MLXXX Posted August 15, 2016 Author Share Posted August 15, 2016 7 hours ago, JSmith said: Not with all that quality copper out there... I understand that If FTTN cabinets are installed in a district then the copper from the vicinity of the cabinet locations back to the exchange won't be needed after a while, as phone traffic will be routed through the cabinets direct to NBN fibre. That'll be a lot of copper wiring to decommission! (Some exchanges cover a wide geographical area. This webpage can be used to show approximate boundaries for ADSL2+ capable exchanges: http://www.adsl2exchanges.com.au/ ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgdownload Posted August 15, 2016 Share Posted August 15, 2016 7 hours ago, MLXXX said: I understand that If FTTN cabinets are installed in a district then the copper from the vicinity of the cabinet locations back to the exchange won't be needed after a while, as phone traffic will be routed through the cabinets direct to NBN fibre. That'll be a lot of copper wiring to decommission! Come to think of it I wonder how NBNCo manage that transition. You have 250 copper wires (from nearby homes) that essentially snake all the way back to the exchange. The cabinets need to be built and connected back to the exchange by fibre first obviously. But then at some point all the copper wires will just be spliced into the cabinet. must be a big day. But yes, after that the copper wiring from the cabinet to the exchange is available to pull out. Regards Peter Gillespie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanh Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 The real question is; Is the recovered copper from the cable worth more than the cost of pulling out the cable? Alanh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgdownload Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 11 minutes ago, alanh said: Is the recovered copper from the cable worth more than the cost of pulling out the cable? Alanh Guess they'll decide that then. I do know we had a spate of people stealing copper cabling from the train lines a few years back. Caused all sorts of safety issues. Not sure what coppers worth these days. Regards Peter Gillespie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSmith Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 1 hour ago, alanh said: The real question is; Is the recovered copper from the cable worth more than the cost of pulling out the cable? Alanh Nah... Even if it were, do you imply it should be left there? JSmith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgdownload Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 46 minutes ago, JSmith said: Even if it were, do you imply it should be left there? That would make the most sense. As the government has explained, fibre is already almost obsolete. There's every chance some new faster than light tech that can make use of degraded copper wiring will be discovered soon. Best leave it to save having to run all that copper out again. Regards Peter Gillespie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanh Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Good one peter, I am not saying the cable should be left there, but if the profit from removing it is not high enough it will be left there. Also consider removing the insulation to regain the copper. How much pollution will be caused by burning insulation both between individual wires and the outside protective covering. After all the copper will have to be melted down. Alanh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSmith Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 7 hours ago, pgdownload said: There's every chance some new faster than light tech that can make use of degraded copper wiring will be discovered soon. I highly doubt that mate! To lay fibre in many of these conduits the copper wiring has to be removed. JSmith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffySlayer Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Well aren't I glad I decided to check up on my suburb getting the nbn *insert major sarcasm here* Prior to the election of the libs (1st time), my suburb was due to get FTTP commencing within 3 months, after the election I looked on nbn website and saw "indefinitely postponed" ? Now......... well I just checked and I'm getting frickin HFC in 1st half of 2017, let's see if the supposed upgrades (such as DOCSIS3. 1) will deliver real improvement in dl speeds. FYI, I'm currently on Optus cable and get a respectable 30mbps at 8am...........that drops to 2-3mbps at 8pm due to congestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mello yello Posted September 1, 2016 Share Posted September 1, 2016 On 16/08/2016 at 1:42 PM, pgdownload said: That would make the most sense. As the government has explained, fibre is already almost obsolete. There's every chance some new faster than light tech that can make use of degraded copper wiring will be discovered soon. Best leave it to save having to run all that copper out again. Regards Peter Gillespie somebody at NBN must have read this post Peter, given them an idea, and a memo issued to all departments to come up with some fictional technology based on the use of smoke and mirrors to make people forget they arent getting FTTP anytime soon http://www.news.com.au/technology/online/nbn/nbn-to-trial-groundbreaking-new-copper-broadband-technology/news-story/9531e3c6e6a0b9e735aeb250577fdab9 NEW technology that holds out the hope of dramatically improving Australia’s much maligned internet speeds is being trialled by the National Broadband Network. The “groundbreaking” technology would dramatically beef up the capability of the copper network, opening the door for far superior internet performance for customers. NOKIA?, yeah right, 5 years?, yeah double right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgdownload Posted September 1, 2016 Share Posted September 1, 2016 Smoke and Mirrors? I suppose you could describe fibre cable as mirrors without the smoke In theory it could happen, but I suppose that's point. In practice whatever newer technologies are gradually invented (and they will be invented) are almost certain to involve similar cost and time to implement. Even taking this one on face value it requires node boxes every 50m-100m instead of the current 500m-1000m NBN FTTN plan. I agree though. Marketing brochure's farmed out to new organisations hungry for a bit of easy journalism to post online doesn't make for much optimism. Regards Peter Gillespie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryCook Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 On 17/08/2016 at 7:52 PM, BoogieWonderland said: FYI, I'm currently on Optus cable and get a respectable 30mbps at 8am...........that drops to 2-3mbps at 8pm due to congestion. I'm on Telstra Foxtel HFC cable and get 130 mbps on a good day/time and it never gets below 40 