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kukynas

60/40 coffee beans recommendation

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if you drinking robusta for years you won't even realize it taste bitter, I don't like bitter coffee either but if I have to choose between acidity and bitter I would pick bitter.

 

Next round:

Brasil Pergamino Sul de Minas  - city+ roasting

Brasil Jardim das Oliveiras - city+ roasting

Brasil Yellow Bourbon Natural - city roasting

Brasil Pink Star - city+ roasting

 

Edited by kukynas
changed "sour" to "bitter" for correct explanation :)

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Ummm, generally sour and acidic are the same thing.:cool:

 

Robusta has less acidity and is less "sour" than arabica. The increased bitterness of robusta is due to it's much higher caffeine content and can mute some acidity in lighter roasts. Robusta is usually also "harsher" although that can be moderated in blends with arabica.

 

Arabica is usually more floral and fruity with complex notes. Some of these disappear with the darker roasts, so it can be a real balancing act to get the chocolate/fruit/aromatics while reducing the acidity.

 

I've also found the "city" rating to differ somewhat from chart to chart and (as a 'card carrying' CoffeeSnob!) prefer the CoffeeSnob scale. My preference for espresso is between CS9 to CS11, depending on the bean. (A high quality copy of the membership card is attached.)

CS_Card.jpg.d80440c5e63b02f5e86f69149ad58f06.jpg

Edited by GregWormald
Added clarity (I hope).

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sorry, I meant acid and bitter :) , city+ will be most probably CS8

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21 minutes ago, kukynas said:

 city+ will be most probably CS8

That may be OK with a bit of ageing to let the CO2 dissipate and then it won't make carbonic acid. 

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I'm guessing for now based on below picture, once delivered I will find out for sure :) , problem locally is with naming, each roaster call it differently, some call "1st Crack Done" as "city light",  "medium" supposed to be "city roast" but last time when I got "medium" it looked more like "1st Crack Done" so it's pretty hard to imagine what you'll get at the end :lol: 

Výsledek obrázku pro city+ roast level

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btw, the one I used to buy and like was in color spectrum somewhere between Full City+ and Vienna-Light French which is sometimes also called Espresso roast to make it even more difficult :lol:, that would be most probably somewhere between CS10 and 11 in your chart

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Fire risk  :lol:

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just marketing term for Starbucks coffee :lol:

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weekend shootout ready :)

 

coffee.thumb.JPG.f2b4893318b23c2c9fe855e1aa3480f1.JPG

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I like the yellow bourbon but it yields a very soft coffee, if you like your robusta hit this definitely hasn't got it.

These are all quite mellow

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I like soft coffee (sort of) and I always had previous (Arabica/Robusta) mix tuned softer on my machine so should be actually ok , I tried yellow bourbon in my previous shootout (first page) already and the only complain at that time was roasting level (still sour to my taste) so this time hopefully with darker roasting I might get closer to my nearly ideal coffee, let's see how the rest of the Brazilians taste :)

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so here is the outcome of the weekend tasting...bear in mind I was looking for balanced coffee with no sourness and chocolate taste so I chosen accordingly 

 

all of them coming from Brazil and are roasted locally, below my short findings, I'm not barista so my description won't be accurate :)

 

Yellow Bourbon (Jamai Café pulped natural) CS8 -  hazelnut and chocolate fragrance, very balanced soft taste, chocolate with puding with clean aftertaste

Pink Star (coffespot scr19+) CS8 - chocolate fragrance, balanced soft taste, chocolate and caramel with slight cocoa aftertaste

Pergamino Sul de Minas (il mio pulped natural) CS9 - fruits and almonds fragrance, sweet rich and stronger taste, chocolate and cereals with strong cocoa aftertaste

Jardim das Oliveiras (il mio pulped natural) CS8 - chocolate fragrance, very strong and sweet taste, chocolate and hazelnut with cocoa aftertaste

 

Rating for Espresso:

1. Yellow Bourbon (Jamai Café pulped natural) CS8 

2. Pink Star (coffespot scr19+) CS8 

3. Pergamino Sul de Minas (il mio pulped natural) CS9

4. Jardim das Oliveiras (il mio pulped natural) CS8

 

Rating for Latte:

1. Pink Star (coffespot scr19+) CS8 

2. Yellow Bourbon (Jamai Café pulped natural) CS8

3. Pergamino Sul de Minas (il mio pulped natural) CS9

4. Jardim das Oliveiras (il mio pulped natural) CS8

 

the main difference between previous Yellow Bourbon and current one is higher roasting level and processing (washed vs. pulped natural) , I got another bourbon to try but need to wait couple of days

so far the best taste coming from Pink Star so unless I find better type I think I'm settled :)

 

below comparison of roasting, left one is Y. Bourbon from first batch (CS6-7) from previous week, middle one is Y. Bourbon from this week and right one is Pergamino as stated above 

 

5a9be9bb49019_coffeebeans.thumb.JPG.b3738b8b2bf7dd8a141a4feed68d5893.JPG

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The darkest still looks a bit lighter than I'd prefer, but you have to settle for what you can get unless you decide to roast your own. The one on the left (IMO) would definitely not be very nice through an espresso machine.

