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Recusant

Samsung Ps50b650 Vs Panasonic Th-p50g10a

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Another thing I've come across when comparing these two sets is that the Samsung doesn't handle still images as well as the Panasonic, (ie image retention & possible permanent burn-in) which may be an issue if you are going to use it for gaming, like I will be.

I'm stuck on the fence between these two. For one I like the Panasonic because of zero input lag, better image retention handling, black levels, more inputs/outputs and better speakers (wife will be using it during the day) but on the other hand I like the Samsung due to better colour, better de-interlacing (not that I really need it due to a progressive DVD player) and it's apparently better for daytime viewing.

I wish you could stick both of these TV's in a blender and out came the perfect set! :lol:

Edited by Dreamcazman

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I wish you could stick both of these TV's in a blender and out came the perfect set! :lol:

Ahhh, the mythical perfect set :D :D

Afraid it doesn't exist.

OLED maybe?? 5-10 years from now??

Anyway, I'm glad that Panasonic and Samsung are still in the plasma business pushing each other to improve. I shudder to think what would happen if one of them left.

Looks like a number of folk on here are vexed about which to choose Samsung or Panasonic. Like Ford or Holden, BMW or Merc, etc etc. Choice, good, yada :)

Dennis.

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Free-to-air .... yes (only for film type material).

DVD ..... no, if you have a good DVD player such as an Oppo or good AV receiver (HQV or ABT processing) that can do the de-interlacing.

Dennis.

What about routing the FTA through the Beyonwiz or other capable STB?

Edited by Recusant

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Looks like a number of folk on here are vexed about which to choose Samsung or Panasonic. Like Ford or Holden, BMW or Merc, etc etc. Choice, good, yada :)

Dennis.

Except without the irrational emotional attachment/brand loyalty. :)

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Tomorrow, i'm going to test some USB content on the Samsung, a DVD i'm familiar with on both (Crouching Tiger, Lord of the Rings) and a Bluray - depending on what they have available - maybe Australia or Dark Knight.

This is assuming the Myer store in Civic gives me the keys so to speak.

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What about routing the FTA through the Beyonwiz or other capable STB?

Depends on the quality of the de-interlacing inside the Beyonwiz. More than likely the de-interlacer inside any STB is likely to be cheap-n-nasty (not better than the Panasonic).

Note also that with real world content (i.e free-to-air content) the Panasonic deinterlacer issue is rather minor in nature rather than something to fret over (in my opinion). Restating, the issue is that the Panasonic always uses bob de-interlacing rather than weave de-interlacing for film content.

Better would be to take the Beyonwiz content (unprocessed) and pass it into a good AVR with HQV or ABT processing. If you don't have such a setup then just pass the content into the display and live with the results. They most definately are not poor with the Panasonic, sub-optimal would be my phrasing.

Or, just get the Samsung if full resolution over-the-air film content is important to you :)

I'm thinking your worrying about something that is not that big a deal. Deal, yes......big deal, no (IMHO).

Dennis.

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Free-to-air .... yes (only for film type material).

DVD ..... no, if you have a good DVD player such as an Oppo or good AV receiver (HQV or ABT processing) that can do the de-interlacing.

Dennis.

Film source on Oz TV or PAL DVD is very simple to deinterlace, only simple weave is required, any display or DVD player that can’t handle that has real issues. True interlaced source from an interlaced video camera 576i or 1080i as used for sport, many documentaries and most TV programs is a whole different ball game and very difficult to deinterlace properly. True interlaced 1080i is a real challenge and requires heavy duty processing power.

Bob deinterlacing should never be used with any source if a high quality image is the goal.

Scaling is usually blamed for all sorts of picture “issues” on TV’s but 9 times out of 10 poor deinterlacing is the culprit. So unless you intend to deinterlace everything externally to the display a good deinterlacer in the display is a very important.

Edited by Owen

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I can't edit my first post anymore. Weird.

Anyway. Another viewing:

Samsung:

- Remote has better key placement and backlighting, but a worse "feel". The buttons feel a bit sticky and unresponsive.

- SD .avi and DVD look better than i thought, even without tweaking. I wasn't able to test out FTA SD or HD unfortunately.

- The unit's screen looks smaller than the Panasonic, probably because the bezel is bigger (as is the overall size - slightly)

- Indiana Jones DVD looked quite good through composite inputs - i didn't notice any issues. I didn't get to see a panning shot unfortunately.

- Intuitive menu. USB content menu is "cool" but not particularly practical (a file listing would be better than the big icon bits).

- The sound can be improved with the custom settings, but is still very much worse than the Panasonic.

Panasonic:

- Remote keys feel responsive. Nicely weighted. Placement of keys isn't good - focus is on their Viera tools that i don't care about.

