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jack_b

Tube Amp for Yamaha NS-2000s

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36 minutes ago, jack_b said:

Hi all, apologies for the late reply - have been out all weekend. 

Thanks so far for all the input - huge help and lots to think about!
I'd love to take @Willmax and @Grizzly up on the listening offer but am in VIC unfortunately. 

I'm pretty omnivorous with my music taste - I'll listen to anything and everything. And I do like to crank it from time to time, so I was hoping for something that would do it all. 

At the moment I've got a Vincent SV236MK, which has a tube pre-amp and solid state power amp at 150 watts. So I have the hybrid approach going at the moment, which may be the right track as some have suggested. To be honest it does sound pretty awesome - but I've always dreamt of going all tubes. 

Opinions seem to split whether tubes are the right speakers for it - I guess in the end there's no definitive answer, as everyone's taste and wants in their sound are different. I would just have to take a leap of faith I guess - expensive gamble though! 

Maybe something like these 80w - 100w Cayin or Consonance amps would be safer bet? That would be enough to grip them? A little out of my budget at the moment but I could hang out for something second hand 

https://www.osbornloudspeakers.com.au/cyber-880i

https://www.audiotrends.com.au/hi-fi-stereo/amplifiers-receivers/valve-tube-amplifiers/cayin-cs-100a.html

 






 

Cayin make fantastic gear and which I can recommend from previous ownership. Cayin (Spark the parent company) make all the Primaluna gear. The lack of new designs from Cayin I think is due to the success they having with the Primaluna gear. Also a good portion of their original engineers left to start Line Magnetic.

 

I think your heart is set on tube gear and I have no doubt with the right amp you would have a big smile on your face.

 

Those Luxman mono's would be worth chasing down and am constantly tempted when they come up on Yahoo Japan.

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, evil c said:

plenty of musicians seem to like the sound of them !

 

 

 

 

 

Nothing like distortion 😉

 

PS. Your Melody is pretty good for the second best one around. You should take it to Tony McKay to improve it 

Edited by jakeyb77

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Posted (edited)

Aahh but it's having the right kind !

And once upon a time you were a Toob fanboy with Yammies!

27 minutes ago, jakeyb77 said:
Nothing like distortion
Edited by evil c

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On 25/05/2019 at 2:44 PM, Ittaku said:

How much are you willing to spend? If you can afford to go separates you could voice your system with a valve preamp instead and use the SS grunt to drive them.

Well I started out at $1500, but now I'm down the war path for a new amp and seen all the temptation out there I think it's blowing out to 3kish.. I think for this money i'll try and stick with an integrated as it seems like more bang for buck 

 

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On 25/05/2019 at 6:57 PM, Ooogh said:

I am not a flat earthist Kelossus. Here are some amps recently in my home.  Each brings a different listening experience. Yes low powered amplifiers can definitely meet their upper limits and compress dynamics. Did I ever hear compression on a 50 Watt SET? No. With 21 Watts, yes , but at very decent volumes.

 

What occurs prior to that and what volumes are actually used daily can well be of greater value to the listener than high SPL’s.  As you point out musical preferences , listening levels, size of the acoustic space and listening distance all play a role. 

5534A1F8-AABD-4A37-9B8F-805F66FC9EE8.jpeg

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That is some drool worthy gear. 

You mention a 50watt SET amp - This 48w SET Class A Line Magnetic showed up in my research before.. Looks like a bargain 

https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/en/line-magnetic-audio-lm-tube-amplifier-c-50/line-magnetic-lm-508ia-300b-805-tube-amp-class-a-single-ended-p-1422

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On 26/05/2019 at 7:48 PM, Be Quiet...Listen said:

There are no absolutes here. No doubt about that. I wish there were as this hobby would be a whole hell of a lot easier... ! 

In my experience of long term ownership of NS1000M’s & NS2000’s you simply cannot beat tube amps. 

I have borrowed and/or heard big SS gear (100 to 700rms) and I just cannot warm to their sound character. Tubes just do it right. 