 

Let them rest for another week or so and then try again. Ageing can change the taste considerably.

 

How do they compare to your previous favourite?

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On 12/02/2018 at 7:06 PM, kukynas said:

with that nice chocolate flavor so that's why I'm looking for

For your description of the coffee style you like 

That style has been around for many years and is known by the name of Mocha Java 

 

Traditionaly it’s a blend of African / Yemen and Indonesian / Java beans 

 

So look for Mocha Java  title in the blend and you should get the flavour profile you like best 

I roast this style often when I have the right beans on hand and it’s also a favourite of mine 

 

 

Edited by Full Range

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Greg, thanks for your recommendation, I will wait for another week and see if anything change, btw. I would assume with darker roasting the aftertaste gets stronger, is that right assumption?

in terms of comparison, all of them are less bitter but sourness is higher, for Espresso I could live only with Yellow Bourbon, everything else is still too sour to my taste, for Latte I could live with all of them except Jardim, I could still taste the sourness from it.

it's funny but only now I see how bitter my previous coffee used to be, after spending week with just Brazil Arabica it's hard to go back :lol:

 

Full Range, thanks for your reco, couple of others already reco this previously unfortunately I can't get it roasted locally so unless I buy Yemen and java separately and mix it myself (somehow) the closest roaster is in UK :( , I think Pinkstar mentioned above would be very close to it and for now is my favorite

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Try the guys at coffee.com.au beautiful coffee roasted on site using their own design chinook coffee roaster and some very clever software....

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Topshelf, I wish I could but 15 936 km is just too far :lol:

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Originally the Mocha beans were anything exported from the port of Mocha in Yemen. Some of the east African beans taste similar. Most Yemeni beans are wild, and grown in rocky soil on the slopes of the mountains. They are currently basically unavailable due to the war there.

 

Java beans do come from Java. Now, the beans from Java are mostly separately designated from specific areas of the island, and can vary considerably in taste.

 

I still have a few Yemeni beans left and my favourite "Mocha/Java" blends are Yemen/Aceh, followed by dry processed Ethiopian Sidamo/Aceh, roasted separately and then blended.

 

Darker roasts get more chocolate and lose some of the fruit and 'brightness' that IMO makes the coffee taste sour. I really don't like the bright with milk--it's like sour milk. With a straight ristretto a bit of bright is OK for me. The really dark roasts can taste burnt, although milk too hot can give that taste too. The coffee burnt taste will also moderate with age.

 

The bitterness is from the longer extractions--those with more caffeine, which is extremely bitter. Some find the first few seconds of black drops too intense and have been known to let them go into the drain tray. 

 

(Sorry, I can go on about coffee way too long. I have learned not to do that about hi-fi but still do it about coffee!:lol:)

Edited by GregWormald
adding, adding, adding

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Greg, you can go on as much as you like :lol:

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The roast level has a close correlation to the brew water temperature and coffee style used 

As a general rule 

Light roast will tolerate - Hotter water - over 92deg ( Think Greek / Turkish style and brew styles that steep the coffee for long periods ) 

Med roast - Just on second crack is is the ideal for most coffee machines available in Australia 89 to 92 deg - a very close correlation of bean and brew temp. Get it wrong and the coffee can taste grassy or sour or burnt if the two don’t match the parameters 

Dark roast under 92deg 

 

 

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thanks FR for your info, my machine has limited amount of tweaking in terms of temp adjustments, operates between 88-96 deg in four steps, now I have it set somewhere between 90-92 deg so I hope within the limits of proper preparation

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90-92 should be fine, although the temperature accuracy of most units--at the group handle--is not great.:(

Try a cup or two both up and down a click and see what happens.:)

 

I always doubted I could taste the difference, but I learned I could.:lol:

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another trial done and the winner iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiis? ..... none of them....

I finally tried Café Eternity Yellow Bourbon pulped natural (from above picture top left) after 10 days of chilling out in the back and I think this is it :), nice balanced and smooth chocolate/hazelnut taste with clean aftertaste, in terms of rousting it's somewhere between CS8 - CS9 

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aaaaaaand another one to try :) , should be very similar in taste to yellow bourbon from same roaster just bit more towards chocolate instead of hazelnut, lets see in 7 days...

 

5abd3118c8e3a_CerradoDulce.thumb.JPG.bd3435550b1b538788443b208e7dec03.JPG

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Most of the Brazilian beans I've tried have left me underwhelmed.

I really prefer African or Indonesian and the fruity/chocolate flavours that they seem to have. Are there any of those in your area?

 

Remember to personal message me a good address and I'll get a sample to you--and hope they arrive before they go stale.:)

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