The Big Screen Debate, Again :)

[McKenzieJr]

I agree with the general consensus on this one - a screen is definitely better than a painted wall. Where it starts to get interesting, though, is which screen to choose.

I have had a 100" screen for a couple of years now. It uses a fairly standard 2-layer Matte White PVC with a gain of 1.0. With the upgrade of my projector to a Sony VPL-VW60, I have now been looking for a screen material that better suits the optics of my projector.

After looking around for quite some time, I asked Richard at OZTS for some samples (thanks Rich!) and have been busy evaluating these. Because my HT is in my living room, my control of ambient light is not stellar, and the wife likes to have enough light to see by so the door to the living room is left open with the lights on in the adjoining room. I have also been banned from painting the walls and ceiling matte black, so splashback is a bit of a problem, primarily from the ceiling.

In my HT environment, I had the following results:

- I noticed no appreciable difference between the fabric on the screen I currently use and the OZTS Diamond Matte White fabric - though the front textures are subtly different, the overall effect was the same from a reasonable viewing distance;

- the OZTS Evo 3D had a noticeable increase in luminance with no appreciable drop off in angular viewing despite the higher gain, but I believe that if the whole 100" screen were using this material then this would likely result in more reflected light coming off the walls and ceilings and washing out darker scenes in my current HT. If I had a "bat cave" HT, the Evo 3D would be a hands down winner;

- the light side of the OZTS Greyview material has a marked increase in perceived contrast - however, the loss in gain (0.9) results in a slightly duller image than the current white matte, though this should be able to be corrected if I turn the lamp up to high mode again with a corresponding trade-off in lamp life;

- the dark side of the OZTS Greyview screen has a massive increase in perceived contrast, and also a noticeably higher luminance similar to that of the Evo 3D. Unfortuantely, it did have an appreciable colour-shift that may be difficult to compensate for. I was also unable to determine if any hotspotting would occur with this fabric given the size of the sample ... but I hardly expect Rich to provide samples that are 2.56 linear metres! At a gain of 1.3, it's definitely a possibility. However, the colour shift was still the primary concern.

Taking a screen as a given, I would like some advice from those out there with ambient light environments and without the budget to go "black screen" technology, like the DNP Supernova or LP Morgan Galleria Noir - Do you find that a grey screen is the best compromise? Or do those with the Evo 3D find that it performs well in an ambient light environment? Has anyone out there tried the silver side of the OZTS Greyview as a 100" HT screen, and if so, what were your results?

[Tweet]

Initially, I tried the melamine board as a DIY screen but the hot spotting was simply terrible, giving it a translucent coating of some sort could have helped in that regard but I also found it tended to crush the whites a little with slightly pronounced blues as well.

This may well have been the result of poor colour calibration of the projector though I did the best I could with the calibration disc.

The projector at the time was a Sanyo Z2 and it is generally known that Sanyo projectors tend to require a little more tweaking than most to get the colour balance correct.. I am now using a Z4.

After various attempts at DIY screens I eventuated into using a painted curved screen, this improved the gain a little over that of the same screen in a flat profile.

It had the added benefit of reducing wall reflections along with a focusing of the sound from the centre channel toward the seating position, this gave dialogue increased intelligibility.

The centre channel speaker is an omni-directional design which I engineered for the purpose, it allowed for some spatial reflection from the screen itself as well as being a direct radiator.

This works quite well but by no means matches a through-the-screen (AT) speaker setup.

Of course the downside to using a curved screen configuration is that proper projector alignment is required along with the more centralized seating arrangement, a necessity to avoid seeing screen curvature.

Curved screens also offer better depth of field by reason of the fact that the far extremes are more tightly focused than with a flat profile.

'Scope screens will obviously benefit most from this screen profile if going C.I.H .( I think we all will eventually.)

C.M

[Aspect]

As you can see by my pics, my screen is in a family room too, where ambient light is not easily controlled during the day.

My projector is a little light cannon @ 1600 lumens, and I can't say I have ever noticed any reflections from the screen, or any hotspotting either.

I don't tend to watch much during the day, but it is somewhat washed out when I try. I have the Evo3D fabric.

