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Ps50c7000 Ps58c7000 Ps63c7000 3d Ghosting / Crosstalk Issues


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Having problems with running 3d "MVA's". A heap of ghosting/crosstalk throughout entire movie. Obviously tried setting the 3d viewpoint on different levels but as you get the foreground calibrated perfect the background is wayout. Been back to Myer to watch on the exact same tv (PS58c7000) and never see a hint of ghosting/crosstalk. Studied all the same bits that they loop in the shops and at home it is awful.

I now have the latest firmware as of 29/11/10 I think it was released (3004) and it hasn't changed anything, maybe making the screen a little darker?..

Samsung have organised a service call but they are closed for a week or so, so I have some time still to muck around with it.

The OZ versions didn't get the 3d optimization like the US models did we?? (Not sure if thats just the same as our 3d viewpoint)

Would really like to hear if anyone has experienced this and if they have found a fix. Or if people are having no crosstalk/ghosting at all on these models?

I will try to get around to taking a picture thru one of the lenses and try to show the ghosting I'm talking about.

As I said in the store I watched for like 15 mins and did not see one bit of crosstalk/ghosting so hopefully there is a fix.

Really love these sets for 2d bluray watched the new "Predators" the other day and movie was alright, picture was UNREAL!!

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What sort of HDMI cable are you using? At a minimum it needs to be a highspeed cable. There is some minor ghosting present in MvA, but it should be quite minimal. Do you have any other 3D content to test? Any of the Sony BD-3D's are good to test as they are pretty much ghost-free. Try Cloudy With A Chance Of Meatballs or Monster House. There should be no ghosting present on those titles.

Andys.

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What sort of HDMI cable are you using? At a minimum it needs to be a highspeed cable. There is some minor ghosting present in MvA, but it should be quite minimal. Do you have any other 3D content to test? Any of the Sony BD-3D's are good to test as they are pretty much ghost-free. Try Cloudy With A Chance Of Meatballs or Monster House. There should be no ghosting present on those titles.

Andys.

Running a 1.4 hdmi cable directly to the tv with pretty good specs compared to others I have seen. Even running the tom cruise "Knight and Day" bluray in 2d to 3d convert shows ghosting around figures and watching FTA it's also present sometimes which I never really noticed before the 3003 firmware update (now updated to the latest 3004 Firmware).

Thanks for the sony BD-3D suggestion's as I've read most people say they have next to none on these titles so will try and pick which movie I would actually prefer to watch and get around to purchasing it, any suggestions as to which is a decent watch for an adult with no kids? haha

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There is some minor ghosting present in MvA, but it should be quite minimal.

Andys, what do you mean by 'present'? A fault in the 3D animation, or a slight deficiency in the Samsung display when displaying 3D?

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Andys, what do you mean by 'present'? A fault in the 3D animation, or a slight deficiency in the Samsung display when displaying 3D?

Well, he said it's only MvA but not the other Sony titles - so it's not the TV.

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Well, he said it's only MvA but not the other Sony titles - so it's not the TV.

It could be that MvA includes some very high contrast material which makes ghosting just visible. It seems a bit odd to me that there should be a fault in the computerised animation. Animation creates a left view and a right view. It should not ghost one view onto the other view.

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Andys, what do you mean by 'present'? A fault in the 3D animation, or a slight deficiency in the Samsung display when displaying 3D?

It's in the transfer. It's been noted in quite a few reviews. It is pretty minimal though. The Sony transfers are ghost free - Cloudy With A Chance Of Meatballs / Monster House look great.

Andys.

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It could be that MvA includes some very high contrast material which makes ghosting just visible. It seems a bit odd to me that there should be a fault in the computerised animation. Animation creates a left view and a right view. It should not ghost one view onto the other view.

Hmmm, I don't think any of us are "experts" enough to comment on your question though. These are just observations.

Edit: at least that's the way I take it.

Edited by Guest
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Maybe someone with a Panasonic 3D-TV could comment on MvA. Minimal ghosting on MvA on the Samsung, but nothing evident on the Sony BD-3D's on the Samsung.

I don't think there's any 3D experts here. We can only comment on what we see.

Andys.

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@jasoroony and @andys

Fair enough.

If a spot where ghosting is in evidence, so many minutes into the animation can be identified, then it is possible to rip the 3D Blu-ray disc, though it might not be legal to do so, using software (DVDFab), and get a side by side version and examine relevant frames in that part of the video for a fault in the animation frames. Another way would be to view that portion of MvA on another set such, as a Panasonic VT20, to see whether ghosting appears. [As I see andys has just mentioned.]

