp.

In reality, that's not likely. As it hits the pre the first stage will be an unbalancer, then the internals will be single ended and then a balancing stage last. It's probably the same in the phono stage too.

 

Balanced cables are by and large a waste of money. To use them, at least one more stage is needed in each device and it the performance of the driver and receiver that determine if the differential mode will add any benefit. Sadly, in almost all devices they use a single opamp and 4 resistor design which gives maybe a 60dB CMRR, not much different at all from a single ended design, especially in light of the short distances cables run domestically and the relative electrical quiet of a home.

 

As it's not going to make a skerrick of difference, you can use it anywhere.

 

Lots of info on balanced system, by people who actually understand the, eg Bill Whitlock, and not some audiophile, here.

[Astronutter]

I’m no expert that’s for sure, but I have been led to believe that the Aqvox   Phono pre is fully balanced, I am using wireworld balanced cable from the cartridge to the Aqvox and then balanced into the pnyx. As I said I’m no expert though.

[A9X]

15 hours ago, jeromelang said:

That fancy wire may have higher capacitance making it unsuitable for phono use.

That's only true if it's between the tonearm socket and the input of the phono preamp and an MM cart is being used. Doesn't apply to MCs as they are too low impedance.

[A9X]

5 hours ago, Astronutter said:

I’m no expert that’s for sure, but I have been led to believe that the Aqvox   Phono pre is fully balanced

I looked at their website, and assuming their brochure is true, I stand corrected, it does appear to have a symmetrical signal path all the way through. Sorry for that.

 

Edit: Sorry, I also meant to add that this type of design is especially rare as being symmetrical will raise the noise floor of the unit 3dB (make the MC stage design more difficult), and it's especially hard to maintain the symmetry throughout the device. Two of my last pres were this sort of design, one fully my own and the other loosely based around an Allen Wright design.

Edited September 16, 2019 by A9X

[Astronutter]

You’ve got me, I am not as technical as you, the Aqvox does not seem to editorialise the signal from the cartridge (I have three mc’s that I seem to rotate randomly) . I’m going to put the new interconnect between pre and power and see how it goes.

 

i appreciate all comments and feedback. Ultimately my ears will determine how it all ends up.

 

best

 

lars