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Thor B8F Smart Filter 8 way Surge Protection $70ea!!! + other Thor bits cheap

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8 minutes ago, Muon N' said:

I'm not all that committed to surge protection with boards, they only offer limited protection for a limited time, and the warranties are a joke, ever heard of a successful claim.

Well it's obviously not that much anyway if that's the storage in just one of my power amps.

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Guest Muon N'

This paper deals with the USA study, but as we can see typical surges are going to kill a board pretty quickly.

 

Not sure if our situation here would be better or worse, but..

surges.jpg.3a89c3097ab11e3bd97cbb5d25338e15.jpg

 

 

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1 hour ago, Muon N' said:

I'm not all that committed to surge protection with boards, they only offer limited protection for a limited time, and the warranties are a joke, ever heard of a successful claim.

 

1 hour ago, Ittaku said:

Funny seeing the power board claim a surge of up to 900 joules. This is the documentation from my power amps:

image.png.fca3aabec4f2be221c39698668e1ed97.png

Completely unrelated, and random association, but funny nonetheless.

Cheap surge protectors are typically one time only use.  If they have copped a major surge or power spike the Metal-Oxide Varistors (MOVs) inside let go pretty quickly and you need to ditch them and buy a new one.  I cannot see on the Thor power strips having any indicator if a major surge has been absorbed.  My APS ones do and they are designed for high end servers.   This should be present in more expensive models. 

 

Also you want to look at the clamping voltage of the power board/surge protector.   Some cheaper ones have clamping voltage of of 300-400Vac which also is useless for sensitive electronics....  I believe the Thors are around 275Vac so that should save most gear from any unwanted power spikes. 

 

I still don't get the loss in dynamics people talk about when they use these devices,  unless they have already a faulty one or one that has been damaged by a power surge already.

 

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1 minute ago, Syrot said:

 

I still don't get the loss in dynamics people talk about when they use these devices,  unless they have already a faulty one or one that has been damaged by a power surge already.

You're talking about power related changes here. In my experience people hear a myriad of things, and the dynamics choking thing is something people converge on as a prevailing opinion... Whilst I hear nothing.

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Guest Muon N'
10 minutes ago, Ittaku said:

You're talking about power related changes here. In my experience people hear a myriad of things, and the dynamics choking thing is something people converge on as a prevailing opinion... Whilst I hear nothing.

 

It's pretty evident in my experience with my system, here. So I can't even guess why you don't hear a difference.

And I didn't want to hear a difference, I wanted it to be all positive! with the amp filtered too. So no expectation bias.

I think it might be a bit of false pattern recognition to think we are all hearing something that doesn't exist, to be honest.

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5 minutes ago, Muon N' said:

It's pretty evident in my experience with my system, here. So I can't even guess why you don't hear a difference.

And I didn't want to hear a difference, I wanted it to be all positive! with the amp filtered too. So no expectation bias.

I think it might be a bit of false pattern recognition to think we are all hearing something that doesn't exist, to be honest.

Mine are mostly class A power amps, so working with your observation and my expanding on your theory, I shouldn't hear it choking the dynamics.

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Guest Muon N'
6 minutes ago, Ittaku said:

Mine are mostly class A power amps, so working with your observation and my expanding on your theory, I shouldn't hear it choking the dynamics.

OK, that sounds fair, I totally misunderstood what you where getting at :oops:

 

It does sound like this is what is going on with amps taking a hit via filtering, at least some amps anyway.

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Guest Muon N'

Now if someone with a class A amp finds it takes a hit, then we are back to square one :cry: But there are no many true class A amp anyway I guess, lots of pretenders though.

Edited by Muon N'

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1 minute ago, Muon N' said:

It does sound like this is what is going on with amps taking a hit via filtering, at least some amps anyway.

I've said this before in another thread where we were discussing power filtration, and it's my belief that for it to be truly effective, you would need a very high current regenerator rather than these simple passive filters, yet those come at great expense and can only be afforded in the most expensive systems. Paradoxically, the most expensive systems have the most robust power supplies, filtering, reserves, and regulation so they stand to benefit the least (if at all) from filtration.

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Well i bought the Thor on it being a great price, i've got one hooked up to my phono stage, DAC, Streamer and TT, no issues there, actually i reckon its made the blacks blacker TBH so no complaints.