I think a lot of people may assume that shutter glasses 3D is straightforward technology for delivering ghost-free 3D. It isn't. It is a balancing act between:

  • maximising brightness (using a high duty cycle, i.e. keeping shutters open as long as possible, the maximum being 50% for each eye)
  • minimising ghosting (using a low duty cycle, i.e. allowing the sceen phospors plenty of time to go dim for one eye before turning the shutter glasses on for the other eye)
  • minimising flicker (using multiple alternating strobes for each eye for a single frame [at this point in time it may be just 2 strobes, for 96Hz 3D in a LRLR pattern] rather than a single flash for the left eye followed by a single flash for the right eye, i.e. a flickery LR pattern)

Faced with these conflicting constraints, it would not be at all surprising to me that a little bit of ghosting is occasionally visible on most models of 3D TV.

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And I think, quality of the peril sensitive sunglasses.

A little slice of black electrical tape over most of the sensor on the glasses does wonders! I've never had any flicker when going from dark scenes to bright scenes ever since. It really works a treat!

Andys.

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@jasoroony and @andys

Fair enough.

If a spot where ghosting is in evidence, so many minutes into the animation can be identified, then it is possible to rip the 3D Blu-ray disc, though it might not be legal to do so, using software (DVDFab), and get a side by side version and examine relevant frames in that part of the video for a fault in the animation frames. Another way would be to view that portion of MvA on another set such, as a Panasonic VT20, to see whether ghosting appears. [As I see andys has just mentioned.]

I think a lot of people may assume that shutter glasses 3D is straightforward technology for delivering ghost-free 3D. It isn't. It is a balancing act between:

  • maximising brightness (using a high duty cycle, i.e. keeping shutters open as long as possible, the maximum being 50% for each eye)
  • minimising ghosting (using a low duty cycle, i.e. allowing the sceen phospors plenty of time to go dim for one eye before turning the shutter glasses on for the other eye)
  • minimising flicker (using multiple alternating strobes for each eye for a single frame [at this point in time it may be just 2 strobes, for 96Hz 3D in a LRLR pattern] rather than a single flash for the left eye followed by a single flash for the right eye, i.e. a flickery LR pattern)

Faced with these conflicting constraints, it would not be at all surprising to me that a little bit of ghosting is occasionally visible on most models of 3D TV.

This is a pretty good perspective at looking how this type of 3d works, it really is a balancing act as we have all probably noticed even when playing with all the different settings trying to get it perfect but then just revert back to the 3d factory standard settings lol.

Question for Andys (or anyone else feel free), do you have the 3d optimisation setting under the 3d option, or just the 3d viewpoint? Just trying to work out if this is just a US setting or wheather the OZ models should also have this setting as mine only has viewpoint. People in the US have stated it works to optimise the 3d sync between tv and glasses...

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Question for Andys (or anyone else feel free), do you have the 3d optimisation setting under the 3d option, or just the 3d viewpoint? Just trying to work out if this is just a US setting or wheather the OZ models should also have this setting as mine only has viewpoint. People in the US have stated it works to optimise the 3d sync between tv and glasses...

At work atm, but I'm pretty sure it's just 3D Viewpoint. As I said earlier, I've had no sync issues since using the black tape. I would imagine viewing distance & the amount of ambient light could play a part. I'm a tad under 2 metres away in a fairly dark room. Bright bursts of light in my environment have caused sync issues in the past, but not since using the tape. I've wasted numerous hours playing withe the 3D settings just to find a small piece of black tape fixed it completely. It's a beautiful experince when you don't lose sync!

Andys.

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At work atm, but I'm pretty sure it's just 3D Viewpoint. As I said earlier, I've had no sync issues since using the black tape. I would imagine viewing distance & the amount of ambient light could play a part. I'm a tad under 2 metres away in a fairly dark room. Bright bursts of light in my environment have caused sync issues in the past, but not since using the tape. I've wasted numerous hours playing withe the 3D settings just to find a small piece of black tape fixed it completely. It's a beautiful experince when you don't lose sync!

No worries just when you get time would you be able to post your 3d settings (if changed from the standard at all) and also I tried the tape over the glasses receiver leaving just a little showing at one end of the receiver but it unfortunately didn't help in my case but was wondering if you had any tips on how you used the tape (ie over the end, or top or bottom half of glasses receiver?). Also when you said the tape fixed your sync issues, what issues were you having? Just the glasses turning off briefly or were you experiencing more crosstalk then the minimal you see after using the tape?