Cheers,

Chris

[IndyJnr]

So if your going down the road of using block out cloth, does this need to be painted or is the cloth

white enough?

Also what would be the best paint for it, Dulux 101 low sheen I've seen mentioned. I just need a screen

to tie me over for 6 months until I buy commercial.

Edited November 16, 2007 by IndyJnr

[Tweet]

First try your block-out cloth first, then if you a not satisfied with that try it painted.

All these screens are subjective, there will naturally be differences between them but the law of diminishing returns is at work here.

If you can make yourself a curved screen using block-out cloth you'll see a better return in brightness for your outlay.

The depth of the curve is only slight, for a 16:9 format screen with an 2400 mm width the curve depth is about 50 mm , that should suit most projector lens profiles.

Just staple the block-out following the curve of the support you might use. Its not rocket science. A curved screen just helps to optimize the image from the projector with the added bonus of greater light captivity.

C.M

[IndyJnr]

The depth of the curve is only slight, for a 16:9 format screen with an 2400 mm width the curve depth is about 50 mm , that should suit most projector lens profiles.

Just staple the block-out following the curve of the support you might use. Its not rocket science. A curved screen just helps to optimize the image from the projector with the added bonus of greater light captivity.

C.M

Thanks C.M, I might go down the path of building a 3m 2.35 screen and bolt the center of the frame to the wall and then pack out the sides to give a curve to the screen and see how that goes.

Cheers

[Dexx1503560195]

I tried white melamine board from Bunnings first. The colour reproduction was OK but hotspotting was terrible. I tried rolling on a coat of clear matt topcoat. But it came out uneven and with some yellowish areas.

Next i tried 3mm thick PVC sign material. This was closer to being matt. But it still had some sheen which caused hotspotting.

I looked at using a sheet of Wilsonart Designer White. But my local supplier wanted over $300 for a sheet!!

Last i tried curtain blockout material stretched over a pine frame. This worked best for me, but it was very fiddly and time consuming to make.

[IndyJnr]

Hi Guys,

I just purchased some 3 pass blockout cloth and was wondering which side is used to project on, the cloth side or the arcylic backing?

[Tweet]

I have never used 'blockout' myself but the smooth side would normally be the better surface to project on otherwise the cloth's texture may become apparent in some scenes.

Hang it up and decide for yourself ...that's the beauty of a DIY project.

C.M

[IndyJnr]

I have never used 'blockout' myself but the smooth side would normally be the better surface to project on otherwise the cloth's texture may become apparent in some scenes.

Hang it up and decide for yourself ...that's the beauty of a DIY project.

C.M

Yeah I tested both sides when I was watching star wars on the weekend and there wasn't much of difference between the two but it was much better than the wall. Hey did you create a riser for you HT room, I think i saw it in your blog but can't find it anywhere now.

Edit: Thats ok the riser was built by fogg, too many chickens......

Edited November 26, 2007 by IndyJnr

[Tweet]

I think there is another 'Chicken Man' out there other than myself, I haven't built a riser in my HT room nor do I have a blog.

I only regularly post on this site and always use my 'birdie ' avatar when I do , though I have signed on elsewhere.

Maybe there was another egg in the nest that I didn't know about........I was a late hatcher......feet first......

C.M

[IndyJnr]

Just finihsed my DIY scope screen at 3.22 meters wide, black velvet border using block out cloth and as I was about to mount it onto the wall (not heavy) I hit my front speaker it wobbled fell onto the screen and put a 5 cm tear near the bottom. I must of looked at it for 30 min before deciding to take it apart and rebuild it with the block out cloth I purchased for the curtains.

So lession learned don't be in a hurry to mount a finished screen and if possible get some help.

[lellis]

Im just about to start making my own screen.

For me it simply comes down to cost, another 'only $1200' puts me way over budget. Setting up a HT isnt cheap!

Projector - 3000

Mount - 150

Cables - 250

New power point in celing - 120

Screen - 300 or 1200

I have looked into Designer white laminante, polar white Laminex and 3 pass blockout cloth

I should be able to rig up a 110' screen for $300 and be able to curve it should i want to...

Edited December 22, 2007 by lellis

[RodN]

Im just about to start making my own screen.