- Menu is silly - why are some display settings in the "setup" menu instead of the display menu?

- SD content looked fine, but i did notice jutter/judder (i don't know which is which) on panning shots (a Bluray movie played through composite inputs - Myer's store in Civic is poorly set up).

- Pana reputedly takes 7+ hours for image burn to be a possible issue (after the 200hr burn-in stage). I don't know if the Samsung is similar/worse/better.

Edited by Recusant

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I can't edit my first post anymore. Weird.

Anyway. Another viewing:

Samsung:

- Remote has better key placement and backlighting, but a worse "feel". The buttons feel a bit sticky and unresponsive.

- SD .avi and DVD look better than i thought, even without tweaking. I wasn't about to test out FTA SD or HD unfortunately.

- The unit's screen looks smaller than the Panasonic, probably because the bezel is bigger (as is the overall size - slightly)

- Indiana Jones DVD looked quite good through composite inputs - i didn't notice any issues. I didn't get to see a panning shot unfortunately.

- Intuitive menu. USB content menu is "cool" but not particularly practical (a file listing would be better than the big icon bits).

- The sound can be improved upon, but is still very much worse than the Panasonic.

Panasonic:

- Remote keys feel responsive. Nicely weighted. Placement of keys isn't good - focus is on their Viera tools that i don't care about.

- Menu is silly - why are some display settings in the "setup" menu instead of the display menu?

- SD content looked fine, but i did notice jutter/judder (i don't know which is which) on panning shots (a Bluray movie played through composite inputs - their setup was not fine at all.

- Pana reputedly takes 7+ hours for image burn to be a possible issue (after the 200hr burn-in stage). I don't know if the Samsung is similar/worse/better.

I actually stalked 'Recusant' and we talked about the TVs at Myer Civic. I even placed an order for the 650B. I reckon I have been waiting for a new TV for at least 6 years. So the waiting is nearly over. thanks for your help everyone.

For those who are interested. $2300 was the purchase price.

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Hi Guys,

have been looking on the forum however have only just joined. Thankyou for the wealth of information that i have already found.

I'm looking at purchasing the b650 from a myer store?

What would you suggest would be a doable price? what have others achieved

Thanks

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Hi Guys,

have been looking on the forum however have only just joined. Thankyou for the wealth of information that i have already found.

I'm looking at purchasing the b650 from a myer store?

What would you suggest would be a doable price? what have others achieved

Thanks

$2300 (above) is an excellent price - no extended wty.

$2700 is a price i've been quoted (includes 4yrs extended wty - which i'm inclined to get as Samsung's reputation isn't spectacular from what i read.. but that could just be competitors planting data.. hey - it happens).

Both from Myer - i expect that to be as close to the best price as you're going to get.

Edited by Recusant

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- SD content looked fine, but i did notice jutter/judder (i don't know which is which) on panning shots (a Bluray movie played through composite inputs - Myer's store in Civic is poorly set up).

Blu-ray played through composite video (shudder). Yes, yes, it was an SD test, but.....it still seems immoral (hehehe).

Judder (rather than jitter, now that I've been taught) is absolutely expected in this case. The 1080p24 content will be converted to ghastly 480i60 (inside the Blu-ray player) in the mode you tested. 2-3 pulldown judder will result on panning shots. This is normal. If it didn't judder than the TV would be in some type of nasty "smooth" mode............Smooth modes suck (imo).

Dennis.

Edited by dlb99

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Blu-ray played through composite video (shudder). Yes, yes, it was an SD test, but.....it still seems immoral (hehehe).

Judder (rather than jitter, now that I've been taught) is absolutely expected in this case. The 1080p24 content will be converted to ghastly 480i60 (inside the Blu-ray player) in the mode you tested. 2-3 pulldown judder will result on panning shots. This is normal. If it didn't judder than the TV would be in some type of nasty "smooth" mode............Smooth modes suck (imo).

Dennis.

Yeah, i didn't put much into it. I don't know why Myer doesn't have a better setup - almost all their TVs were running SD.

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Well I have got the G10a but didn't do a exhaustive testing out...

my friends kept telling me to take a DVD across, play it and se eteh quality etc etc... but forgot all that and made a quick purchase when I reckoned I got a good price...

initally got offerred a 3k deal for the G10a inclusive of extra 4 yrs and delivery from Myer chaddy and i accepted it on Saturday...

Recusant post later that he was offerred 2.9k triggerred buyer remorse and followed by a guy on WP getting the same for close to 2.8k, forced me to renegotiate the deal with Myer..

got it at 2.8k total.. got delivery of TV y'day and I am haaaaapppppppppyyyyy...