Played with the picture settings and got the picture so the crosstalk was quite watchable and only quite distracting when displaying objects on a dark background etc, but then I realised it had lessened the 3d effect considerably to the point I thought I may aswell take off the glasses and watch 2d lol.

Thanks heaps for your help

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No worries just when you get time would you be able to post your 3d settings (if changed from the standard at all) and also I tried the tape over the glasses receiver leaving just a little showing at one end of the receiver but it unfortunately didn't help in my case but was wondering if you had any tips on how you used the tape (ie over the end, or top or bottom half of glasses receiver?). Also when you said the tape fixed your sync issues, what issues were you having? Just the glasses turning off briefly or were you experiencing more crosstalk then the minimal you see after using the tape?

Played with the picture settings and got the picture so the crosstalk was quite watchable and only quite distracting when displaying objects on a dark background etc, but then I realised it had lessened the 3d effect considerably to the point I thought I may aswell take off the glasses and watch 2d lol.

Thanks heaps for your help

3D Settings: Default Standard, adjusting Colour to 44, & Colour Space to Auto.

Tape: I placed it so there was just a little bit of the sensor showing at the top of the glasses. It can take a couple of goes to find the sweet spot.

Sync Issues: An occasional flick on the glasses when going from a dark scene/or black back to a bright scene. The tape stopped that. It's possible viewing distance may play a part. I'm under 2 metres & in a reasonably dark environment.

Hope that helps.

Tiles - Out of interest what BD-3D Player do you have? I found the PS3 well below par for BD-3D movies in comparison to the Sammy 3D player.

Andys.

Edited by andys
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I'm using the sammy 5900 bluray player which is why I can't understand I'm pretty sure the store is running the same player to the same 58" plasma yet with absolutely no crosstalk. Not sure if there is a difference in levels of ghosting between the MVA's demo disk in store which just loops certain parts or the feature length disk we received as part of the samsung 3d starter kit, but with my 3d settings set to the default config it is so irritating it renders the movie unwatchable for me (between the distraction of it and the eye strain).

On a better note, wanted to say thanks to Andys watched the entire MVA's movie lastnite with settings which reduced 3d effect but also reduced crosstalk to a tolerable level and with the tape partially over the receiver of the glasses I did not lose snc with the tv once which obviously helped in keeping with the immersion so kudos to Andys!!

Tried to purchase another 3d bluray movie today for comparisons of crosstalk but had no luck with Myer, JB, Big W, Target and Kmart so will purchase one online shortly.

Anyone else have similar problems or no problems at all?? Your feedback would be greatly appreciated :)

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On a better note, wanted to say thanks to Andys watched the entire MVA's movie lastnite with settings which reduced 3d effect but also reduced crosstalk to a tolerable level and with the tape partially over the receiver of the glasses I did not lose snc with the tv once which obviously helped in keeping with the immersion so kudos to Andys!!

Tried to purchase another 3d bluray movie today for comparisons of crosstalk but had no luck with Myer, JB, Big W, Target and Kmart so will purchase one online shortly.

Cheers Tiles. Glad it improved things for you. Maybe give JB a try for some BD-3D titles. Currently available; Open Season, Cloudy With A Chance Of Meatballs, & Monster House. From the UK - Alice In Wonderland & Bolt. From the US - Polar Express & Clash Of The Titans (both region free). There's a few Imax BD's as well from both the UK & US.

Enjoy!

Andys.

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Just to let you know I'm having minor mirage like effect around some scenes mainly M v A (pana 65vt) but also Avatar, like you I have played with the settings which also reduced the 3D effect. I'm starting to think it could be the HDMI (monster home series) going to borrow a friends lead and see if it makes any difference. Will be a few days though. If it does the fix was thinking of ordering some from this site.

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Just to let you know I'm having minor mirage like effect around some scenes mainly M v A (pana 65vt) but also Avatar, like you I have played with the settings which also reduced the 3D effect. I'm starting to think it could be the HDMI (monster home series) going to borrow a friends lead and see if it makes any difference. Will be a few days though. If it does the fix was thinking of ordering some from this site.

That'll be ghosting. As I suspected (& have seen mentioned in a few reviews) the minor ghosting in MvA is in the transfer itself. Just check that your Monster cable is a highspeed cable. If it is, then I doubt another cable will make any difference.

