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Focal Speakers Owners & Discussion Thread


Guest alebonau

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Sorry for the late reply,

TBH I can't remember a lot of detail of the day, mainly that I was impressed and sorry I couldn't just take the set-up home.

I don't remember any bass issues jumping out at me.

I do remember the speakers being about 2.5m apart, and there was plenty of room behind the gear as I was easily able to get around back and check everything out.

thanks chui for posting back. good to know you were impressed and no obvious bass issues that you could remember. 2.5m apart is abotu how wide I would have them, perhaps they need a bit of space to breath which could be a problem in a setup like mine ..

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The information below is from numerous sessions I have had with this speakers, and I am referring to my various notes as I am typing this. Hopefully it makes sense in this thread....

I had been following the 1027BE for quite a while now. I had been waiting for them prior to their release and as soon as they were released in Australia I had my first listen. Since then I have had numerous sessions with them at both eHome and Audiolifestyle in Melbourne.

I have similar experiences to Al, in that the delicate top-end, razor sharp imaging; good soundstage; but something not right with the bottom-end. For me it dilutes the overall presentation quite a lot.

In my first demo, I thought the speakers were not broken-in yet (this must have been around a year or so ago); and so waited many months for things to be broken in. Still things were not quite right with the bass.

I have played around with moving speakers, closer to wall, bring them out, toe them in, keep them parallel; but to no avail.

Have even tried various amps, Exposure, Consonance, Bryston, MF, Marantz, Primare.... still to no avail....

Finally, around a few months back, after not getting things right with this speaker, I was invited to have a listen to the Utopia series (Alto). The impaccable resolution of the top-end was still their, with the bottom end just as detailed as well. Perfect ! Unfortunately for me, the Utopia series is beyond my budget currently, oh well, the savings shall continue for a little while more :)

Other speakers that I have listened to, which may be missing some of the resolution in the top-end but seemed to me to be offering overall a better musical experience; have been the Sonus Faber Cremonas, and KEF Reference series...I now plan to listen to some of the Aussie speakers, which I have thus far ignored a bit, these includes the VAF, Osborne, and even Krix.....

However, like Spearmint, I await with bated breath for the 1037, may be they have got things significantly improved in that model....and like the 1027, I will be the first one to go around demo'ing that one too :)

Ritesh

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I was talking to another member a few months ago, and he had listened to the 1027's with a CC1000 centre, and was blown away.

Then he started wondering what the Diva's would sound like, and so he tried them alongside the 1027Be's in his own HT, and in his own words: "They crucified the 1027Be's and I knew that I'd always regret not having bought the Diva's until eventually I'd buy them and lose money in the process."

...where does it all end!! :blink:

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I was talking to another member a few months ago, and he had listened to the 1027's with a CC1000 centre, and was blown away.

Then he started wondering what the Diva's would sound like, and so he tried them alongside the 1027Be's in his own HT, and in his own words: "They crucified the 1027Be's and I knew that I'd always regret not having bought the Diva's until eventually I'd buy them and lose money in the process."

...where does it all end!! :blink:

Hi Foggy,

Are you referring to the WLM Diva that JohnA is playing with at the moment?

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No Spearmint, this is a Sydney member who doesn't want to post details of his new setup on the forum. It was the Focal Diva Utopia that he upgraded to.

phew thats twice the price of the 1027be's we're talking about ! but part of the utopia range and probably a very nice thing. i'll make sure I dont ever have a listen to one of those ! :blink:

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The information below is from numerous sessions I have had with this speakers, and I am referring to my various notes as I am typing this. Hopefully it makes sense in this thread....

I had been following the 1027BE for quite a while now. I had been waiting for them prior to their release and as soon as they were released in Australia I had my first listen. Since then I have had numerous sessions with them at both eHome and Audiolifestyle in Melbourne.

I have similar experiences to Al, in that the delicate top-end, razor sharp imaging; good soundstage; but something not right with the bottom-end. For me it dilutes the overall presentation quite a lot.

In my first demo, I thought the speakers were not broken-in yet (this must have been around a year or so ago); and so waited many months for things to be broken in. Still things were not quite right with the bass.

I have played around with moving speakers, closer to wall, bring them out, toe them in, keep them parallel; but to no avail.

Have even tried various amps, Exposure, Consonance, Bryston, MF, Marantz, Primare.... still to no avail....

