Next Generation Jvc's: X5000/7000/9000

[betty boop]

Anyone know if these will have any better gaming performance? That is the only reason I went with Sony for the prev generation but really don't want fork out over $10k for a new Sony just because the JVC don't do gaming well. I really do hope they have improved on that.

really ? I seem to have done ok with gaming on the ps3/4 on various games. this was with the x35. though ended up selling the consoles and the games. more because the lack of games than the experience wiht the projector as such.

[bandyka]

yes sorry I should have said lag time, would love to get a new X series but if they are as slow as the old ones just can't do. The X500 measured at 125ms that is just extremely slow it should be below 40ms.

Edited October 6, 2015 by bandyka

[sero]

It is very obvious playing ps4 on tv compared to my x35. I host a FIFA night for my mates and the lag is obvious and annoying on the projector. I wouldn't even attempt to play an Fps game on the projector

[Owen]

yes sorry I should have said lag time, would love to get a new X series but if they are as slow as the old ones just can't do. The X500 measured at 125ms that is just extremely slow it should be below 40ms.

Motion interpolation causes lots of delay, dynamic iris, EShift and even the color management system likely add more so try will everything disabled.

In the end, the JVC is a home cinema projector and lag is irrelevant for that use. A cheap DLP is a better option for games, less motion blur and no processing to slow things down.

[oztheatre]

Motion interpolation causes lots of delay, dynamic iris, EShift and even the color management system likely add more so try will everything disabled.

In the end, the JVC is a home cinema projector and lag is irrelevant for that use. A cheap DLP is a better option for games, less motion blur and no processing to slow things down.

Very true, they're not manufactured with playstation and xbox in mind, they're cinema projectors. Though having 2 projectors might be seen as overkill.. I'd just put up with the lag tbh.

[michaelp2005]

Does anyone have an idea of when the new JVC's (X5000/7000/9000) will be available in Australia?

I "sort of" need to get a new/replacement projector in the next month. So wondering if I should just get the X500 for now........

[oztheatre]

Does anyone have an idea of when the new JVC's (X5000/7000/9000) will be available in Australia?

I "sort of" need to get a new/replacement projector in the next month. So wondering if I should just get the X500 for now........

Due next month. Normally not released until the current models and stock is cleared, that's pretty much done now too so November looking good.

[Tarnsie]

What do you expect the pricing to be in AUD for the X5000? Im looking for a PJ to watch blu ray movies (no TV).

Edited October 7, 2015 by Tano

[betty boop]

http://www.trustedreviews.com/jvc-dla-x5000b-w-review

x5000 probably a gap filler I suggest. the review above not very glowing and looks like sony has skipped way past ahead, wiht jvc got quite a bit of catching up to do.

[sero]

Id pick up a bargain runout of the x500 if i was upgrading

[Tarnsie]

Im looking to buy a 120" scope (3.8m distance) for a very immersive movie experience (good contrast etc). If the X5000 is only marginally better than the X500 but double the price then i will buy an X500

Is anyone having sales on these X500's?

[Owen]

http://www.trustedreviews.com/jvc-dla-x5000b-w-review

x5000 probably a gap filler I suggest. the review above not very glowing and looks like sony has skipped way past ahead, wiht jvc got quite a bit of catching up to do.

From your link.

"And again the level of detail and sharpness visible on the X5000B/W was no match for the sharpness of upscaled HD pictures as shown on a genuine native 4K display."

That tells me the main difference is the sharpening system and the "reviewer" isn't very knowledgeable. Up scaling cant add any detail that isn't in the source so a genuine 4K projector cant have any advantage over a 1080 model for detail with 1080 source.

Unlike "demo" content Hollywood movies are not high resolution and E-Sift has the potential to deliver more resolution than any movie.

Sharpness is a separate issue and can be added via external processing, high native contrast cant.

So, unless there are more issues than with the current range which is unlikely, or significantly lower contrast, JVC's approach has a lot of merit.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Owen

[betty boop]

re lag, coincidentally a post from zombie over on avs today,

This was a good review on the RS46/X35 when it was first released. They point out the 45 ms lag time which seems like the last 'fast' JVC that was made. All the models since then have had much higher lag time. HDTV measured 140+ MS on the new JVC's so a gaming mode is likely not in the agenda for these new models.

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/jvc-x35-201302052614.htm

for color gamut, it's also one of the first models released that had very good OOTB settings with good saturation track.

so looks like the x35 lag wise was one of the last fast JVC's

45ms I would think is pretty quick, and I honestly couldnt say I detected anything lag wise with either the ps3/4 and on various games first person / shooters, car racing, adventure and such

[Mr Robot]

Iirc computer monitors are between 2-8 ms ... So 45 ms would seem a fair bit more.

[sero]

I have the x35 and notice the lag all the time playing FIFA it's annoying! I wouldn't even bother playing an Fps !

[jutta]

45ms on a FPS ....... You'd be dead more often than breathing

[sero]

Yeah and i use to play on 240ping back in the dial up days and it's still annoying on a projector

[IMDave]

http://www.trustedreviews.com/jvc-dla-x5000b-w-review

x5000 probably a gap filler I suggest. the review above not very glowing and looks like sony has skipped way past ahead, wiht jvc got quite a bit of catching up to do.

Maybe not.

Manni01 commenting on the new JVC's supporting CMD on 4k/UHD content, while the Sony 4k models don't:

"Because the technology in the Sony 4K models is 3 year old while the JVCs have actually upgraded their hardware for UHD Bluray and UHDTV support. Unlike with the Sony 4K, both the HDMI boards and the processing boards have been upgraded.

