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Guest Mr Thorens

Well I did this exercise. Used formply for outer and because I couldn’t get cutting boards I used cork floor tiles stacked and cut to size and taped up with paint blue masking tape. Did a few layers and yes you’re right the resin leaked everywhere. Was a messy job. Anyway molds removed easily enough. Then I added the outer timber for additional strength, glued to the sides using liquid nails.  Painted the top with piano gloss black spray paint. Here’s what it looks like. 

D0589674-B3D7-4BF1-BE2A-3FCAE8906D0F.jpeg

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Guest Mr Thorens

And how does it sound? Well the difference between this and the layered timber plinth I used to use is definitely there. Resonance has been removed. So essentially all you hear is what’s on the record grooves. Better focus and micro dynamics, cleaner and more natural sounding. Instruments appear more properly into space - front to back, side to side and also height. Pretty impressive. 
 

Total project cost just over $220, all sources from bunnings. 

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17 minutes ago, mloutfie said:

@Mr Thorens   how is the bass performance? Is it thinner than wooden plinth? I've read more rigid plinth has better bass performance.

 

Do you just leave the glue to dry or you weigh it down or clamp it?

I have done a few plinths, I borrowed a lot of clamps and clamped hard overnight.

Chris

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17 minutes ago, mloutfie said:

@Mr Thorens   how is the bass performance? Is it thinner than wooden plinth? I've read more rigid plinth has better bass performance.

 

Do you just leave the glue to dry or you weigh it down or clamp it?

I have done a few plinths, I borrowed a lot of clamps and clamped hard overnight.

Chris

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Guest Mr Thorens

I didn’t use clamps at all. Just let each layer dry by itself. Bass performance is improved I think it’s more taut and goes a bit deeper once the timber resonance has gone. 

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On 29/10/2020 at 10:14 AM, Mr Thorens said:

And how does it sound? Well the difference between this and the layered timber plinth I used to use is definitely there. Resonance has been removed. So essentially all you hear is what’s on the record grooves. Better focus and micro dynamics, cleaner and more natural sounding. Instruments appear more properly into space - front to back, side to side and also height. Pretty impressive. 
 

Total project cost just over $220, all sources from bunnings. 

The resin plinth is about as good as it gets for the SP10. I get my fiberglass supplies from Trojan in Newcastle NSW even with shipping they are cheaper than Bunnnings with my wife's staff discount.

 

I like the timber surround looks like Tassie Oak. All my DIT gear has Tassie Oak front panels finished with Scandinavian oil, I like the look.

Edited by Warren Jones
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I'm in the process of machining a stainless steel platter for an SP10 so we'll see if that improves things. 2 x 304 SS blanks and an almost finished platter bottom. This platter will have 16mm Delrin top and is for a chassis less install.

 

I have a few upgrades on the boil.

 

A chassis less plinth where the motor will be mounted directly to the plinth and electronics separate.

 

I am also well down the track in designing and manufacturing a stepper motor driven linear tracking arm driven by an Arduino. The Arduino code is written and operational, just finalizing a unipivot design that will ride on the carriage.

 

IMG_20200926_062401503.thumb.jpg.b266a2bf754ce085f76ef572aba12125.jpg

 

IMG_20201031_173148578_HDR.thumb.jpg.ba00efde62d0ab53af75bcb1684b2431.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

Platter finished

 

Vertical runout was awful so I commenced measuring. All the runout was in the motor.. Next project is to modify the motor with a larger bearing and investigate if I can fit an inverted bearing into the SP10 motor.

 

 

 

 

IMG_20201115_103627455.thumb.jpg.87769bba3335b5819f8c72105b20289c.jpg

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1 hour ago, Warren Jones said:

Platter finished

 

Vertical runout was awful so I commenced measuring. All the runout was in the motor.. Next project is to modify the motor with a larger bearing and investigate if I can fit an inverted bearing into the SP10 motor.

 

 

 

 

IMG_20201115_103627455.thumb.jpg.87769bba3335b5819f8c72105b20289c.jpg

Looks like you are doing that measuring on a kitchen worktop which wont be level, not even close. You cant measure runout this way, you are as much measuring the worktop and anything else. What is the motor sitting on, is that level?

Measuring motor runout you need to spin the motor. Curious why you are making a stainless platter, what is wrong with the old one?

Chris

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6 hours ago, cafe latte said:

Looks like you are doing that measuring on a kitchen worktop which wont be level, not even close. You cant measure runout this way, you are as much measuring the worktop and anything else. What is the motor sitting on, is that level?

Measuring motor runout you need to spin the motor. Curious why you are making a stainless platter, what is wrong with the old one?

Chris

I know how to measure runout it was spinning the platter on the motor that sent me measuring to determine what caused the vertical runout. I also measured TIR of the motor and spindle in the lathe. I posted because I thought people might be interested.

 

That is an AA grade granite surface plate with the motor sitting on precision blocks accurate to 0.005mm. Look at the measurement of the motor mounting flange compared to the platter mounting face.

 

Platter is not mine it's made for someone else which is why I needed to determine the cause, as when I indicated the platter in the lathe it measured less than 0.02mm TIR.

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2 hours ago, Warren Jones said:

I know how to measure runout it was spinning the platter on the motor that sent me measuring to determine what caused the vertical runout. I also measured TIR of the motor and spindle in the lathe. I posted because I thought people might be interested.