Finally, around a few months back, after not getting things right with this speaker, I was invited to have a listen to the Utopia series (Alto). The impaccable resolution of the top-end was still their, with the bottom end just as detailed as well. Perfect ! Unfortunately for me, the Utopia series is beyond my budget currently, oh well, the savings shall continue for a little while more :blink:

Other speakers that I have listened to, which may be missing some of the resolution in the top-end but seemed to me to be offering overall a better musical experience; have been the Sonus Faber Cremonas, and KEF Reference series...I now plan to listen to some of the Aussie speakers, which I have thus far ignored a bit, these includes the VAF, Osborne, and even Krix.....

However, like Spearmint, I await with bated breath for the 1037, may be they have got things significantly improved in that model....and like the 1027, I will be the first one to go around demo'ing that one too :D

Ritesh

interesting to read your experience so far ritesh. what particualr mf amps do listen to the 1027be's with and where abouts was that in melb ?

re the bass I havent totally written the speaker off because of that. As remember johna's B&W 703 floorstander sounded pretty similar with a muffled bass when heard it first on the end of the rotel 1080 but trying a gruntier power amp in my a5cr tidied that up. Could be other room or setup issues too. But yeah if its a factor related to the speaker itself then thats a problem for a speaker in this sort of league.

Altos, Divas ? all way out of even dreaming range unfortunately, I'd keep using my missions rather than go wandering there. My wife would much rather a new car I think than me spending $20k on a pair of speakers ! got to keep things in perspective.

1037be's ? too big for my setup and addiitonal bass is not somethign I'm chasing, got plenty of what I need there in the velo DD.

I'm yet to experience the current kef reference range only remember the one from few years back, who sells those in melb ritesh ? sonus has not really been my taste in the past unfortunatley perhaps its might be worth pursuing with different amps/source than what I listenined to them on. Look forward to your posts ritesh and what you come across and how you find them.

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Finally I have some time to write up some of my thoughts.

Did everyone have a good long weekend?

Setup:

source = MF A5 CD and Primare CD31

http://www.musicalfidelity.com/products/a5/a5cd.html

http://www.primare.net/00002/00007/00011/

amp = MF A5 integrated and Primare I30

http://www.musicalfidelity.com/products/a5/a5int.html

http://www.primare.net/00002/00041/00048/

speakers = the Focals of course

setup ~2ft from side-wall, ~4ft from rear and ~9ft apart,

"severely" toed-in directly to the listener, a little > 9ft away

and on spikes.

The Focals have a downward firing port, sealed at the back and sport

only a pair of binding posts each, ie. not bi-wire/amp capable.

Music:

- Spearmint's Compilation CD # 4

- Rodrigo y Gabriella self-titled and live CD

- Geoff's/Focal's test CD #4

track 5: I was expecting Marvin Gaye

but got The Insect-Pooka instead (nice surreal track)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pooka_(band)

- no classical/choral works :(

Disclaimers:

- My ears and my musical tastes :P

- I'm no expert and am definitely not consistent with my notes,

it's more of what stands out to me at that time given the

setup and phase of the moon. awoooo..

Goal:

- Demo the A5 integrated amp, a contender for my next amp.

Ideal demo since it was hooked up to the JM Labs.

- Just to share my thoughts and hoping that someone can point me

to gear I can listen to given my musical tastes.

On with the show:

Started out with the MF gear.

1st impression - wherever the instrument and voice popped up there it

stayed. Solid imaging.

This was true for Rodrigo y Gabriella's self-titled album.

It did not sound larger than life, Gabriella's guitar drumming

was portrayed with good scale.

It had a sufficiently deep and wide soundstage to my liking, although

I think it would've been wider if the speakers were toed-out some more.

However on the live album with One/Take 5 both guitarist turned up

in the same spot :|

Tried this at home and it was not so, not sure why.

Unlike the Osborn Interludes etc the music was not projected tall.

Female voices (So Nice-Stacy Kent, Blues In The Night-Katie Melua) were

clear/articulate but not liquid smooth, preferred male voices (Sometimes

We Cry-Van Morrison, Stimela-Hugh Masekela). Van Morrison's voice was

good and "earthy" but sounded a little compressed when he belted it out.

Maybe I like my female vocals warmer, thicker and oh so liquid smooth.

I'm not a bass "expert" as evident in my current setup, so was it muddy?

Let's say the mid-bass/lower bass was a little rounded, this could be

the Focal's sound signature.

I preferred the Whatmough's P31's (raptor's) impact/attack on the

spearmint's CD.