What BD-3D player are you using?

Andys.

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As I suspected (& have seen mentioned in a few reviews) the minor ghosting in MvA is in the transfer itself.

I have found this in a review (from http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/3617/monstersaliens3d.html ):-

Hick-ups such as ghosting and background blur are probably to be expected with new HD 3D, but I see no reason why as the technology matures, studios can't learn to correct these problems.

That strikes me as a somewhat patronising wording for a reviewer to adopt, and there is no attempt by the reviewer to explain at a technical level how the Blu-ray "contains" ghosting. I note the reviewer used a Samsung 3D display.

I have four questions:

1. Is there another review that offers a technical explanation as to how and why MvA apparently contains ghosting defects in the transfer itself?

2. Has anyone actually seen an extracted (ripped) still frame from MvA showing a blemished Left image and/or a blemished Right image? (Perhaps in a thread on an overseas forum.)

3. If anyone has tried playing a troublesome part of the 3D MvA Blu-ray with the player set to 2D mode, was ghosting to be seen? (I think that 2D mode plays the Left image only. If it has been blemished by ghosting the ghosting would presumably appear in 2D mode.)

4. Is the ghosting of the same intensity on a non-Samsung 3D display?

Edited by MLXXX
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I have found this in a review (from http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/3617/monstersaliens3d.html ):-

Hick-ups such as ghosting and background blur are probably to be expected with new HD 3D, but I see no reason why as the technology matures, studios can't learn to correct these problems.

That strikes me as a somewhat patronising wording for a reviewer to adopt, and there is no attempt by the reviewer to explain at a technical level how the Blu-ray "contains" ghosting. I note the reviewer used a Samsung 3D display.

I have four questions:

1. Is there another review that offers a technical explanation as to how and why MvA apparently contains ghosting defects in the transfer itself?

2. Has anyone actually seen an extracted (ripped) still frame from MvA showing a blemished Left image and/or a blemished Right image? (Perhaps in a thread on an overseas forum.)

3. If anyone has tried playing a troublesome part of the 3D MvA Blu-ray with the player set to 2D mode, was ghosting to be seen? (I think that 2D mode plays the Left image only. If it has been blemished by ghosting the ghosting would presumably appear in 2D mode.)

4. Is the ghosting of the same intensity on a non-Samsung 3D display?

All good questions will try 2d mode and also try and take a picture of my crosstalk through the glasses and see if it is more or about the same as what others are experiencing. Also does anyone have any ideas as to why there is no crosstalk on the mva instore demo on the exact same setup as mine but then heaps when i watch at home? Cant work out if the store demo which just loops the impressive scenes in the movie has been transferred differently to the full feature we received with samsung starter kit. Any ideas??
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Tiles, I was hoping you could please contact the store and ask them to check what firmware version (will show under software upgrade) they are using? I'm guessing they may be on the older firmware.

I had my ps58c7000 replaced 3 weeks ago for something unrelated to 3d, and with this one I am noticing an incredible amount of crosstalk, something I never had on the old one. There were a couple of firmware updates made available around the time I had my tv replaced but I didn't update at the time. I updated this new one to the latest before I viewed any 3d content.

I've contacted Samsung (and their head tech) to investigate this further. I think maybe Samsung have messed up in one of their recent firmwares (3002 or 3003), as that is also when they fixed up the '3d picture correction' option.

This is all I can think of, as it's nothing to do with the panel, I can't see the board being at fault.

But it would be interesting to know what firmware that TV you saw in the store is on.

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I've contacted Samsung (and their head tech) to investigate this further. I think maybe Samsung have messed up in one of their recent firmwares (3002 or 3003), as that is also when they fixed up the '3d picture correction' option.

I think you might be on to something there. I was thinking in the back of my mind that it hadn't been quite the same since the 3000 updates. Let us know if you hear back from Samsung.

Andys.

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Yeah the 3005.1 came out yesterday/today, but I already updated and made no difference to the 3d. In fact every single file is exactly the same byte size as the previous update, so don't know what's going on there.

Will post whatever info I get back from Samsung.

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It's interesting to note that Samsung's firmware updates are released for the same series of both LED and Plasma at the same time, same version and everything. Maybe they've been using same code to reduce crosstalk for both LED and Plasma and it has made it worse for the Plasma?