 

That is an AA grade granite surface plate with the motor sitting on precision blocks accurate to 0.005mm. Look at the measurement of the motor mounting flange compared to the platter mounting face.

 

Platter is not mine it's made for someone else which is why I needed to determine the cause, as when I indicated the platter in the lathe it measured less than 0.02mm TIR.

Looking at your precision surface there seems from the pic to be sand or bits all over it which is what I saw. If measuring like this even a tiny bit of grit gives a massive error, but I am sure it is just a trick of the light. This way to measure a flat you need to be really careful.

Anyway nice project, did you find the problem.

Chris

Edited by cafe latte
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  • 3 weeks later...

There are 2 issues with the motor, 1 - is the platter mounting face has runout, 2 - I think the interface where the spindle is pressed into the rotor is flexing and the bearing is flexing. Mounting the motor in the lathe and indicating in the spindle bore I can get 0.02mm deflection with my finger. It's not slop in the lathe, I checked that. I am planning to machine a new motor housing with a larger bearing now I have finished my Stainless platter.

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I read a post that Wayne Colburn from Pass Labs made a few years ago about a Stainless Steel platter for an SP10 mk2 they had made. Pass Labs evaluation the SS plattered mk2 performed as well as a mk3. This sent me down the path of making a SS platter for my mk2.

 

This is platter is made to stock dimensions, so it fits in a stock SP10 mk2 chassis. Pic 3 shows it mounted in my spare test mule mk2. In these pics I hadn't milled the platter mounting bolt recess.

 

I'll add the measurements in the next post.

 

IMG_20201201_113058765.thumb.jpg.c9dfac762ff04aac63d507e3b7442890.jpg

 

IMG_20201201_124354160.thumb.jpg.1e42540f3c6ddc30c68617c9255d533c.jpg

 

IMG_20201201_124323235.thumb.jpg.436e71a7cca2eb13a7e028cb52975c18.jpg

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Being a trained electronics tech and metrologist I'm not into subjective evaluation. I believe if I can hear a difference I can measure it, so that out of the way.

 

Here are the impulse response measurements of the the stock and SS platters.

 

Pic 1 - Stock platter and rubber mat no clamp. I did the same test with the clamp and there was no difference in the response plot.

 

Pic 2 - Stock platter diy acrylic mat with reflex clamp.

 

Pic 3 - SS platter acrylic mat and reflex clamp.

 

Breaking the measurements down

 

1 - 200mv P-P and decay takes 12 cycles

2 - 80mv P-P and decay takes 12 cycles

3 - 80mv P-P and decay takes 4 cycles

 

Platter resonant frequency - OEM 40Hz and Stainless 16Hz.

 

Not only does the SS damp resonance faster it also lowers the Fr to 16Hz.

 

Is this audible in the music............YOU BET.........

 

IMG_20201128_122059725.thumb.jpg.4e2ebd3ef9a13fd14d87290273911db7.jpg

 

IMG_20201128_121735730.thumb.jpg.a824c244d1db54d6da1286ec185a3669.jpg

 

IMG_20201201_140425248.thumb.jpg.5a8c44a748850afd0a77a93c09a87ecd.jpg

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Guest palexsia
On 22/03/2019 at 11:47 AM, Peter_F said:

Without a doubt the BEST spinner on the planet for the money.  Idlers and belt drives are mere toys and farming machinery by comparison IME.  Unfortunately the SP10 MKII is often the victim of audiophools who poorly implement them and blame the deck.  There is no limit on their potential as they can be mated with arms and carts of the absolute highest calibre.  I've owned well over 250 turntables and still have about 20, but the SP10 MKII is still my reference.  My only 'upgrade' would be to a MKIII. 

DSC03132 (Medium).JPG

DSC02930 (Medium).JPG

Your tonearm is worth 3 0r 4 times more than your sp10 .  

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Hello everybody , you all have very nice and different SP10 turntables , I just love it , for my everyday turntable  I have a SP10 Mk2 and it has the obsidian volcanic glass base

and looks and sounds  good , It came with a EPA 100 arm and a denon dl103 MC cartridge . I also run a ortofon mc20 MC cartridge . when i got this turntable

for joe ridiger at the audio connection it came with a EPA500 and 1 x epa-a501H and 2 x epa-a501L arms , he said it was special but I have never used them.

I sold 1 x epa-501l arm and kept the rest . I am not sure what to do with these arms and I seek your counsel about this .

I also have a Michelle gyrodeck and this is what I use as a reference turntable because it has a accuphase ac-2 MC cartridge .

regatrds

ivan

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On 02/12/2020 at 2:07 PM, palexsia said:

Your tonearm is worth 3 0r 4 times more than your sp10 .  

 

and the SP10 mk2 can handle it easily.

 

My SP10mk3 has a Thales Simplicity II tonearm fitted and it raised the SQ more than I could ever have hoped for.   No real desire to look at more expensive tables anymore.

 

YMMV

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Guest palexsia
41 minutes ago, metal beat said:

 

and the SP10 mk2 can handle it easily.

 

My SP10mk3 has a Thales Simplicity II tonearm fitted and it raised the SQ more than I could ever have hoped for.   No real desire to look at more expensive tables anymore.

 

YMMV

My original SP10 MKii , sold this to Max head room ‘ Jason  . Keep it and love it never let me down. , very faithful TT . 

B89AF0C0-640F-4E25-AED2-2B6A96E7DA9E.png

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