Pri-mare, Pri-ma-re or something Scandanavian like that:

Geoff hooked this setup up as a direct comparison to the MF gear.

For ~$200 less you get a balanced input and a heavier chasis as well :)

We did not use the balanced setup.

This setup plumbed a little deeper into the soundstage :o

I enjoyed Hugh's Stimela thoroughly here.

The speakers seemed to dissapear "more" than with the MF gear

(if that makes sense at all).

Pooka's (not a bad word) The Insect was interesting and the song

ended with birds chirping in the background.. surprisingly real even

at low (ie. not high) volumes, just like looking out a window to

a nearby tree with a flock of birds chirping merrily away.

The bass had more control, it was taut and not as rounded.

However the midrange sounded thinner to me compared to the MF.

Some 3 hours later:

- If I was replacing my speakers I'll need to seriously demo

Whatmough's offerings.

- I still prefer the MF, I think it'll handle bass better in my setup.

The Primare is still worth a listen, at the very least you can compare

this with the MF setup with the same room setup + speakers.

Given the time I did not request to mix the systems.

Afterthought:

- The eerie orange glow still has a hold on me :)

You can get a lot of tube goodness for under $4k (cost of each SS amp)

Yes, I can sacrifice some clarity/accuracy, bass control..

give me lush, warm thick sounding vocals :P

- Geoff is keen on the GTG - he anticipates 3 groups of people,

= the demo/listening room group

= LCD/Plasma/projector/HT setup group

= another group wandering about the shop for other stuff (eg. Sonos, etc)

He is building his 2ch part of the business.

- A GTG can be setup in the coming months.

- Worth a look if you're into LCDs/Plasmas/projectors as well.

E-Home is a solutions-shop and gear can be tailored to your needs.

I purchased my plasma + HD stb from E-Home ~2 years ago

and couldn't be happier with the service and outcome.

It's also convenient living in the same suburb :)

enjoy

k_

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Guest alebonau

thanks for the post back K. presume it was the primare integrated you listened too. yes very nice stuff too. well worh considering interesting to read yoru compariosns with the mf.

in regards the comment "on the live album with One/Take 5 both guitarist turned up

in the same spot :|

Tried this at home and it was not so"

and noticed earlier too you said there was severe toe in perhaps too much can constrict the soundstage doing that which might explain the two guitarists on top of them selves hehe. I remember reading a magazine review on these speakers posted by a guy on avs that went into the positioning of these speakers in some detail and said they didnt need a lot of toe in due ot their wide dispersion. so you could be quite when you say "although I think it would've been wider if the speakers were toed-out some more.". perhaps htey have been toed in more since my visit. or perhaps with them being moved forward the toe in angle a lot more severe restricting now some soundstage width ?

anyways good reading and some nice tracks played there in yoru demo ! :)

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interesting to read your experience so far ritesh. what particualr mf amps do listen to the 1027be's with and where abouts was that in melb ?

@ eHome

re the bass I havent totally written the speaker off because of that. As remember johna's B&W 703 floorstander sounded pretty similar with a muffled bass when heard it first on the end of the rotel 1080 but trying a gruntier power amp in my a5cr tidied that up. Could be other room or setup issues too. But yeah if its a factor related to the speaker itself then thats a problem for a speaker in this sort of league.

@ Audiolifestyle, we did try the Bryston 4BSST (new range), Marantz Reference and a couple more.... these speakers don't go as low as, say the Thiels (their low-end impressed me a lot BTW), but it's just that the lower-bass is average i.e. it doesn't have the same resolution as the top-end, which I found extremely nice...

Altos, Divas ? all way out of even dreaming range unfortunately, I'd keep using my missions rather than go wandering there. My wife would much rather a new car I think than me spending $20k on a pair of speakers ! got to keep things in perspective.

quite true :) Apart from the car, it may even serve as a deposit for an investment unit or something similar.... :P

1037be's ? too big for my setup and addiitonal bass is not somethign I'm chasing, got plenty of what I need there in the velo DD.

I may still go that way, i.e. bookshelves and a good sub, although that would be a two stage purchase for me then.....

I'm yet to experience the current kef reference range only remember the one from few years back, who sells those in melb ritesh ?

I have not heard the new one yet, I have only heard the old one and that was at Secher.

For the new one, I most probably will fly to Sydney to have a listen....from what I have heard it is really good ! While at Sydney I will also give Revel a listen too...

sonus has not really been my taste in the past unfortunatley perhaps its might be worth pursuing with different amps/source than what I listenined to them on. Look forward to your posts ritesh and what you come across and how you find them.

