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powerinnumbers

How to achieve ATMOS with a terrible roof line

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Imagine this

From the main seating area ( only 3 chairs wide ) I look up and I have a raked ceiling on the left that goes from 2.1 mtrs to 2.7 mtrs.

The rake from the side left wall meets the upper level of ceiling inside where the left ATMOS speakers would go ideally. If I placed the left upper speakers as close to the rake as possible while still being horizontal, that would leave me with a spacing of only 2 mtrs to the right speaker, to be in alignment. This is far from ideal but what to do?

All I could imagine is speakers inside the rake but angled down to vertical, then the other side I would have to suspend the right side speakers like a hanging light fixture would be hung.

 

I have a really lovely room almost perfect for cinema but looks like the ATMOS will be a real challenge

 

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Do you mean 2m between inceiling speakers? If so then it's fine. Most surround effects go to 5 speakers. Those Atmos are for the immersive object base 3D effects. 

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If you've got an AVR with decent room equalisation it should deal with time alignment issues from the difference in distances.

 

You can also buy in-ceiling speakers with angled drivers - some fixed (e.g. Krix)and others with adjustable tweeter angles.

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1 hour ago, Irek said:

Do you mean 2m between inceiling speakers? If so then it's fine. Most surround effects go to 5 speakers. Those Atmos are for the immersive object base 3D effects. 

Yes I do, but it was probably overstated too, it might be 1.8 m . It would look silly in my opinion that the speakers are inside the width of the seating. 

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31 minutes ago, Quark said:

If you've got an AVR with decent room equalisation it should deal with time alignment issues from the difference in distances.

If the left speakers were in the rake so that they were 3 or 400mm lower than the right side, it would be ok? You may be right but it would be ugly

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2 minutes ago, powerinnumbers said:

If the left speakers were in the rake so that they were 3 or 400mm lower than the right side, it would be ok? You may be right but it would be ugly

The aesthetics may not be to your taste, but it can work well subject to decent room equalisation.

 

What AVR are you planning to use?

 

Also note that the Krix speakers I linked to also come in a standard version for a flat ceiling. I'm using these in my Atmos set-up.

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3 minutes ago, Quark said:

What AVR are you planning to use?

Prob a Yamaha CX 5200 pre pro

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1.8m is still ok methink. + You can paint the grills so they blend in. (thin paint, preferably spray)

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3 hours ago, powerinnumbers said:

Prob a Yamaha CX 5200 pre pro

That should be fine.

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https://www.melbournehifi.com.au/products/cambridge-audio-c46-in-ceiling-speaker?utm_medium=cpc&utm_source=googlepla&variant=7152204218419&gclid=CjwKCAjwkenqBRBgEiwA-bZVthm2bPpRN8VoB0wLhiyR-hWeJKFAz4PiKls_eLZu2MpK8chR4HMJXxoCSBIQAvD_BwE

 

From memory I think these are meant to be the same size as a halogen downlight, could be wrong though.

 

Maybe you could get a hanging light fixture to match??

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Nice idea. I don't think it's frequency range is adequate though

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For sound affects you may be ok, that’s what subs are for in surround sound anyway, Bose have made a half decent living using speakers with less oomph than those ones.

 

thinking also a nice white bookshelf speaker like a q acoustics may look ok hanging from a ceiling?? They have Rounded cabinets.

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4 hours ago, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

thinking also a nice white bookshelf speaker

Just painted matt grey the ceiling :)

Dunno

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21 hours ago, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

https://www.melbournehifi.com.au/products/cambridge-audio-c46-in-ceiling-speaker?utm_medium=cpc&utm_source=googlepla&variant=7152204218419&gclid=CjwKCAjwkenqBRBgEiwA-bZVthm2bPpRN8VoB0wLhiyR-hWeJKFAz4PiKls_eLZu2MpK8chR4HMJXxoCSBIQAvD_BwE

 

From memory I think these are meant to be the same size as a halogen downlight, could be wrong though.

 

Maybe you could get a hanging light fixture to match??

Never seen these before, a cool concept.

Now if they were wireless and battery powered... ....

