Magico Owners and Discussion Thread

[Tony ray]

15 minutes ago, davewantsmoore said:

You will need closer to 16x SVS PB-16 subwoofer.

 

Each time you double the number of sound sources the SPL increases by 6dB.

 

1x    113.8dB
2x    119.8dB
4x    125.8dB
8x    131.8dB
16x    137.8dB

I thought each matching sub you add you get a 3db increase.

[Ittaku]

1 minute ago, Tony ray said:

I thought each matching sub you add you get a 3db increase.

Should be 6.

[Ittaku]

SVS16 and s3600i reviews respectively, alas different sites, so different methodology and not directly comparable results.:

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofer-reviews/svs-sb16-ultra

https://hometheaterreview.com/power-sound-audio-s3600i-subwoofer-reviewed/

Fibreglass composite 16" resin cone with 8" voice coil versus 2x18" paper cones with 3" voice coils.

The reviewer in the second one describes a "rattle" at 50Hz which sounded like "some sort of resonance in the driver cones" He also said it didn't sound (more or less) as musical as other subs he's listened to.

Edited November 15, 2018 by Ittaku

[Tony ray]

10 minutes ago, Ittaku said:

Should be 6.

Now im more confused than ever.

[Bunno77]

I was in this room for the demo's by a rel employee. There's more benefits for adding multiple subs than just spl as demonstrated by having 1,2,4 and 6 subs powered at a time. 

I've heard the Q sub too. It's fantastic though I couldn't really tell if it is any better or worse than the rel no 25s.

Its definitely better than my svs sb13 ultra though

[Satanica]

2 minutes ago, Tony ray said:

Now im more confused than ever.

It gets harder and harder to make things louder.

[davewantsmoore]

18 minutes ago, Tony ray said:

I thought each matching sub you add you get a 3db increase.

It can get quite confusing for people .... because of the "amplifier bit" .... series, parallel, volts, watts, etc.

 

The simple rule to keep in mind is .... that if we have a piston moving back and forward X amount making some SPL ..... each time we double the number of pistons (with each piston moving the same X amount) .... we get 6dB more SPL.

 

 

In the above example, if the pistons are sharing an amplifier it gets complicated .... cos how the pistons are connected (impedance) and how much power the amp delivers to each (watts) is different for different scenarios.

 

... but for our "add more powered subwoofers" scenario, it's easy.   It's just doubling pistons.

 

 

 

[davewantsmoore]

12 minutes ago, Bunno77 said:

There's more benefits for adding multiple subs than just spl as demonstrated by having 1,2,4 and 6 subs powered at a time.

Yep - putting the sources in multiple locations has the benefit of exciting more room modes.

 

... which you don't really get by stacking them up like that.

 

[Ittaku]

21 minutes ago, Bunno77 said:

I was in this room for the demo's by a rel employee. There's more benefits for adding multiple subs than just spl as demonstrated by having 1,2,4 and 6 subs powered at a time. 

I've heard the Q sub too. It's fantastic though I couldn't really tell if it is any better or worse than the rel no 25s.

Its definitely better than my svs sb13 ultra though

Thanks for that. The rels I've heard and are pretty awesome but also quite wide. Getting accuracy at normal to loud listening levels matters more than the peak possible when distortion abounds indeed. Can you recall if the Qsub had one driver on each end and if they were facing laterally during the demo?

[Bunno77]

Yep - putting the sources in multiple locations has the benefit of exciting more room modes.
 
... which you don't really get by stacking them up like that.
 

It was all beneficial from what I heard and changed my thinking on the necessity for subs. And it is a necessity.

[Ittaku]

Just now, Bunno77 said:

It was all beneficial from what I heard and changed my thinking on the necessity for subs. And it is a necessity.

Agreed. I can't imagine high end audio without a subwoofer any more. Their technology has moved light years in the last 20 years anyway.

[Bunno77]

Thanks for that. The rels I've heard and are pretty awesome but also quite wide. Getting accuracy at normal to loud listening levels matters more than the peak possible when distortion abounds indeed. Can you recall if the Qsub had one driver on each end and if they were facing laterally during the demo?