 

I bought 2 but have not hooked up the second yet.  Seems to be a quite few experiencing the same issue using the Thor with their respective amps, so call me paranoid but given I purchased the Thor on advice I thought I'd do the same on the Belkin!

I found the Belkin pro 4000 8 way which was mentioned earlier in this thread for $85 delivered using current code PBLITZ. Not quite $30 but none the less a very good price and in colour black which is what i prefer.  It also has a 3m chord which is a bonus for me and my room set up.

.....Anyone interested in this here is the link. 

 

I will leave the Thor hooked up where it is, but use the Belkin with my AVR, Integrated Amp, BluRay Player, VHS, x2 Subs and TV. 

Way too much hassel getting to the back of cabinets etc, so will remove the cheapie and roll with the Belkin based on the experience herein.

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Are not the Thor's Black?  The ones I bought are black...

55 minutes ago, 08Boss302 said:

I will leave the Thor hooked up where it is, but use the Belkin with my AVR, Integrated Amp, BluRay Player, VHS, x2 Subs and TV. 

Way too much hassel getting to the back of cabinets etc, so will remove the cheapie and roll with the Belkin based on the experience herein.

How powerful are your subs? If they are high output they should be on different power board/ power points to your other gear.  These items will draw a lot of power and if you love your bass it may trip out the power board if your subs and all that other gear plugged into the same power board.    You should be OK for that VHS thing,  aren't they  steam powered :)

Edited by Syrot

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Guest Muon N'

Be interesting if the Belkin if it is filtered (says it is) will also effect the amp performance.

 

No another note, I see that ad for the Belkin says it protects against voltage drops....can't see how it is going to do that, unless it has some super capacitors squeezed in there, or something.

Belkin have made some mistakes in the USA, including a board with a rotating plug that was a fire hazard.

 

Something I noticed with Belkin, they do not state the response time.

 

Edit: hmm... older model, but one reviewer's experiences show how these warranties work.

WWW.PRODUCTREVIEW.COM.AU

Belkin 8-Way Surge Protector F9G820au2M-GRY: 3 out of 5 stars from 2 genuine reviews on Australia's largest opinion site ProductReview.com.au.

 

Edited by Muon N'

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Guest Muon N'

I'd like to open up one of those Belkin's and have a look at what it has in there.

 

I'll have to wait for one to show up in an op shop :D

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On 02/11/2019 at 11:03 AM, Mr Thorens said:

Further testing today. As good as the Thor is at reducing noise from an overall perspective the Belkin Pro 4000 is superior on high current integrated amp. The $139 Belkin also is superior to the $700 Isotek Polaris as it cleans things up, opens up soundstage and unlike the Polaris doesn’t seem to crush dynamics. It’s a great buy. 

This above post was the post that peaked my interest in the Belkin Board.  I think this was the first post that highlighted or noticed some dampening of dynamics.

 

 

On 31/10/2019 at 9:24 PM, Mr Thorens said:

Well tonight I’ve noticed something with the Thor. Whilst it cleans up the signal and makes the space sound blacker, especially good with solo piano, when moving to jazz and rock I notice some loss of bass depth and speed. So it’s time for a look inside. Here’s pics. The current runs through PCB tracks and 17AWG (1.0mm2) hookup wire. So it might be softening dynamics. The Belkin Pro 4000 board doesn’t have this issue, although it’s not quite as quiet. 

8E768B50-098E-4372-B8E7-F1F7AE351011.jpeg

D968324E-79DF-4003-B140-F6304EA225AD.jpeg

AC149BB2-A0CD-4BAD-B448-B4C0C70768D8.jpeg

 

46 minutes ago, Syrot said:

Are not the Thor's Black?  The ones I bought are black...

How powerful are your subs? If they are high output they should be on different power board/ power points to your other gear.  These items will draw a lot of power and if you love your bass it may trip out the power board if your subs and all that other gear plugged into the same power board.    You should be OK for that VHS thing,  aren't they  steam powered :)

Sorry, yes thats correct, the Thor board i bought was black but there are some belkin out there in white, i was pleased I got a black Belkin board.  My cables are all black and one large white board would have looked wildly out of place.  