I had a listen to them at Encel in Richmond, with the Rotel 1090; overall it is very very nice..... definately in the same league, and a very nice speaker.

Ritesh

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Thanks all for the comments.

alebonau:

I don't remember any JM Labs toed-in this much when I demoed them almost a decade ago

at Len Wallis. Well, with mine there's very little toe-in.

I think norpus was the last to hear this setup before me.

joz:

The P31s I listened to belongs to raptor.

It was a GTG at his home with the Aksa pre/power combo + Qinpu integrated + Shanling and Raysonic CDPs.

hmm.. I think you listened to the same setup.

k_

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@ eHome

@ Audiolifestyle, we did try the Bryston 4BSST (new range), Marantz Reference and a couple more.... these speakers don't go as low as, say the Thiels (their low-end impressed me a lot BTW), but it's just that the lower-bass is average i.e. it doesn't have the same resolution as the top-end, which I found extremely nice...

quite true :P Apart from the car, it may even serve as a deposit for an investment unit or something similar.... :blink:

I may still go that way, i.e. bookshelves and a good sub, although that would be a two stage purchase for me then.....

I have not heard the new one yet, I have only heard the old one and that was at Secher.

For the new one, I most probably will fly to Sydney to have a listen....from what I have heard it is really good ! While at Sydney I will also give Revel a listen too...

I had a listen to them at Encel in Richmond, with the Rotel 1090; overall it is very very nice..... definately in the same league, and a very nice speaker.

Ritesh

presumably heard the mf a5 with the 1027s' at e-home then ritesh ?. it doesnt to be honest worries me too much if it doesnt go too low for a speaker. but what it does do I'd want it to do cleanly. will remain a question mark for me I think till I can try with my a5 power amp and possibly in my room as well as know what an effect that can have on the bass response of a speaker.

will be interesting to hear how you find the new kef reference. pity no one selling in melb ? look like nice speakers.

hehe the sonus I last heard was with rotel and in encel as well. sorry but that combo almost put me to sleep ! :D possibly we are lookign for different speaker charecter :P

ps quite true re $20k didnt think of it as a deposit on an investment !

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phew thats twice the price of the 1027be's we're talking about ! but part of the utopia range and probably a very nice thing. i'll make sure I dont ever have a listen to one of those ! :P

Hehe

I did listen to the Nova Utopia in HK last May, just after listening to the 800D immediately before two floors above.

The Nova did it for me, better than the 800D - it was a gorgeous sound :blink: (for a citroen) :P

Then again it retails for $60K at Len Wallis :D

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hehe the sonus I last heard was with rotel and in encel as well. sorry but that combo almost put me to sleep ! :blink: possibly we are lookign for different speaker charecter :D

Sad thing about Sonus speakers is that there is very little choice in powering them, at least in shops here in Melbourne. Not sure if anyone else stocks them other than Encel, and Encel only have Rotel power amps (AFAIK) in store. Would be nice to take along some different amps and put a pair of Cremona's through their paces. I'd be interested to see (hear) what a MF A5cr (or Elecktra etc) and SF setup could do.

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Guest alebonau

Found a thread with a few thoughts of the model up (the 1037Be) and seems others think there is a problem with the bass from these speakers...

AVS Focal 1037Be Thread

[/b]

dont know abotu the 1037be's but I'm still suspect about the 1027be's bass response. I had another little bit of a listen again at e-home on the weekend but with still beign a bit under the weather and with a clogged up head couldnt really tell a lot. the bass seemed to me a bit better but to be honest hard to tell it was like I had a pair of ear plugs in the ears.

hopefully in a couple of weeks time I can have anotehr listen plus take my power amp in to see what theyre like with it. darren the scotish sales guy at e-home said that although using the spikes etc had helped he still feel a lot of it is room related. he says he really has heard them a lot more incisive soudning than as they are and really hasnt been able to get the best otu of em in the setup they have. therye actually thinking of taking a wall out to setup a dedicated 2ch listenign room so obviously quite serious abotu things.

I have read to a lot of the bass response of the focals is run in related. even the manual suggests long periods of bass heavy music to run them in to get their best.

my own thoughts are that at this sort of price range you want to be quite happy with a speaker, sure it may not be absolutely perfect - no speaker is. but albeit without anything like these kind of things I think.

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