For me it simply comes down to cost, another 'only $1200' puts me way over budget. Setting up a HT isnt cheap!

Projector - 3000

Mount - 150

Cables - 250

New power point in celing - 120

Screen - 300 or 1200

I have looked into Designer white laminante, polar white Laminex and 3 pass blockout cloth

I should be able to rig up a 110' screen for $300 and be able to curve it should i want to...

There ya go I just spent 30 bucks on a 15m HDMI cable so you could have saved some there. A screen should have been factored into the overall cost. They provide significant improvements especially with stuff like the EVO3d fabric. I guess its a PQ upgrade you can look forward to doing one day.

[Aspect]

Im just about to start making my own screen.

For me it simply comes down to cost, another 'only $1200' puts me way over budget. Setting up a HT isnt cheap!

Projector - 3000

Mount - 150

Cables - 250

New power point in celing - 120

Screen - 300 or 1200

I have looked into Designer white laminante, polar white Laminex and 3 pass blockout cloth

I should be able to rig up a 110' screen for $300 and be able to curve it should i want to...

By an OZTS and it comes with a mount, so there's another $150 you've saved... Now you're already up to about $600 in the kitty for a screen. The "only $1200" is for a 3m wide scope screen. A 110" 16:9 may significantly cheaper, but I guess you won't know till you call Richard..

Now, just to clarify, we're not trying to push you to "spend more money" for the sake of. We're just trying to help you spend the money you have as wisely as possible, but RodN and I have just reduced that "budget excess" from $1200 to something more like $400 - $600. Although this may still be too much outside your budget, it's a lot closer and it should, if nothing else, give you food for thought.

Cheers,

Chris

Edited December 23, 2007 by Prior

[IndyJnr]

OK updated a pic of the screen, 3.22 m by 1.4 the black velvet border is the dead zone in terms of light

http://www.dtvforum.info/index.php?act=att...ost&id=4369

total cost was around 170 includes 50 of ripped cloth:(

Edited December 23, 2007 by IndyJnr

[norpus]

OK updated a pic of the screen, 3.22 m by 1.4 the black velvet border is the dead zone in terms of light

http://www.dtvforum.info/index.php?act=att...ost&id=4369

total cost was around 170 includes 50 of ripped cloth:(

Looks fab on the wall Indyjnr - great job esp for the outlay!

[IndyJnr]

Looks fab on the wall Indyjnr - great job esp for the outlay!

Thanks norpus, will post some more pics when the HT room is complete. Its almost there....

[Aspect]

That looks great! Wel done! Scope screens are just the best!

[collinhack]

Ok, so to get widescreen you either have to zoom in a lot or use an anthropomorphic lens. Do you get the "black bars" either way (albeit offsceen)?

[CAVX]

Ok, so to get widescreen you either have to zoom in a lot or use an anthropomorphic lens. Do you get the "black bars" either way (albeit offsceen)?

A what lens? If you use an ANAMORPHIC LENS you will achieve an on screen image as wide as 2.37:1 using the full panel, so NO BLACK BARS top or bottom...

The VW60 actually has a mode called "anamorphic zoom" specially designed for this...

Mark

[CAVX]

Sorry double post

Edited December 28, 2007 by MarkTecher

[collinhack]

Lol, I guess an anthropomophic lens makes everything look more human :-) So I'm guessing not all projectors have the "anamorphic zoom"?

[CAVX]

Lol, I guess an anthropomophic lens makes everything look more human :-) So I'm guessing not all projectors have the "anamorphic zoom"?

Panamorph (in the US) have been actively marketing the need for the so called "vertical stretch" AKA - Anamorphic Zoom, so more and more are supporting it, but sadly there are some very good projectors out there that do not. The JVC HD1 and Epson TW2000 are two that come to mind that do not support this feature...

Mark

[collinhack]

Thanks! After your replies and reading your "CIH explained here" I think I've more or less got it. I guess I'll just post in here somewhere and ask if the projector I'm considering supports this feature - Epson seem particularly keen to pretend they've got it with a suitably vague but important sounding section of the overview:

"Widescreen Experience

The truly widescreen experience . . ."

Hmm, getting very close to misleading advertising.