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Snoopy8

GIESELER Groß DAC Review

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44 minutes ago, MattyW said:

Might try one between my pre and power amp, though in no rush.

Be careful between the pre and power - it screwed up the balance of my system, was too much of a good thing. But my pre and power amp are from the same designer/manufacturer. I found it very effective between source components and my pre.

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On 17/01/2019 at 11:31 PM, Max Headroom said:

Be careful between the pre and power - it screwed up the balance of my system, was too much of a good thing. But my pre and power amp are from the same designer/manufacturer. I found it very effective between source components and my pre.

 

I'm guessing if the pre/power amps are from the same manufacturer then chances are they are already matched, so might actually be beneficial if your pre/power amps are from different manufacturers.

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25 minutes ago, Cardiiiii said:

 

I'm guessing if the pre/power amps are from the same manufacturer then chances are they are already matched, so might actually be beneficial if your pre/power amps are from different manufacturers.

Thats my guess...

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On 17/01/2019 at 9:44 PM, Max Headroom said:

Its not about the exact quality of the copper in the cable, but impedance balancing which has a far more significant impact

Thanks for the heads up Max. Unfortunately they appear to be out of stock and removed from the Burson website.

 

On another front, picked up a Gross with Kraftwerk PSU today and will be giving it a spin tonight :)

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34 minutes ago, lemarquis said:

On another front, picked up a Gross with Kraftwerk PSU today and will be giving it a spin tonight :)

Good pickup.  You will be in for a very pleasant surprise when comparing it with the Klein II. 😀

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4 minutes ago, Snoopy8 said:

Good pickup.  You will be in for a very pleasant surprise when comparing it with the Klein II. 😀

Looking forward to that. I was happy with the Klein II, maybe holding out for a Fein II but the price was too good to refuse. The previous owner upgraded to a Dac in the $US 6K territory... ;)

 

Will report back with my impressions.

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Just some quick impressions after a few hours with the Groß and the Kraftwerk PSU which replaced the Klein II dac.

 

I won't reach for the audiophile thesaurus here so I'll be as brief and to the point as I can. Right from the start you know you are in the presence of a fine dac. When I replaced the Klein I with the Klein II, I felt the same sonic signature (Gieseler house sound?) was there, but just bigger and better in every department.

 

Going from the Klein II to the Groß + Kraftwerk was a similar experience but..... magnified by 10. Soundstage just deeper (listening to some Classical choral works is amazing as the voices shift and weave across the soundstage left to right, up and down, in and out). Bass even at very low levels, (like a note from the back of the orchestra) very tuneful and controlled and just there like it wasn't before. Probably helped by the lower noise floor of the unit + the Kraftwerk. Overall the sound is just luscious and liquid in a way that doesn't sacrifice dynamics or detail. Two words also come to mind: weight and authority. I could go on..

 

This is only after a few hours but having lived with the Klein I and II dacs I know there is more to come and this time, much more! In answer to someone's query as to how specifically the Groß is an upgrade from the Klein II, I would say specifically : in every department you care to name. and the difference is not subtle.

 

I'll close by saying that in my experience Clay's dacs give you an entry into the world of serious HiFi. You start to understand what great gear is capable of. Each upgrade removes another veil and gets you closer to the Nirvana that, more than just putting a smile on your face, is like a revelation after years of listening to gear that is just very good.

 

The Groß tells you that you have made another huge leap and if the rest of your gear is up to it, you may well rest on that part of the mountain for quite some time :)

Edited by lemarquis

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19 hours ago, lemarquis said:

Looking forward to that. I was happy with the Klein II, maybe holding out for a Fein II but the price was too good to refuse. The previous owner upgraded to a Dac in the $US 6K territory... ;)

 

Will report back with my impressions.

I agree that what you bought was a steal.  And thank you for the writeup.  So, why didn't you upgrade earlier?   😜 😁 🤣 

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2 minutes ago, Snoopy8 said:

 So, why didn't you upgrade earlier?   😜 😁 🤣 

Full RRP for the Groß and Kraftwerk was a bit out of budget after springing for the Eos Reference. :popcorn:

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On 15/07/2019 at 6:09 PM, Thelastjedi said:

Would you say any one of geiseler dacs offer a smooth and warm sound?

Seems mike that’s their house sound. But don’t confuses that with not being dynamic and punchy, with astounding bass depth and reach. 

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On 10/07/2019 at 10:20 AM, lemarquis said:

Just some quick impressions after a few hours with the Groß and the Kraftwerk PSU which replaced the Klein II dac.

 

I won't reach for the audiophile thesaurus here so I'll be as brief and to the point as I can. Right from the start you know you are in the presence of a fine dac. When I replaced the Klein I with the Klein II, I felt the same sonic signature (Gieseler house sound?) was there, but just bigger and better in every department.

 

Going from the Klein II to the Groß + Kraftwerk was a similar experience but..... magnified by 10. Soundstage just deeper (listening to some Classical choral works is amazing as the voices shift and weave across the soundstage left to right, up and down, in and out). Bass even at very low levels, (like a note from the back of the orchestra) very tuneful and controlled and just there like it wasn't before. Probably helped by the lower noise floor of the unit + the Kraftwerk. Overall the sound is just luscious and liquid in a way that doesn't sacrifice dynamics or detail. Two words also come to mind: weight and authority. I could go on..

 

This is only after a few hours but having lived with the Klein I and II dacs I know there is more to come and this time, much more! In answer to someone's query as to how specifically the Groß is an upgrade from the Klein II, I would say specifically : in every department you care to name. and the difference is not subtle.