The subs are SVS sb2000, running audyssey they are not running that hot at all, i've tuned to them my taste but I dont think any problem will come of them powered from the board.

 

17 minutes ago, Muon N' said:

Be interesting if the Belkin if it is filtered (says it is) will also effect the amp performance.

 

No another note, I see that ad for the Belkin says it protects against voltage drops....can't see how it is going to do that, unless it has some super capacitors squeezed in there, or something.

Belkin have made some mistakes in the USA, including a board with a rotating plug that was a fire hazard.

 

Something I noticed with Belkin, they do not state the response time.

 

Edit: hmm... onler model, but one reviewer's experiences show how these warranties work.

WWW.PRODUCTREVIEW.COM.AU

Belkin 8-Way Surge Protector F9G820au2M-GRY: 3 out of 5 stars from 2 genuine reviews on Australia's largest opinion site ProductReview.com.au.

 

Thanks for posting the reviews, I just read throught them.  The first one seemed like serious bad luck, could happen to $1000 board or a $10 board i reckon.  In all honesty the surge stuff is probably of less interest to me than the potential filtering I think. 

I mean i have a $20 board there right now, surly either the Thor or Belkin is going to be equal or slightly better in that respect BUT if either can provide some filtering that doesnt hinder any sound its a win IMO.

Now, i am not sure which will suit my set up best but there has been a bit of trend from a few members using the Thor board  and an experience posted above with the Belkin is otherwise I thought i'd give it a go.  I have a vincent sv237mkII which is 10w class A, then onto class B.  I rarely go hard on volume and probably dont step out of the first 10w, but again the Thor has proven troublesome for some.

I'll likely try both TBH and whichever I dont use i'll find another spot for but with quite a few posts stating a similar finding with Thor I  and given its so easy to try something else I grabbed the belkin.  I'll fit that first and if i like what i hear i'll save myself the jungle of cables and ridiculously tight squeeze in switching boards over and over hahah

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Guest Muon N'

Yes, I read that view by Mr Thorens.

 

My amp isn't high current, It's a valve amp and around 20 watts a channel at that, I use about 10 to 20% of the volume dial.

 

That and the claims made by Belkin has me curious to see what is or isn't inside them.

 

Edit: You get a very low parts cost total with the Thor, and the Belkin is half the RRP so wondering on that angle also..

Edited by Muon N'

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Guest Muon N'

Has been for a while now.

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On 20/11/2019 at 10:46 PM, 08Boss302 said:

The subs are SVS sb2000, running audyssey they are not running that hot at all, i've tuned to them my taste but I dont think any problem will come of them powered from the board.

 

 

I also have two SB2000s running off two Thor 8 plug boards both attached to a Thor PS10 Power Station. Along with 2 amps, a receiver, TV, BDP, and games consoles. Never had a problem.

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No surprise performance a little lower on fast rates of power draw when there's a few small caps in the way.

 

Bought many of them. Prolly won't run them on the audio stuff all the time, but have a ton of stuff I'm happy to keep protected the rest of the time.

 

Oddly my TV looms a little richer in colour with one in.

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On 20/11/2019 at 10:11 PM, Muon N' said:

No another note, I see that ad for the Belkin says it protects against voltage drops....can't see how it is going to do that, unless it has some super capacitors squeezed in there, or something.

I'd like to know what they mean by that too.  Don't know how that can be achieved with a passive device.

No amount of capacitors or super capacitors will help because they pass AC, they can't store it.  Any capacitors in these devices are only for filtering.

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I just got mine today and no one has mentioned the best thing - lead labels!!

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Guest Muon N'
19 minutes ago, Pac-man said:

I just got mine today and no one has mentioned the best thing - lead labels!!

Yeah, a nice little bonus, especially if you have a bunch of leads.

 

I have two leads, but even handy there :wub:

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Two 8-plug units bought just now, thanks for the link and user findings. 

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I bought 4 but all 4 of them have audible transformer hum...

 

I have plugged them to various loads but as soon as something is plugged, there's a humming noise emitted from the board..

 

anybody else noticed this ?

 

Cheers..

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Guest Muon N'

I only have an 8 plug one with a PC system and that's fine, and the daisy chained Duo's that my CD player is plugged into are OK also.

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