So Sony kept their old HDMI boards and old processing power, without adding back the P3 filter they took away from the vw1x00ES, while JVC went from 10.2gb/s to 18gb/s with updated their processing which allows them to keep 12bits processing from input to the panels and handle CMD of UHD content. As they have also retuned the filter to P3 instead of Adobe RGB, basically they have done their homework to fully support UHD Bluray and UHDTV, while Sony have fallen asleep at the wheel, hoping that native 4K at twice the price will seduce enough buyers.

I guess that for those who value native 4K over anything else and need a low lag for gaming, it makes sense to go for them, otherwise the JVCs are much more future proof and a much better value (IMHO).

Hopefully next year Sony will do better than a f/w update and a new bulb

i don't think they were expecting JVC to catch up re brightness (which was their USP along with native 4K last year), but as no model is fully compliant yet, I think value is crucial as we're still talking about 1-2 year projectors here, no long term option."

[betty boop]

Maybe not.

Manni01 commenting on the new JVC's supporting CMD on 4k/UHD content, while the Sony 4k models don't:

"Because the technology in the Sony 4K models is 3 year old while the JVCs have actually upgraded their hardware for UHD Bluray and UHDTV support. Unlike with the Sony 4K, both the HDMI boards and the processing boards have been upgraded.

So Sony kept their old HDMI boards and old processing power, without adding back the P3 filter they took away from the vw1x00ES, while JVC went from 10.2gb/s to 18gb/s with updated their processing which allows them to keep 12bits processing from input to the panels and handle CMD of UHD content. As they have also retuned the filter to P3 instead of Adobe RGB, basically they have done their homework to fully support UHD Bluray and UHDTV, while Sony have fallen asleep at the wheel, hoping that native 4K at twice the price will seduce enough buyers.

I guess that for those who value native 4K over anything else and need a low lag for gaming, it makes sense to go for them, otherwise the JVCs are much more future proof and a much better value (IMHO).

Hopefully next year Sony will do better than a f/w update and a new bulb

i don't think they were expecting JVC to catch up re brightness (which was their USP along with native 4K last year), but as no model is fully compliant yet, I think value is crucial as we're still talking about 1-2 year projectors here, no long term option."

while I think its great ivc has gone the expanded gamut route, unfortunately they still persist with the wobulation. its a halfway house. people whom cant afford a true 4k/uhd projector will have one at half the price that gives full benefit on the colour side.

re the sony's I think any comment there is dated refer the latest press releases of sony from cedia on their new models the other day. the sony machine keeps marching on. with full hdmi compatibility (happy to be corrected) and 4k/uhd capability though charging a premium...though we know how much sony are discounted in the retail stores !

[Owen]

Don't get sucked in by Sonys 4K BS. Hollywood movies are not high resolution and never will be as long as 24fps capture remains.

Even under ideal lab conditions a 4K video capture system can only deliver about 3K visible resolution and then only in an absolute still shot with no motion of scene or camera. The vast majority of content is 2K or less even if its delivered in a 4K video format.

Sony know all this, which is why they put so much effort into digital sharpening. People think sharper means higher resolution when thats not the case at all, sharpness and resolution are quite different. High resolution images can look very soft and much lower res images sharp, its all dominated by MTF which is what sharpening systems manipulate.

Give people sharp images and they will assume its due to greater resolution even if its not, it reinforced peoples preconceptions and is therefore great marketing on Sony's part. If JVC's sharpening isn't up to the mark external processing can be used to lift its game.

Native contrast is actuality more important then the last word in "resolution" and Sony are way behind JVC in that area. As far as I am concerned that puts Sony out of the running.

[bandyka]

Damn that Epson LS10000 keeps getting better in my eyes, low lag, laser light source, lens memory, excellent blacks and up scaling... Hmmm damn shame about the JVC gaming lag they would have been my first choice. Would love a true 4K PJ but it seems Sony are re-using their old tech not sure its worth the extra cash over the Epson.

Edited October 18, 2015 by bandyka

[cwt]

Seen a few comments from cedia attendees that the improved jvc e-shift is very hard to pick from the sony 4k projectors when fed a 4k signal Coupled with the hdmi 18gbps board vs the last gen 10.2gbps sony board means better future proofing [ depending on how long you keep your projector natch]

The sonys are lacking with certain 60p 4k colour spaces - noticed that European 4k sat tv may be problematic - not that that matters out here the complete 5000/7000/9000 jvc's have HDR capabilities [ thanks to hdmi 2.0a] in concert with there impressive lumen output which matters a lot with HDR as its bitmapped to the projectors capabilities .. If you want a big difference though flat panels with HDR are the go . Jvc has also activated the lcos panels to 12bit from the old 10 bit bottleneck according to Kris Deering in the 7000/9000 ; and Manni mentioned above; sweet .

If you want HDR [ a batcave will help a lot ] this doesn't start with sony until the $$ 600es replacement . The jvc's have 4k cfi for sports too [ if you watch sports] ; no go on the sony's. Should mention another thing I like about the new projectors is sony's 6000hr lamp life and jvc's 4500 similar estimate ..

[bandyka]

The Sony 520ES has HDR, I am going to see a demo side by side next week (sony-epson) the JVC would be the perfect choice IF it did gaming better. Don't forget you also need and 2.0a compliant receiver.

[cwt]

Don't fancy paying > $10000 to sony for HDR bandyka . Not when you can pay less than 1/2 possibly for a 5000 and get all those lumens You never know maybe the jvc will have a low lag menu setting that will switch off some processing The price difference would pay for a Marantz 8802 hdmi2.0a ; not bad ..

Sony know they can charge whatever the market will bear because of the 4k moniker imho .

[bandyka]

yeah I know but from what I've heard the new JVC will have the same 140ms lag as the outgoing ones that basically leaves me out of their game which leaves me to decided between the epson and the sony unfortunately.