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Personally, I mounted Kef Q100s on angled brackets on my ceiling, aimed at listener position. Never regretted it.

 

Addicted to audio has them ultra cheap too. If they have any left.

 

I'm personally not a fan of in ceiling speakers. After an entire lifetime of hearing and beliieving how emportant enclosure design is to speaker sound, the idea if just cutting a hole in plaster and either leaving an open cavity behind, or doing a half baked enclosure, just didn't make sense.

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On 15/08/2019 at 9:04 AM, powerinnumbers said:

Yes I do, but it was probably overstated too, it might be 1.8 m . It would look silly in my opinion that the speakers are inside the width of the seating. 

Draw a top-down layout (ignore the roof rake) of the room .... showing where the speakers will go .... and we can tell you what's up.

 

If any of the speakers are going to be on an angled roof surface, then adjustable angle tweeters is almost essential.

 

On 21/08/2019 at 8:22 AM, Mobe1969 said:

and either leaving an open cavity behind, or doing a half baked enclosure, just didn't make sense.

You can also buy ones which don't compromise.

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On 15/08/2019 at 9:05 AM, powerinnumbers said:

If the left speakers were in the rake so that they were 3 or 400mm lower than the right side, it would be ok?

The issue is not so much the different distance to your ear ... but the speakers pointed in different directions.    If one is on an angled roof, and the other is on a flat roof .... then that's not the best.

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14 hours ago, davewantsmoore said:

Draw a top-down layout (ignore the roof rake) of the room .... showing where the speakers will go .... and we can tell you what's up

 imagine a square 4m wide room, a 5 m deep room. I'll only have room for rear channels that point from a 45 deg behind, so I don't think I will be able to have 7.1.4, we'll prob go with 5.1.4

( im no good at drawing )

 

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It isn't the 45 degree angle that I'm so worried about.... it's just the overall room dimensions.   It seems unlikely you'll be able to fit 7 channels or 4 atmos and follow the guide closely.     I'd be thinking 5.1.2 tops.

 

https://www.dolby.com/us/en/guide/7.1.4-overhead-speaker-setup-guide.pdf

 

If you cannot follow the dolby guide closely (angles and relative distances), then you will get better performance dropping back to less speakers that are setup more closely in line with the guides.

 

 

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On 06/09/2019 at 11:23 AM, davewantsmoore said:

I'd be thinking 5.1.2 tops.

I'm thinking 5.1.4 actually. I've taken a new approach ( thought bubble ) and believe I can manage 4 ATMOS bookshelf speakers with 2 mounted to the rear wall pointing down and at an angle approximately 1600mm behind the listening position.  The other 2 the same distance in front and same angles, all I have to do is mount the left front into the raked ceiling and make it tidy, they would all be at the same height since I can mount to the right hand side wall down from the very high ceiling that side.

 

If I am to do this, i would do in stages since i don't have a capable pre-pro for ATMOS yet, only have a 7.1 pre-pro

Would the rear height speakers in my example also be able to double as rear center surrounds in a 7.1 system? I think it would. That would allow me time to save for a proper pre-pro and the second pair of heights. 

 

The speakers I was thinking of are KEF Q150 or 350 ? Thoughts? My existing speakers in 5.1 are all VAF towers.

Edited by powerinnumbers

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If you are to rear wall mount some height speakers have a look/consider the Dali Alteco C1.

 

Currently I have these mounted on the rear wall and switched to downfiring, obtained a pretty good atmos effect with this (5.1.2) and the direct sound is certainly better than ceiling bouncing it.  My lounge is almost against the rear wall (currently anyway - to be amended when we move)

 

Just a thought

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On 14/08/2019 at 11:49 PM, powerinnumbers said:

Imagine this

From the main seating area ( only 3 chairs wide ) I look up and I have a raked ceiling on the left that goes from 2.1 mtrs to 2.7 mtrs.

I am wondering if worth posting a pic or two of the room, not sure where got to but I recently saw a sloped raked ceiling setup and atmos in  this worked 

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On 06/09/2019 at 9:19 AM, powerinnumbers said:

im no good at drawing

 

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