jasper1553552693 Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Hi Wizard Where in my posting would you interpret 'sour grapes'? I obviously have an interest in the situation and am genuinely curious where he sources these from. :confused: Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapfu Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 My apology jasper. As god is my witness I only tracked your web site - honestly had no idea until 10 minutes ago your interest. Didn't actually pay attention to your avatar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasper1553552693 Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 All is cool and groovy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gortnipper Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 jasper;155337 wrote: As for 2Juki here is an interesting posting. http://www.audioasylum.com/audio/vinyl/messages/20/206719.html Now, I have ordered items from him that are not available from a distributor here in NZ. I have been satisfied, and the items were in what appeared to be factory sealed packaging. Grey market? Sure. No different than Parallel Imports. As one of the posters said, "Bottom line, I suppose: Caveat emptor." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luis1553552738 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I would add that the only sour grapes in Jasper's life are those that undergo malolactic fermentation and end up in a bottle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasper1553552693 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Luis you know me too well! This guy's source in the past was a Vietnamese Benz Micro distributor who was kicked out of the distributorship as soon as it was discovered. There are investigations happening right now into the new source. Benz Micro do not condone in any way their products being sold this way. I understand the "bargain" side of things and I do understand human nature as I am one of them (allegedly) but this could be looked at as an international equivalent of a "nudge, nudge wink, wink Del-boy it fell off the back of a truck " scenario. He is certainly not selling them with the blessing and support of the manufacturer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gortnipper Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 jasper;155413 wrote: He is certainly not selling them with the blessing and support of the manufacturer. I am sure that most of his stuff is this way. And Parallel Imports is the same. Apple was not happy with them selling iPhone v1 - nor was Vodafone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopeman Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 As a consumer, a few questions, 1), What support do I want for a cart? when it's broken, it's broken, or I will get a new one for free if I buy it locally? 2), I don't believe it's that easy to clone a cart, not like cables, WBT plug etc, there're fake cables in eBay like Audioquest etc, but I never heard someone buy a fake cart... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilNZ Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 You get knowledge, a trade in scheme if its broken, and of course the satisfaction of knowing that you are helping the local industry. And I have seen it before that you can buy a cartridge that is 'brand new' to find it is anything but, and has been retipped by some third party. How many times do I have to say that if you don't support local then there won't be any local? And then who will be complaining that there is no where to see the gear...? It is very shortsighted to think that buying stuff from overseas doesn't damage the local industry... and in the case of Benz cartridges the local RRP is better than the RRP overseas!! Oh well, I guess I will go to work and rip off a whole lot of people with overpriced stuff so I can buy my weekend Ferrari... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gortnipper Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Just make sure to pick me up and give me a ride... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Ono Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Its not always as cut and dry as we would like it to be.I like to buy locally if the retailer meets a few of my expectations.Which are -backup for future repairs-a reasonable price-and availability.Yesterday I had a sub (Kef 2010) in for repair,the retailer referred me to the supplier for more details.The supplier said we dont have those and to buy a new circuitboard,at a cost similar to a new sub.I dont blame the retailer for this situation,but it really doesnt do alot for my confidence in buy local.I eventually found the information I needed on the net ,handed it to the electrician and a reasonably priced repair is under way.A more approachable atitude by the supplier is required in this case IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilNZ Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 gortnipper;155438 wrote: Just make sure to pick me up and give me a ride... Sure thing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 neil;155435 wrote: You get knowledge, a trade in scheme if its broken, and of course the satisfaction of knowing that you are helping the local industry. And I have seen it before that you can buy a cartridge that is 'brand new' to find it is anything but, and has been retipped by some third party. How many times do I have to say that if you don't support local then there won't be any local? And then who will be complaining that there is no where to see the gear...? It is very shortsighted to think that buying stuff from overseas doesn't damage the local industry... and in the case of Benz cartridges the local RRP is better than the RRP overseas!! Oh well, I guess I will go to work and rip off a whole lot of people with overpriced stuff so I can buy my weekend Ferrari... I bought my Benz cartridge locally. The price was good, the service was good and the "peace-of-mind" factor was good. Why the hell would I buy from overseas when I get all that locally (even if I could save a few bucks buying overseas)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapfu Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Brian you have it in one. "Which are -backup for future repairs-a reasonable price-and availability." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapfu Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 mmmm "Why the hell would I buy from overseas when I get all that locally (even if I could save a few bucks buying overseas)? " Hopefully joe average doesn't buy CD's or DVD's or Blu-rays on Amazon. Hopefully they do not buy from Jay bee Hifi any of the above. If you could get 3 for the price of one. Say a Shure 97xE is selling for $50USD allow 15 for delivery = $65 at rate of depreciation = $81.25 NZD. Real world price right now is the $81 not the $230 locally on Trademe. Benz $2200 give or take. One off on Ebay $831.25 thats nearly one third - delivery 3 days at best. mmmmmmmmmmm - lets go back to traiffs and building TV's in Waihi and winding voice coils. If you paid 1 million for your house, and tomorrow its worth 400K you sure would be pissed that you couldn't get 1 million for it again. I'd be pissed too if I'd bought something for twice its value and the guy next door got it for less and could buy another if the first broke. Australia doesn't want NZ apples cause they're cheaper and better. Buy locally in OZ, bananas at $8 kilo - protects the local market. NZ made tyres - cheaper made in China. No local tyre makers are there now? Depends on the side of the fence you are on. Does anyone make Cartridges in New Zealand that we can buy? Joys of globalisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilNZ Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 wizard;155447 wrote: Benz $2200 give or take. One off on Ebay $831.25 thats nearly one third - delivery 3 days at best. And you're 100% confident that it is a genuine Benz not retipped by some 3rd party. Remember sealed packaging counts for nothing... I guess you can't convince some people... the destruction of local industry doesn't happen in one fell swoop, its death by a thousand cuts.