powerav Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Had a chance to listen to this old gem yesterday at @Whiterex1 place it was being used as a preamp going straight to a beast of an usher power amp and huge usher speaker, I’ll let @Whiterex1 fill you in on model numbers. This was just a couple of weeks after hearing his oppo 105 with the same set up. Surprisingly or maybe not so the California labs blew the oppo away, it was a night and day difference in the CA labs favour. I advised that adding a dedicated preamp or using his Yamaha a s3000 as a preamp would make a big difference to the oppo but also improve the CA labs as well. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batty Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 CL-15? I have one, best CD player I have heard. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 7, 2019 Author Share Posted February 7, 2019 CL-15? I have one, best CD player I have heard.What are you using it with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiterex1 Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Speakers AC-20; amp 2.5s class a; CL-15 CD player. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batty Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Copland CSA29 and Castle Howards soon to try a First Watt M2X and B1 Pre when they are complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 7, 2019 Author Share Posted February 7, 2019 The CA labs makes me seriously regret selling my CD collection as I thought getting a hi end CD player would cost $4000 or more.[emoji20] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgehifi Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, powerav said: Surprisingly or maybe not so the California labs blew the oppo away, it was a night and day difference in the C.A. Labs favour Of course it did, I've been saying it for years, and getting flack from the Delta Sigma brigade for saying it. When playing PCM RedBook, the Cal CL15 uses 2 x PCM1702 R2R Multibit d/a converters which are "bit perfect". When playing PCM RedBook the Oppo uses Delta Sigma ESS-9018 Sabre32 Reference d/a converters, not bit perfect but a facsimile of the real thing. I bet you had more drive, better boogie factor and greater dynamics using the CAL, the Oppo would have been sweet enough, but boring compared to the CAL. The Oppo would have been kinder to bad recordings, and the CAL would have shown them up for warts and all. Cheers George Edited February 7, 2019 by georgehifi 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiterex1 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Look for a cl-15 for sale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiterex1 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Or just organise a time to come around and listen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batty Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Should be able to get one for $500 to $600 or maybe even less. Mine is from 1995 I think, so not new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdDrawerDown Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 A good heritage and an excellent player. I've just thrown out the manual for my EAD Enlightened Audio Designs CD 2000 player that died as a result of a lightning storm five years ago. I think I held onto the manual because I still wanted the connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 8, 2019 Author Share Posted February 8, 2019 3 hours ago, georgehifi said: bet you had more drive, better boogie factor and greater dynamics using the CAL, the Oppo would have been sweet enough, but boring compared to the CAL. The Oppo would have been kinder to bad recordings, and the CAL would have shown them up for warts and all. Yes! Perfect way to describe it. What would be an equivalent DAC as I don’t have CDs anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest kab Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 (edited) http://vasiltech.narod.ru/CD-Player-DAC-Transport.htm Here's a list of PCM1702 players and dacs. Edited February 8, 2019 by kab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 8, 2019 Author Share Posted February 8, 2019 http://vasiltech.narod.ru/CD-Player-DAC-Transport.htm Here's a list of PCM1702 players and dacs. Thanks for that list, only a few options to choose from makes it easy [emoji1] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgehifi Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 1 hour ago, kab said: Here's a list of PCM1702 players and dacs. 55 minutes ago, powerav said: Thanks for that list, only a few options to choose from makes it easy Look for the PCM1704, even better again, they were the last R2R Mulibit d/a chip that TI made. Cary 303/200 used them with great success, so did the Linn CD12, but at $30k aud not exactly cheap Cheers George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batty Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 I believe Audio GD made some PCM1704 DACs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 8, 2019 Author Share Posted February 8, 2019 I believe Audio GD made some PCM1704 DACs.Yep I’ve been looking at the new ones, what chip do the new ones use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgehifi Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 (edited) 32 minutes ago, powerav said: what chip do the new ones use? He's been doing discrete R2R Multibit like other are now, probably because PCM1704 are getting hard for him to get, as his dac's using these were his flagship models. Cheers George Edited February 8, 2019 by georgehifi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 By the way the bass from the CA labs CD player was so much deeper than the oppo, needed a subwoofer with the oppo. This has turned me off even getting a second hand oppo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgehifi Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, powerav said: CA labs CD player was so much deeper than the oppo You should hear the Cary 303/200 then, it will blow your mind. (pcm1704 K's and PMD200) It was so good I did a new I/V stage for it using the AD844, and it was stunning Cheers George Edited February 9, 2019 by georgehifi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maximus Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 The best implementation of PCM1704 was in the Naim CD555. Finest player I've ever heard. @georgehifi have a listen to the Pioneer PD-70AE, it uses ESS ES9026 pro Sabre DAC chips, but implemented with integrity, no hardness /edginess experienced as with many sabre dacs. I've got one with 500hrs on it. Its stopping me from investing in a Chord Hugo TT/Dave. Stereonet awarded it with an applause award....if that means anything. It can be had for under 3k new 5 year warranty. @powerav Just be very cautious when laying your money down for one of the lovely esoteric CD players of yester year. I had an Bladelius(PCM1704) for repair at a very high cost. Never ever sounded the same when I got it back. Don't want to sound negative, just my personal experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxspl Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 6 hours ago, powerav said: By the way the bass from the CA labs CD player was so much deeper than the oppo, needed a subwoofer with the oppo. This has turned me off even getting a second hand oppo. Fo stereo listening make sure the Oppo stereo outputs are set to Down Mixed Stereo. If they are set to front left/right they will be affected by the settings in the multichannel menu and may be diverting bass to the lfe channel . The Oppo 95 , 105 and 205 are not lacking in bass , the measurements show they are very linear and work superbly as a preamp connected directly to a power amp or to active speakers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 8 hours ago, MarkT said: f they are set to front left/right they will be affected by the settings in the multichannel menu and may be diverting bass to the lfe channel . @Whiterex1 check this setting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerav Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 8 hours ago, maximus said: Just be very cautious when laying your money down for one of the lovely esoteric CD players of yester year. I had an Bladelius(PCM1704) for repair at a very high cost. Never ever sounded the same when I got it back. Don't want to sound negative, just my personal experience. I don’t have CDs anymore so I am just after the dac but looks like due to cost I am now just after a dac with that similar sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgehifi Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 11 hours ago, maximus said: The best implementation of PCM1704 was in the Naim CD555. Finest player I've ever heard. Also the Linn CD12 Cheers George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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