 

I'll close by saying that in my experience Clay's dacs give you an entry into the world of serious HiFi. You start to understand what great gear is capable of. Each upgrade removes another veil and gets you closer to the Nirvana that, more than just putting a smile on your face, is like a revelation after years of listening to gear that is just very good.

 

The Groß tells you that you have made another huge leap and if the rest of your gear is up to it, you may well rest on that part of the mountain for quite some time :)

You can rest on that mountain for quite some time. To spend more doesn’t necessarily bring improvement, and if you spend a lot more your system has to be seriously good to be able to take advantage of the improvements. Enjoy!

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23 minutes ago, obitankenobi said:

Anyone have experience with the Gieseler DAC vs the Auralic Vega and can share their experience?

Closest is this

Konverter was released before the Groß DAC...

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On 12/03/2018 at 12:10 PM, Snoopy8 said:

I did an unusual compare yesterday. Not against another 2 channel DAC but a multi channel AVR.

The MRX -1120 came close to the Groß in a limited test and I could easily live with the 1120.

 

What that exercise did was also to highlight once again why I love the Groß. DSD superb, sound stage so wide that it almost replaced the rear channels of a multi channel recording. :wub:

 

 What we did not do was compare16/44.1 non classical music. The Groß does CD quality PCM so well and has this ethereal quality that is addictive (that word again!). Time and time again, I have difficulty stopping and want to listen to the next song. It is this quality that sets the Groß apart. :thumb:

I recently acquired the last Gross dac unit from Clay before the product was discontinued. It has Clay's Gold Tune Kraftwerk built-in.  One of the reasons I bought the Dac was to explore the Hi resolution Pcm musics as well as Dsd format.

 

After a month of listening I think the Dac has finally burnt in. That said, listening to DSDfiles hasn't drawn me in yet, despite the level of details the format produces is much better than that of the Red Book (I compared two versions of Diana Krall The Look of Love). Perhaps my current source (an old Hp i7 laptop, Windows8) and Foobar to feed the files to the Gross Dac are not up to the task. In a separate thread I am seeking advice how to improve this (weak) link within my limited budger.

 

That said, listening to Red Book files has never been better. Indeed I have started to question myself whether I need to listen to Hires and Dsd formats?

 

One thing I know for sure: Mr Gieseler has made a mistake by discontinuing the production of this great dac. Are you sure that the Fein 2 is better? 

 

Chu

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4 minutes ago, chu said:

One thing I know for sure: Mr Gieseler has made a mistake by discontinuing the production of this great dac. Are you sure that the Fein 2 is better? 

Glad you like the Gross and it was a steal buying the last one. 👍 

 

2 of us compared the Fein II with the Gross and found it to be slightly better.  See Fein II reviews:

Worse still, the Fein II was cheaper than Gross + Gold Tune PSU. Clay made the mistake of pricing the Fein II too cheap!  Many of us have told him that his DACs pricing was too low, but he refused to listen. 😂  So, everyone gets incredible value for money DACs which can compete with the big boys costing a lot more.

 

Happy listening...

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On 17/01/2019 at 3:40 PM, Max Headroom said:

...Guys get a pair of Burson Audio Cable+ Pro cables. They will bring the Gieseler DACS up an amazing level when they're matched with the Gieseler Kraftwerk Power Supply.

 

...yes I've got good gear, great speakers and expensive interconnects... 

 

Thankyou, thankyou, thankyou!!

 

I've just received a Burson Audio Cable+ Pro cable and I'm initially trying it between a humble Rega A2D phono stage for my Dual CD503-2 turntable, into a Naim NAC32.5 pre-amp. The difference it makes is pretty amazing.

 

Next I used it between my Gold Tune enhanced Kraftwerked Klein III DAC and the 32.5. Note: The Kraftwerk made a dramatic further enhancement to my already high satisfaction with the Klein III in my system.
 

A favourite discovery on Tidal is this 

‘Joni 75: A Joni Mitchell Birthday Celebration (Live)

TIDAL.COM

TIDAL is the first global music streaming service with high fidelity sound, hi-def video quality, along with expertly curated playlists and original content —...

 

The Burson cables enabled me to hear gently-brushed cymbals at the end of the Brandi Carlile rendition of ‘Down to You’, and everything else I listened to was also enhanced above the very high baseline noted earlier. I’ve managed to buy another set just now from a US eBayer but everywhere else seems sold out.

 

This Sara K track starts with Russian dialogue on a street busy with traffic; again, the extra atmosphere revealed by these cables is striking: 

 

 

TIDAL.COM

Listen to 4atahyta 4y-4y (Russian dialogue) on TIDAL

 

Ever since I’ve had my Klein my fitness has been in decline...as a retiree I spent far too many hrs on my a** revelling in the amazing music I can stream from Tidal or my own 16/44 FLACs.

Edited by lenticularis

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Christmas competition:

 

Who can construct a Limerick incorporating the following:

 

"

Ever since I’ve had my Klein my fitness has been in decline "

 

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Ever since I’ve had my Klein

my fitness has been in decline          It’s just like when I went from Bose

to joining SNA and finding Gros

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35 minutes ago, lenticularis said:

That’s gold, Henry

 

😄

Thanks! I can’t go past a Limerick..

hopefully there are better ones ‘waiting in the wings’!

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Ever since I’ve had my Klein

my fitness is in decline,

It really makes my system shine

...exercise and I just don't align!

Edited by lenticularis
Improved!

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Warning, ownership of a Klein may force one to break out in a rhyme.

Not always of course,

just from time to time.

 

 

Actually mine's a GroB, but close enough.

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There once was a man who bought a DAC, 

He proudly placed in in his hi fi rack, 

But since owning the Klein, 

With His fitness in decline,

He now resembles a 300 pound burlap  potato sack. 

 

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