Lower powered tube amps aren’t always a deal breaker either. You just have to know what to get your hands on. 

In regards to my NS2000’s, I have used my Luxman MB-3045 mono’s @ 45rms, EAR 509 mono’s @ 100 and Rogue Audio mono’s @ 160 and the Luxman’s cannot be beat.

Loss of dynamic with 45rms from the Luxman’s? No. 

Also, my musical tastes are wide and  varied. 

My god those Luxmans.. 
I guess hanging out for some vintage gear could be another option. If you have any other recommendations to keep an eye out for I'm all ears. Don't mind lurking on Yahoo Auctions for something to come up (the NS-2000s came from there originally)

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On 26/05/2019 at 9:29 PM, evil c said:

 @jack_b Agree with much of what Hugh says - have been into HiFi for a similar period and following a few rules I've been more than happy with the end result. 

 

Research, research,  talk with knowledgeable equally passionate enthusiasts , demo gear at their and your own home.

 

And go with your intuitive gut, our inner voice is a powerful tool.

Listen to it above what others say, you are the one who has to live with the sound, hopefully long term if you choose very well.

 

Couldn't  bear to sell my Melody valve amp,  magical warm mids and surpringly low, punchy bass .

Small tubes seem to impart a really nice quality.

 

Some will say valve amps can't do bass well, balderdash I say - plenty of musicians seem to like the sound of them !

 

 

 

 

 

 

Will do - thank you again for the advice! Much appreciated 

 

On 26/05/2019 at 9:31 PM, kelossus said:

Cayin make fantastic gear and which I can recommend from previous ownership. Cayin (Spark the parent company) make all the Primaluna gear. The lack of new designs from Cayin I think is due to the success they having with the Primaluna gear. Also a good portion of their original engineers left to start Line Magnetic.

 

I think your heart is set on tube gear and I have no doubt with the right amp you would have a big smile on your face.

 

Those Luxman mono's would be worth chasing down and am constantly tempted when they come up on Yahoo Japan.


Ah no way, that's interesting - thanks for the info. Yeah I have become obsessed with the idea of trying tubes recently - I guess because I'm relatively new to the hobby and it's something I haven't experienced properly yet. From everything I've read they provide the kind of sonic signature that appeals to me, so have to test the water. 

 

 



The Chinese tube amps are looking like front runners at the moment- they seem to be the only way I can get the power I need while keeping within budget. Either that or hanging out for something vintage / second hand.  

The Cayin CS-100A is high up on the list at the moment. But I keep getting drawn back to this Line Magnetic gear. 
The colour scheme isn't really for me, but this one looks interesting https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/en/line-magnetic-audio-lm-tube-amplifier-c-50/line-magnetic-lm-501ia-kt120-tube-integrated-amplifier-push-pull-power-amp-100w-p-1444 
Rated at 100 watts, with half the power tubes as the Cayin (albeit more powerful ones). Having less power tubes is more appealing as it means it won't be as costly to tube roll, but is there a sonic benefit to the Cayins design which uses 8 as opposed to 4? 

Then there's this 50 watt SET Class A number I posted earlier... Looks like it'd cut the mustard? https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/en/line-magnetic-audio-lm-tube-amplifier-c-50/line-magnetic-lm-508ia-300b-805-tube-amp-class-a-single-ended-p-1422
 


Are there any stores that offer take-home demo gear? I always read about it in the states but I haven't come across it here. They'd certainly have my business - I don't really know anyone else into HiFi so it's hard to try anything out. Unless anyone's keen on hearing what a pair of NS-2000's sound like in their system - would be happy to offer a demo if they had a tube amp to test out..! ha

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, jack_b said:

Well I started out at $1500, but now I'm down the war path for a new amp and seen all the temptation out there I think it's blowing out to 3kish.. I think for this money i'll try and stick with an integrated as it seems like more bang for buck 

 

In that case I'd highly recommend the Elekit amps for tube,. quality, and bang for your bucks.