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Yeah the 3005.1 came out yesterday/today, but I already updated and made no difference to the 3d. In fact every single file is exactly the same byte size as the previous update, so don't know what's going on there.

Will post whatever info I get back from Samsung.

You're right, it's made no difference and as you say every file is the same size at 3004. Maybe a placebo fw update. :lol:

Andys.

Edited by andys
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Tiles, I was hoping you could please contact the store and ask them to check what firmware version (will show under software upgrade) they are using? I'm guessing they may be on the older firmware.

I had my ps58c7000 replaced 3 weeks ago for something unrelated to 3d, and with this one I am noticing an incredible amount of crosstalk, something I never had on the old one. There were a couple of firmware updates made available around the time I had my tv replaced but I didn't update at the time. I updated this new one to the latest before I viewed any 3d content.

I've contacted Samsung (and their head tech) to investigate this further. I think maybe Samsung have messed up in one of their recent firmwares (3002 or 3003), as that is also when they fixed up the '3d picture correction' option.

This is all I can think of, as it's nothing to do with the panel, I can't see the board being at fault.

But it would be interesting to know what firmware that TV you saw in the store is on.

I'm running firmware 3004 but I raised this issue in another forum as before I had received the 3d bonus bluray player and starter kit, I did not update the firmware from original purchased end september, and had only watched the 2d-3d conversion on FTA and DVD's which actually worked well on HD shows like CSI etc. which became really sharp and created definate depth.

Then not long before I received the 3d bluray player I also updated the firmware to one of the 3000's and immediatley noticed the 2d-3d conversion was no where near as sharp and added no real depth to HD content. And for the first time I saw ghosting on the 2d-3d (before I could turn the 3d depth up to 10, although looking a little too much it still showed no ghosting).

Tried not to think too much of it until the 3d bluray player came and I was pretty dissapointed to see the crosstalk really bad on MVA's pretty much throughout the entire movie (except when the characters were the perfect sort of distance away then they were displayed without any ghosting). Even when played the bluray Knight and Day in 2d to 3d there was ghosting around characters with 3d depth set on 6.

As I've said before I'm pretty sure places like David Jones and Myer (which I have both seen to have no crosstalk at all) do not update there firmware as I was there a week ago to have another look in Myer and when I asked the guy who was trying to sell me the TV if I could check it out with the glassses, he came back with a pair of panasonic glasses and I had to explain to him the glasses need to match the TV lol.

Out of curiosity why was your tv replaced and how old was it? Starting to think I would not mind starting from scratch and never upgrade another firmware EVER!!! lol

One last thing on this huge post, how did you contact the samsung head tech as I only got the drone on the phone who repeatedly told me to update to the latest firmware after I explained to him I only got problems after upgrading to the latest? Then he booked me in a service call which still hasn't come. I wouldn't mind speaking to someone who knows what their talking about also.

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You're right, it's made no difference and as you say every file is the same size at 3004. Maybe a placebo fw update. :lol:

Andys.

:lol: :lol: true! from the new placebo firmware development department

Maybe needs placebo compatible model tv tho hmmm?

Well nothing back from Samsung today, but a case analyst from the Samsung service division (hopefully not the placebo division?) has assured me it is being investigated by the head tech.

I wouldn't mind at all if they just put the old firmware back up,done up in a new fw of course as fw on these current tv's can't be downgraded, only by board replacement with older fw loaded. That's actually what is in the works for me at the moment, local Samsung service centre organising for a board with the one before 3002. So if no fw fix is done soon, maybe you guys might wanna do the same?

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Out of curiosity why was your tv replaced and how old was it? Starting to think I would not mind starting from scratch and never upgrade another firmware EVER!!! lol

One last thing on this huge post, how did you contact the samsung head tech as I only got the drone on the phone who repeatedly told me to update to the latest firmware after I explained to him I only got problems after upgrading to the latest? Then he booked me in a service call which still hasn't come. I wouldn't mind speaking to someone who knows what their talking about also.

Mine was replaced because it was showing quite a bit of colour bleed and the panel seemed brighter in some areas and perhaps slight burnin. It was actually a display model. It was only 4 months old.

lol about the store dude bringing out Panasonic glasses for it! At least it wouldn't have shown any ghosting whatsoever?

All you'll need is a replacement board with whatever firmware you want loaded, so yeah if they don't come out with a fix (which I'm sure they will), might be worth booking a service call. In fact maybe you should anyway just for them to come out and see it and report it. The more reports Samsung gets the quicker they might act on it.

