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Speaker coupling & isolation


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14 hours ago, zydeco said:

 

 

I'm in a similar situation - speakers situated on a suspended wood floor and can feel the floor vibrate when music has strong bass tracks. The idea of isolation makes sense to me but it does assume that the driver is the speakers to stands to floor as opposed to the floor-boards being driven by the airborne vibrations.  Is this likely to be true?

Are the Gaia "squishy" - so as to decouple the floor from the speaker?

Yes, the Gaia is supposed to decouple the speaker from the floor. It’s a bit more sophisticated than just a “squishy” substance under the speaker. At least I hope so for the price but there doesn’t seem to be much detail around on exactly how they work.

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On 11/02/2019 at 5:52 PM, jt301 said:

Yes, the Gaia is supposed to decouple the speaker from the floor. It’s a bit more sophisticated than just a “squishy” substance under the speaker. At least I hope so for the price but there doesn’t seem to be much detail around on exactly how they work.

How much is the speaker elevated when one installs the Gaia 2? The web-site mentions a height of 35mm but it's not clear if this is the height of the base (i.e., it lifts the speaker by 35mm) or the full height of the unit including the thread.

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This has got me thinking. My floor is some sort of cheap composite board covered with carpet. I have some Herbies fat pads and coins which I will try.  If that makes any difference then further investigation will be warranted. Speakers are Graham LS 5/9 on light weight metal stands. 

Edited by PKay
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Should a well made speaker not vibrate as to cause the floor to vibrate?

The speakers I have had seem to be inert and do nothing to the floor. Even at loud volumes I cant feel any vibration in the cabinet or the floating floor. I also have several subwoofers and they make the walls shake and windows rattle but there is no cabinet vibration.

 

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20 minutes ago, AudioGeek said:

I see. What is the goal of having the cabinet vibrate?

The result is a magnificent mid range. 

 

The cabinet uses classic BBC "thinwall" construction, and is manufactured in the UK from high quality 9mm birch plywood. Hand-matched veneers are applied and finished to a very high standard indeed. All joints in the cabinet are reinforced with hardwood batons to ensure long life and total air sealing. The panels are mass-loaded to ensure that resonances are moved away from the critical mid-range region, and a layer of Rockwool held in place by fabric provides air damping. The grille - machined from a single piece of 9mm birch plywood - is held in place by concealed rare-earth magnets.

 

 The cabinet walls resonate in a controlled manner. Thanks to this, the construction is optimally adjusted with the drivers in the full frequency range. The result of a tedious tuning process is a sound corresponding to the nature of musical instruments or the human voice

 

Edited by PKay
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On 03/02/2019 at 10:02 PM, DEANO23 said:

Concrete paver with rubber pads under it and spikes onto the paver . Been proven that concrete is surprisingly resonate, hence the rubber to decouple it . Cheap to try , Clarke rubber and Bunnings can't go wrong

I have a carpeted cement floor. Do you put these pads on carpet? I understood that it was best to eliminate any movement of the cabinet so as to not compromise the movement of the drivers?

 

1 hour ago, PKay said:

The result is a magnificent mid range. 

 

The cabinet uses classic BBC "thinwall" construction, and is manufactured in the UK from high quality 9mm birch plywood. Hand-matched veneers are applied and finished to a very high standard indeed. All joints in the cabinet are reinforced with hardwood batons to ensure long life and total air sealing. The panels are mass-loaded to ensure that resonances are moved away from the critical mid-range region, and a layer of Rockwool held in place by fabric provides air damping. The grille - machined from a single piece of 9mm birch plywood - is held in place by concealed rare-earth magnets.

 

 The cabinet walls resonate in a controlled manner. Thanks to this, the construction is optimally adjusted with the drivers in the full frequency range. The result of a tedious tuning process is a sound corresponding to the nature of musical instruments or the human voice

 

This sounds like the complete opposite of a HiFi speaker. More like a guitar cab.

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3 hours ago, zydeco said:

How much is the speaker elevated when one installs the Gaia 2? The web-site mentions a height of 35mm but it's not clear if this is the height of the base (i.e., it lifts the speaker by 35mm) or the full height of the unit including the thread.

The unit is 35mm high. My speakers are lifted about 50mm off the ground. A bit more than they would be with spikes supplied. 

AD395506-04EB-401E-A5BF-1358E5457D18.jpeg

Edited by jt301
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If the speakers are ground floor and you can get underneath under them, then there is a simple solution. Get a couple of concrete pavers. Flatten the earth and place then under the speakers. Cut some hardwood or structural pine to length so they  are just a but longer than the top of paver to bottom of floor distance. Bang them into place to they add some upward tension to the floor. Works well, I've done it several times and best of all it costs little and there is no aesthetic issue in room for 'er indoors to whinge about.

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Just tried isolating my speakers - currently spikes on 5 cent coins on timber floor.