This system was played at over 110db.
I can't remember even seeing the driver as it was sideways and I don't have any pics sorry.
Yeah low level was incredible. Added such realism even when purely vocal music being played.

[Ittaku]

8 minutes ago, Bunno77 said:

This system was played at over 110db.
I can't remember even seeing the driver as it was sideways and I don't have any pics sorry.
Yeah low level was incredible. Added such realism even when purely vocal music being played.

Now you got me excited all over again, but no, I must resist...

[Bunno77]

Now you got me excited all over again, but no, I must resist...

Mate my dream is to find another 5 sb13s.
The difference it made was incredible.

[Tony ray]

10 minutes ago, Ittaku said:

Now you got me excited all over again, but no, I must resist...

There 12 grand a pop. Makes your SVS 16 seem like a budget brand.

[Ittaku]

Just now, Tony ray said:

There 12 grand a pop. Makes your SVS 16 seem like a budget brand.

I was talking about the Q15, and that's 38 grand a pop. They make my SVS16 seem like something they'd sell at JB.

[Tony ray]

So would you go 3 rels 25 or one magico Q-15?

[Ittaku]

Just now, Tony ray said:

So would you go 3 rels 25 or one magico Q-15?

The magico, I have limited space.

[Bunno77]

So would you go 3 rels 25 or one magico Q-15?

That pic was just one side. There were 6 rels in that room stacked 2x3

[Ittaku]

1 hour ago, Bunno77 said:

Its definitely better than my svs sb13 ultra though

By the way, I moved from the 13 to 16 and the difference was substantial with far more authority despite what apparently were equivalent sound volumes and DSP corrected room responses, with the 16 in exactly the same position I had the 13 (smack dead centre between the two main speakers.)

[Steam]

What about getting Paul spencer @Red Spade Audio to build you a subwoofer under your floor and porting it into your room? 

[Ittaku]

14 minutes ago, Steam said:

What about getting Paul spencer @Red Spade Audio to build you a subwoofer under your floor and porting it into your room? 

Concrete slab

[TP1]

8 hours ago, Satanica said:

So are you implying that @Ittaku as a potential buyer should demand proof of this claim?

What if they can't or won't?

Why don't they publish the proof on their website rather than potential buyers having to converse (email) with them I wonder.

To me it's a poor business model, but anyway.

 

Over to you @Ittaku 

 

I'm not suggesting that .   Magico have done the hard R&D  and  have built a reputation on being at the leading edge,. They took a long time to develop the Q-sub and Alon Wolf would not have been satisfied until it could push the boundaries  like they have done with  other speakers. The problem only arises when amateurs believe that they know everything that is to be known about speaker design.  To them new technology cant be true because its not in their '"How to build a loudspeaker book" . 

 

On the issue of emailing Magico,   I suggested that for 2 scenarios:

1.  If someone is genuinely interested in learning about the parameters used for testing. I find that far more preferable to declaring  "funny business" to one of the worlds leading speaker manufacturers who would have vastly more knowledge and ability than any  armchair critic . They might learn something.

 

and 2. If a prospective buyer had any doubts due to the knockers, they could also talk to Magico  and make there own assessment 

[Steam]

29 minutes ago, Ittaku said:

Concrete slab

Roof space 

[TP1]

10 hours ago, davewantsmoore said:

The only "independent" clarification Magico offer on their website, is this:

 

https://www.soundstageglobal.com/index.php/shows-events/ces-2015-las-vegas-usa/175-ces-2015-features/548-ces-2015-mirage-listening-impressions-magico-q7-and-qsub-18

 

The fact that Magico  have published peak  dba readings at all should be seen as a positive.  They have put it out there so that any reviewer or owner can can do their own tests.   In the USA , where competition is fierce, no -one has tried to dispute the numbers.   Industry competitors would be the first to do so if they thought there was anything untoward going on. 

Edited November 15, 2018 by Tasso