With the head tech, I haven't contacted him directly. It was through someone at the Samsung resolutions team in the service division as I was contemplating a refund.

I'll PM you

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Here's a review that blames authoring, sort of, but with more than a bit of backpedalling (Engadget 3DTV roundup - picture quality):

The funny thing is cross-talk seems to be related more to the content than anything else. What we mean is that if one TV had cross-talk exposed in the trees in the background of Open Season, the other models did too. Some scenes were worse than others which
makes us think it's more of a problem in the authoring
process than the display itself.
But one thing is for sure, the Panasonic and the LG sets seemed to be able to eliminate the cross-talk
in those problem scenes.

It surprises me that a review specifically on 3DTVs can be worded so vaguely, and reflect no follow up research on a crucial matter such as crosstalk. The review immediately goes on to remark:

This being said, while this is just as good of reason as any other to buy a 3DTV, we don't think the difference was big enough that we'd use it as our determining factor. Really, the ability of a 3DTV to eliminate cross-talk is a single aspect of a single feature and hardly a big deal.

Yes, it's only relevant when using the 3D TV to watch 3D...

I guess if crosstalk is only mild and occasional, it really isn't a big deal.

Edited by MLXXX
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Well before these recent firmwares, I never remembered having any crosstalk at all. And it's exactly the same 3d footage as before. I recorded Origin 3d and the demo loops they were running. The perfect scene which shows the crosstalk is on the big 9 3d logo. Never had it before..

What threw me off track a bit was the cooincidence of me getting my tv replaced during all these recent firmware updates. But then I got thinking that the now greater crosstalk can't really be because of the panel or the board, and it's seeming definite now from others that it is firmware.

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Hopefully a further firmware update will improve the crosstalk situation.

Edited by MLXXX
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I had never seen crosstalk instore or at home ever until after I got around to upgrading the firmware in late october I think it was.

Mind you I had only watched rugby league 3d and the afl and 2d to 3d but I had never experienced it.

Thanks Marauderxp for email address surely the more people they get documenting the problem they will really have to address it.

Each further firmware has not changed 3d at all.

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No probs :)

I was just looking at trying to modify/hex edit an older FW from October for TV to recognise it as updateable, but hmm very much encrypted and everything. Looked at the firmware hack guides on Samygo, but these are different type of firmwares :(

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This is a really dumbed down simple way for anyone is isn't quite sure what the ghosting is I'm talking about.

In Monsters VS Aliens 35 minutes 52 secs in (chapter 10) as they are all getting on the ship, press pause and have a look at the lights on the left of the boarding ramp.

Take the glasses off and you should see 2 white circles (the take off lights).

Now hold the glasses up in front of you so that you only look through the left lense and you will notice you can still see the left light fully lit but the lense partially blocks the right light so it is only half visible.

Now hold up the glasses so that you only look through the right lense and you will see the right light fully lit but the left light is now partially blocked.

Now slowly brings the glasses up while looking at the 2 lights and between the 2 there becomes 1 bright light with 2 partially visible lights either side of it.

I picked this light sequence as it probably demonstrates best how the picture is getting it wrong.

Also try 42 minutes 46 seconds, pause and try the same thing on the vertical cables on the bridge. Although fainter you can still easily see the same thing occuring.

Just my opinion but I think possibly the firmware upgrades have caused a problem with the shutter speed syncing between tv and glasses causing the glasses to slightly continue showing the image which should be blocked out completely.

Obviously I think there will be parts of 3d content where the transfer is to blame but not throughout the entire movie like it is especially when I can't spot it on the instore display models probably with old firmware.

Keep giving your feedback much appreciated

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Awesome stuff (feedback). Yep exactly same kinda thing I saw with Avatar 3d.

And from what I've gathered, it seems the worsened crosstalk issue is with all recent TVALDEUC firmwares (europe, oceana etc - all the PS models). Somewhere I read people in eur reporting increased ghosting recently.

All PN models - TVALAUSC (US etc) firmwares seems to be ok and sounds like their recent fw reduced crosstalk a little more for them.

Another idea to add to yours... I wonder if they've tried to fix up the loss of sync issue with the glasses that was always there from the beginning? Well I think everyone had that prob anyway? where on scenes where changes in brightness, glasses would lose sync for a moment. I discovered long ago that a piece of electrical tape covering 99% of the IR sensor on the glasses fixed it up. But yeah wondering if that might also be related?

Edited by marauderxp
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