 

So Spikes into a heavy 2 inch oregon timber slab sitting on Bunnings rubber isolation pads onto timber floor.

 

Back to the drawing board. It killed the top end and the bass got very flabby - it was immediately apparent.  I don’t think timber as an intermediary is ideal but I had the oregon sitting around so thought it was worth a try. When I can be bothered going to Bunnings i’ll try pavers on the rubber pads. 

 

Its fun to try a few cheap tweaks but I suspect my current set up - spikes, 5 cent coins - will prove to be if not the very best solution at least good enough not to worry about it, without spending a bucket of speculative money that is. 

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not surprised.... you want coupling... not decoupling / isolating :) 

 

want speakers well located and coupled to stand and deliver :) 

 

spikes on 5c coins have worked for decades for folk.... but sure try the slabs it is also something that has worked for folk :) 

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 spikes on coins have always worked for me, as well. Coupling to a concrete floor is certainly the way to go. But the jury is still out - at least for me - on coupling to the floor of my study - it’s basically a big resonating wooden box. 

Anyway, you know how it is, always got to be fiddling with a perfectly good system. 

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2 hours ago, buddyev said:

Just tried isolating my speakers - currently spikes on 5 cent coins on timber floor.

 

So Spikes into a heavy 2 inch oregon timber slab sitting on Bunnings rubber isolation pads onto timber floor.

 

Back to the drawing board. It killed the top end and the bass got very flabby

 

Fascinating, Russ.  :thumb:  But did it stop the floor vibrations that you said you could hear, before?

 

Quote

- it was immediately apparent.

 

C'mon, Russ - you know that can't be so … as it wasn't even a half-blind test!  :lol:

 

Quote

I don’t think timber as an intermediary is ideal but I had the oregon sitting around so thought it was worth a try. When I can be bothered going to Bunnings i’ll try pavers on the rubber pads.

 

I think that would be very worthwhile.  (I believe it should be an improvement over the oregon; it will stop vibrations travelling into the wooden floor … without 'flabbying' the bass.)

 

Quote

Its fun to try a few cheap tweaks but I suspect my current set up - spikes, 5 cent coins - will prove to be if not the very best solution at least good enough not to worry about it, without spending a bucket of speculative money that is. 

 

I'm plumping for the Bunnings paver improving your sound (over spikes/5c coins).  :)

 

But it would sure be interesting to find out whether the high-priced spkr stands would work even better!

 

Andy

 

 

Edited by andyr
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Guest Muon N'

I'd try the Bamboo boards from bunnings, every substrate has a different resonant frequency.

 

I have a carpeted concrete floor and the Bamboo + anti vibration blocks work really well. Maybe it won't work but at worst you end up with boards suitable for under a TT ect'.

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13 minutes ago, andyr said:

 

Fascinating, Russ.  :thumb:  But did it stop the floor vibrations that you said you could hear, before?

 

 

C'mon, Russ - you know that can't be so … as it wasn't even a half-blind test!  :lol:

 

 

I think that would be very worthwhile.  (I believe it should be an improvement over the oregon; it will stop vibrations travelling into the wooden floor … without 'flabbying' the bass.)

 

 

I'm plumping for the Bunnings paver improving your sound (over spikes/5c coins).  :)

 

But it would sure be interesting to find out whether the high-priced spkr stands would work even better!

 

Andy

 

 

Andy, yes, it seemed to stop the transmission of the vibrations into the floor. I wasn’t very confident the Oregon would do the job but it was a pretty meaty chunk of wood so I thought it worth trying. 

I do need to fill the stands sometime soon.

Edited by buddyev
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9 minutes ago, Muon N' said:

I'd try the Bamboo boards from bunnings, every substrate has a different resonant frequency.

 

I have a carpeted concrete floor and the Bamboo + anti vibration blocks work really well. Maybe it won't work but at worst you end up with boards suitable for under a TT ect'.

Do you mean boards from Ikea? Haven’t seen bamboo at Bunnings.

 I have a couple of bamboo cutting boards from Kmart - I’ll try those. They’re  now garlic infused so that should help as well. 

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18 minutes ago, buddyev said:

Andy, yes, it seemed to stop the transmission of the vibrations into the floor. I wasn’t very confident the Oregon would do the job but it was a pretty meaty chunk of wood so I thought it worth trying. 

I do need to fill the stands sometime soon.

If you want a cheap fill try the kiln dried sand at Bunnings. 

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Guest Muon N'
16 minutes ago, buddyev said:

Do you mean boards from Ikea? Haven’t seen bamboo at Bunnings.

 I have a couple of bamboo cutting boards from Kmart - I’ll try those. They’re  now garlic infused so that should help as well. 

Yes, Ikea, sorry for not including that.

 

Cool, should give an approximation to what the Ikea ones will do.

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