mbps. Cheers Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrC Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 19 minutes ago, GaryCook said: I'm on Telstra Foxtel HFC cable and get 130 mbps on a good day/time and it never gets below 40 mbps. Cheers Gary Unbelievably fast there ... I am sure you are the envy of many on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryCook Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 (edited) 1 hour ago, MrC said: Unbelievably fast there ... I am sure you are the envy of many on this forum. Underground cable, with a node about half way along the street (90'ish houses, no units) so it's not far from my house to the node, then I've been told it's 3k's of fibre optic to the exchange which was upgraded about 5 years ago. As a result I really don't give a rats about NBN, which would probably cost me more as well. BTW, that's no accident, the availability of HPC cable was one of the considerations in choosing the location. Cheers Gary Edited September 2, 2016 by GaryCook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgdownload Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 2 hours ago, GaryCook said: I'm on Telstra Foxtel HFC cable and get 130 mbps on a good day/time and it never gets below 40 mbps. I'm a bit surprised at the number. The HFC speed is usually limited by the ISP according to what plan you're on. I think 100Mbps is the top tier at the moment. Perhaps Telstra just flick all the switches to max on the upper plan. FWIW without knowing your home data consumption, I've found 100Mbps of little practical value for the extra $240 a year it costs. Few households would encounter many bottle necks at 30Mbps so long as it was a solid 30Mbps. Regards Peter Gillespie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrC Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 23 minutes ago, GaryCook said: BTW, that's no accident, the availability of HPC cable was one of the considerations in choosing the location. Cheers Gary Well obviously that is where I went wrong .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eth Nick Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 Copper will never be faster than fibre. Fibre will get faster - as a data 'conduit' it's pretty much future-proof & only limited by the equipment utilising it at each end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSmith Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 1 hour ago, Ralfi said: Fibre will get faster It sure will; A team of engineers has just used a new type of laser-based transmission technology to smash data transfer records, achieving an incredibly speedy 57 gigabits per second at room temperature. To put it in perspective, 57 Gbps is enough to download a whole Blu-ray in just a few seconds. That's the fastest ever data transmission speed over a new type of laser called a vertical-cavity surface-emitting laser (VCSEL), which is used across fibre optic lines - the type of cabling that underpins much of the broadband infrastructure that's already in place in our homes and offices. http://www.sciencealert.com/how-a-new-type-of-laser-has-become-a-data-transfer-speed-record-breaker JSmith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrC Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 11 minutes ago, JSmith said: That's the fastest ever data transmission speed over a new type of laser called a vertical-cavity surface-emitting laser (VCSEL), which is used across fibre optic lines - the type of cabling that underpins much of the broadband infrastructure that's already in place in our homes and offices. JSmith Yeh ... across fibre optic ... not across copper wires in the FTTN method !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSmith Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 29 minutes ago, MrC said: not across copper wires in the FTTN method ! Nah, for sure. That's why I quoted and was discussing optical fibre. I just wish this stupid govt hadn't stuffed the NBN up... Labor's model t'was pretty close to perfect As Ralphi said, copper will never reach the potential speeds of fibre. JSmith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffySlayer Posted September 2, 2016 Share Posted September 2, 2016 7 hours ago, MrC said: 7 hours ago, GaryCook said: I'm on Telstra Foxtel HFC cable and get 130 mbps on a good day/time and it never gets below 40 mbps. Cheers Gary I have my fingers crossed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eth Nick Posted September 3, 2016 Share Posted September 3, 2016 On 16/08/2016 at 0:51 PM, JSmith said: Nah... Even if it were, do you imply it should be left there? JSmith Old lead cabling was left in the ground for a while before it was removed (I worked for a mob who removed the stuff - could be the reason for my dodgy back these days!). I think they'll do the same here - unless it's in the way, they'll just leave it in-situ until it's worth removing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryCook Posted September 5, 2016 Share Posted September 5, 2016 On 2/09/2016 at 3:43 PM, pgdownload said: I'm a bit surprised at the number. The HFC speed is usually limited by the ISP according to what plan you're on. I think 100Mbps is the top tier at the moment. Perhaps Telstra just flick all the switches to max on the upper plan. FWIW without knowing your home data consumption, I've found 100Mbps of little practical value for the extra $240 a year it costs. Few households would encounter many bottle necks at 30Mbps so long as it was a solid 30Mbps. Regards Peter Gillespie We use lots of bandwidth, albeit mostly wifi, there's generally an iPad or 2, a couple of iPhones, 2 x Apple TV's and 2 x Foxtel boxes plus the MacMini of course. But not a lot of data, 200 gb a month does us just fine. My son, a professional photographer, used to use up the data, but since he has his own place we haven't hit the ceiling. Cheers Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLXXX Posted November 5, 2016 Author Share Posted November 5, 2016 Davmel has cleared up some common misconceptions about FTTN speed limitations in another thread. See: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLXXX Posted December 29, 2016 Author Share Posted December 29, 2016 Just an ad hoc titbit of info. I don't know whether it's typical. Holidaying recently in the north of the northern beaches region of Sydney (in the former local government area known as Pittwater), I noticed NBN cabinets on the surburban roads I was walking along. The cabinets were at about 400 metre intervals. Along the particular streets I walked along, I observed that the housing was predominantly detached dwellings, with a very small number of low rise apartment blocks. I'd assume that that sort of cabinet spacing should support pretty reasonable download (and upload) speeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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