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 wizard;155446 wrote: Brian you have it in one. "Which are -backup for future repairs-a reasonable price-and availability." Which was exactly the point I was making. Sure I buy CDs and vinyl from Amazon - ones which I cannot get here in NZ. What's with all the "mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm"-ing, Wizard? It makes you seem arrogant and unpleasant. mmmmmmmmmmmm maybe it was things like that which made me stop posting on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Ono Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Lets not forget the Adidas jersey debacle,really, who did Adidas think they were fooling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapfu Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 When you say buy local - are we not saying support the importer? "And you're 100% confident that it is a genuine Benz not retipped by some 3rd party" Are we sure it is not? Linn now say pay the overseas price and we will bring your TT here for you - not the local price. If you went to a fire sale and low and behold there was something there that you buy for 70% less than normal - sealed - and if you were a business man looking for quick turnover resell it again at a profit for a lot less than the shop across town. mmmmmmmmmmm - no way of knowing where he got the Benz anything else. Support local where local is local manufacture but support local where you are supporting the importer - mmmmmmmmmmm Interesting dilemma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Y Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 neil;155435 wrote: It is very shortsighted to think that buying stuff from overseas doesn't damage the local industry... I think that we are often shortsighted (myself included) but it is important to choose & support retailers who can provide good support to the customer. Usually this means not only good retailer-customer advice/rapport but also retailers who themselves choose good suppliers/distributors....so that if anything starts hitting the fan, you rely on your retailer to have the support of the supplier to maintain/retain happy ciustomers. A case in point... in another life I have bought stuff from a retailer of certain goods for years, despite internet (overseas & local) pricing being significantly lower. This retailer also only stocks a limited range of brands. Why? He says that he only likes to deal with suppliers who give good service & parts support. On more than one occasion I have benefited from exceptional repair & parts service...including on one occasion when an item broke which was many yrs old, but was returned to the supplier by my shop & a new (improved model) replacement item was sent out at no charge, because it was unfixable and/or a fault that should not have occurred. So, in the long term view, I have quantifiably benefited in terms of this type of support. It pays to look beyond the few $$ you might save on the advertised price. But the onus is also on good retailers to weed out & support only the best suppliers/distributors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilNZ Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 I couldn't agree more Owen. That's certainly our approach. Also, we only stock products we like. Makes it far easier to actually sell them! Most importers are pretty good, there are a few bad eggs, but not many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilNZ Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 wizard;155457 wrote: When you say buy local - are we not saying support the importer? Support local where local is local manufacture but support local where you are supporting the importer - mmmmmmmmmmm Oh of course I forgot that Importers are the Devil's testicle fungus! If all the importers and distributors stopped importing and distributing, do you think that would be good for the hifi industry? Or would you prefer to buy directly from the manufacturer with no demo available, no experience, service etc.... Yes support the importer because without them we would have nothing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinO Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 CHrist , as I've said before , the Law of Death has been broken so many times here that there isn't even a horse carcass to be flogged , just a wrinkle in time where the bloody thing used to be. Neil , life's too short to worry about knob cheese!! Every hifi retailer I've ever met has tales of guys who go to the shops , utilise their time and expertise at no cost ( and maybe demos) , go and order kit from overseas then go home , break out the baby oil and go nuts on how they " beat the system" and stopped those nasty , filthy rich hifi retailers from ripping them off. Then of course , when it all goes tits up with what they've bought , expect the NZ retailer to come to the party with free repairs , replacement and the rest.You just can't explain it to some people Neil ; either too stubborn , too thick or just plain w...ers. Too much good beer and wine so rip in and enjoy!!Of course , if I ever see you driving a knob-extension /surrogate ( I've met you , I know what you look like ) then all the above is instantly voided !! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilNZ Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 I hear you Kevin!! Unfortunately the only way I will get an automobile knob extension will by lotto funded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkr001 Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 KevinO;155472 wrote: CHrist , as I've said before , the Law of Death has been broken so many times here that there isn't even a horse carcass to be flogged , just a wrinkle in time where the bloody thing used to be. Neil , life's too short to worry about knob cheese!! Every hifi retailer I've ever met has tales of guys who go to the shops , utilise their time and expertise at no cost ( and maybe demos) , go and order kit from overseas then go home , break out the baby oil and go nuts on how they " beat the system" and stopped those nasty , filthy rich hifi retailers from ripping them off. Then of course , when it all goes tits up with what they've bought , expect the NZ retailer to come to the party with free repairs , replacement and the rest.You just can't explain it to some people Neil ; either too stubborn , too thick or just plain w...ers. Too much good beer and wine so rip in and enjoy!!Of course , if I ever see you driving a knob-extension /surrogate ( I've met you , I know what you look like ) then all the above is instantly voided !! :-) I have refrained from entering this debate but Kevin I couldn't have put it better!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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