PQ is excellant... I like Sammy's extra features but went for Panny due to price, supposed better build as per salesperson's... Will put the diff in price to build a HTPC that will give me more features than Sammy...

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Recusant post later that he was offerred 2.9k triggerred buyer remorse and followed by a guy on WP getting the same for close to 2.8k, forced me to renegotiate the deal with Myer..

got it at 2.8k total.. got delivery of TV y'day and I am haaaaapppppppppyyyyy...

Great deal - that's effectively $200 cheaper than the Samsung (after Wii sale.. if you sold it).

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Blu-ray played through composite video (shudder). Yes, yes, it was an SD test, but.....it still seems immoral (hehehe).

Judder (rather than jitter, now that I've been taught) is absolutely expected in this case. The 1080p24 content will be converted to ghastly 480i60 (inside the Blu-ray player) in the mode you tested. 2-3 pulldown judder will result on panning shots. This is normal. If it didn't judder than the TV would be in some type of nasty "smooth" mode............Smooth modes suck (imo).

Dennis.

Wrong, if the display is doing its job properly it should do 3:2 pull down and weave deinterlacing to recreate the original 24fps progressive content, therefore there should be no judder but 24fps jitter should always be present.

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I've beed reading reports of Buzz generated from the Samsungs. If you choose it and have the buzz - call the retailer and have it swapped out immediately.

Forums seem abuzz (pun intended) with customer experiences with the Samsung models (LCD/Plasma?) having a very irritating sound. It should not.

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Forums seem abuzz (pun intended) with customer experiences with the Samsung models (LCD/Plasma?) having a very irritating sound. It should not.

Better put Pioneer on that list as well.

Edited by Owen

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Pioneer aren't part of this topic.

The August issue of "What Hi-Fi" magazine (British) have a review of 50" TVs - i don't know what TVs are covered. It's due to hit the newsagency in the next couple of days (might be there already).

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Wrong, if the display is doing its job properly it should do 3:2 pull down and weave deinterlacing to recreate the original 24fps progressive content, therefore there should be no judder but 24fps jitter should always be present.

No I'm not wrong, most displays don't do what you state Owen.

I know the old Pioneers could take 480i60 input and re-scale that to the native display resolution and redisplay at 72Hz if the original content was derived from a 24fps source (Pure Cinema I think the feature was called).

The Panasonic does NOT do that. 480i60 will be rescaled to native res and the frame-rate will be 60Hz (the same as the input frame-rate).

Same for Sony and most TV brands (60Hz in means 60Hz out, period).

480i60 will result in 3-2 pull-down judder just as the other poster noted.

Samsung, not sure what the Smooth Cinema feature will do, it may do what the Pioneer could...or maybe not, I just don't know :)

Note, my BD-35 Blu-ray player allows me to output NTSC film DVDs as 1080p24, so I get 96Hz from my US derived DVD collection (hehehe) :D :D

Dennis.

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Note, my BD-35 Blu-ray player allows me to output NTSC film DVDs as 1080p24, so I get 96Hz from my US derived DVD collection (hehehe) :D :D

Dennis.

I take it the BD-35 (and hopefully BD-60) are multi-region DVD players. Excellent :)

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I take it the BD-35 (and hopefully BD-60) are multi-region DVD players. Excellent :)

Mine was DVD multi-region-free out of the box :)

I then had it modded for Blu-ray multi-region as well :)

Answer would be yes, either the BD-35 or BD-60 are really good Blu-ray players.....just a tad slow.

Dennis.

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The Panasonic vs Samsung debate regarding reliability isn't one i'd normally put much faith in. Both are reputable brands.

But the B650 seems to have some teething issues. So far, i haven't heard a peep about any issues with the Panasonic.

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The Panasonic vs Samsung debate regarding reliability isn't one i'd normally put much faith in. Both are reputable brands.

But the B650 seems to have some teething issues. So far, i haven't heard a peep about any issues with the Panasonic.

I am leaning towards the 50G10 now instead of the 50B650 because there seems to be heaps of people with problems with the Samsung. Pity because the Samsung looks much better than the Panasonic (design wise).

I am still a bit on the fence though and haven't jumped yet.

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I am leaning towards the 50G10 now instead of the 50B650 because there seems to be heaps of people with problems with the Samsung. Pity because the Samsung looks much better than the Panasonic (design wise).

I am still a bit on the fence though and haven't jumped yet.

On the other hand, I jumped earlier in the week. I now have the Samsung B650 in the lounge and it is great. All my connections are via component, and all are SD. It looks better than I had hoped. DVD looks better than FTA via my Toppy MP; in my view.

Resuscant - do it!

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