 

http://shop.grantfidelity.com/Japanese-Elekit-TU-8340VK-Integrated-Tube-Amplifier-Kit-or-Assembled.html

 

They start at about $2K assembled and allow you to go up in quality according to your budget. These amps sound lovely even with the cheapest EL34 option, but you can change to KT150s now or later on to make them sound excellent.

Edited by Ittaku

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4 hours ago, Ittaku said:

In that case I'd highly recommend the Elekit amps for tube,. quality, and bang for your bucks.

 

http://shop.grantfidelity.com/Japanese-Elekit-TU-8340VK-Integrated-Tube-Amplifier-Kit-or-Assembled.html

 

They start at about $2K assembled and allow you to go up in quality according to your budget. These amps sound lovely even with the cheapest EL34 option, but you can change to KT150s now or later on to make them sound excellent.

Oh yeah I saw these - they look perfect! Although they don't seem to be available with a remote control which is a deal breaker. I don't think I could live without at least volume control. Unless one could be added? 

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2 minutes ago, jack_b said:

Oh yeah I saw these - they look perfect! Although they don't seem to be available with a remote control which is a deal breaker. I don't think I could live without at least volume control. Unless one could be added? 

Ouch, no I'm afraid not as far as I'm aware unless you wanted to modify it yourself :(

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15 hours ago, jack_b said:

 

That is some drool worthy gear. 

You mention a 50watt SET amp - This 48w SET Class A Line Magnetic showed up in my research before.. Looks like a bargain 

https://www.china-hifi-audio.com/en/line-magnetic-audio-lm-tube-amplifier-c-50/line-magnetic-lm-508ia-300b-805-tube-amp-class-a-single-ended-p-1422

The amplifiers I owned were  Cary 805 AE  Monoblocks. They use a very similar lay out. I did not find them lacking in dynamics , or unable to drive a 6 Ohm load. 

 

Not all of the amplifiers in the earlier photo were owned by me but I am fortunate enough to have a great group who let each other test equipment to make informed decisions.

 

I have not listened to to the Line Magnetic amplifier but there have been a few owners of Line Magnetic on SNA who you may be able to locate to ask for their opinions.2166F377-C8B4-41F7-8D0B-F0FEC3BB1A80.thumb.jpeg.af3e833d0af13fe7f031be3430ac76be.jpegC26D0FE8-4656-4DCC-8CF6-769BE288253F.thumb.jpeg.1d95a3c2d5b0fe4217079161401e294e.jpeg

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Posted (edited)

Double post

Edited by Ooogh
Double post

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Posted (edited)

Always liked Cary gear. Costly but quality.

 

Saying that running the NS2000's with a low powered tube amp caused "No loss in dynamics" is not quite accurate. You would need to A/B them with a larger powered design to hear. Most are none the wiser until swapping out components.

 

I mean if you were to plug in a 400 watt Krell or a big ME and didn't hear an increase in dynamics something is seriously wrong. Or you listen to music that has no dynamics to begin with.

Edited by kelossus

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If you are after more tone and sweetness have you tried tube rolling the valves in your amp. I have the same Vincent amp. The amp responds very well to different valves in the input stage. I have tried all the usual suspects, teles, amperex, brimar and mullard. Mullard long plate mc1 in the window position was by far the best.

 

I know the valves aren't cheap but they could save you thousands on a valve amp that may not match the Yamaha's. I agree with Kelossus stick with a ss amp to drive the Yamaha's . Valve pre and SS amp is what i would do.

 

I had the vincent driving my JBL 4344. Played beautifully. Do not underestimate the convenience of a remote and tone controls.

 

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Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, jack_b said:

Well I started out at $1500, but now I'm down the war path for a new amp and seen all the temptation out there I think it's blowing out to 3kish.. I think for this money i'll try and stick with an integrated as it seems like more bang for buck 

 

@jack_b For that sort of money and given your location, I'd suggest it would be worthwhile  a visit to Osborn Speakers and having a chat to Greg Osborn. At least you'd be able to have a listen and see the Consonance amps in the flesh.

Edited by Willmax

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What about something like this ARC VT100? Possibly still available, it would not hurt to ask.

 

 

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