Bravia X Series Patchy Backlight Bleed

[magictorch]

I called Sony a couple of days ago and was told that it was a moisture problem. As when the panels were being manufactured some moisture go in behind the glass and I was told that I need to run the set for at least 40 hours and up 80 hours to "dry" out the moisture huh. Then if the problem still persisted I needed to call them back.

I don't remember anyone ever saying that this worked for them. I have heard people say that clouds appeared after using the panel for a while, though I don't know if that's because it took them a while to notice.

Ultimately, there is no fix for clouding unless the panel is replaced. Sony don't want to do that, and so will make you jump through some hoops in the hope that you'll give up and go away. I've had two service calls, my panel taken away for two weeks to be 'repaired', and a subsequent firmware upgrade, and the clouding is still as noticeable as before (and now my TV dims automatically when the screen goes dark, an undesirable feature that can't be switched off).

I've decided to press ahead with demanding a refund from Sony or going to court to get it. I paid a premium price and got a flawed product.

[NapoleonDynamite]

Hello everyone,

I've been out of action for a couple months now and was hoping to come back and find the Topfield HD 7000PVR released and the Sony X-Series issues 'resolved'.

I quickly checked the Topfield website yesterday and found no official release news of this device. Geez, but then I noticed the latest JB Hifi junk mail was advertising this PVR for $1196. I'll check the forums more on this shortly.

Back to the topic, it sounds like the X-Series clouding issue is still occurring (for some people). I want to buy these two devices very very shortly, however I'm a little hesitant now to get the Sony X-Series (46"), as its pop luck if you get a 'good' one. Grrr.

Are we any closer on determining if there are any good batches or anything like that? So I can atleast specify what I want from the retailer?

Finally, what choices of HD panels are there now - I believe Sharp and Samsung have Full HD models (any one else - which are available now (42" plus)), which I plan on looking at. However, from what I've read and seen, the Sony X-Series is slick. ARGH!

Thanks guys.

Ray.

[magictorch]

Are we any closer on determining if there are any good batches or anything like that? So I can atleast specify what I want from the retailer?

Not that I'm aware of.

This thread (from the predominantly US-based AVS Forums) is probably your best bet for keeping up with what's happening (or not happening) regarding the issue, but at 269 pages as of today, the general consensus is still that clouding is just as much of an issue for the X-Series as it always has been.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....44#post10471744

If you do decide to buy one, I'll keep my fingers crossed that you get a cloud-free set!

[DFgunner]

i see....i m new here...and i've been reading issues re Bravia 46X....

i've been good guys, sony central & HN in Perth....really love it....and really wanna get it...but after all these cloud issue...i m really concern...

would anyone know there are new Bravia X model coming out soon? or new panasonic model?

[Gazzz]

i'm replacing my 42" schaub with one of these x series i think.... becuase of the bleeding backlight. I'll be way poopie if the x sereies has the same prob!!!

[Souwalker]

Back to the topic, it sounds like the X-Series clouding issue is still occurring (for some people). I want to buy these two devices very very shortly, however I'm a little hesitant now to get the Sony X-Series (46"), as its pop luck if you get a 'good' one. Grrr.

As mentioned a few times on this thread, I was dead set on the 46x but this issue was not worth the hassle and heartache if I got one dud so I went for the Pioneer 507 a few months ago and never regretted this

Rgds

pat

[wiseguy61]

As mentioned a few times on this thread, I was dead set on the 46x but this issue was not worth the hassle and heartache if I got one dud so I went for the Pioneer 507 a few months ago and never regretted this

Rgds

pat

Hi All, I bought the 46X a couple of weeks ago. Perfect panel except .. you guessed it .. clouds. Nowhere near as bad as some have mentioned but still a distraction in the dark scenes. Pretty crap when you pay a premium price! Did even one review I read in all the mags I bought and websites visited before buying mention this problem - NO! Guess I should have checked the forums. Doh! Set manufactured in Jan2007

[NapoleonDynamite]

Hi guys,

I made the plunge and bought the 46" X-Series. Damn fine screen. No problems and no clouding on mine. Phew. I really feel for the people with this issue. When I purchased, I got the retailer to agree to a couple weeks to return the device should it have the clouding.

I looked pretty hard too, using Alien, Tigerland, Batman Begins and The Others in ultra dark scenes. Nothing annoying and no sign of clouding.

Goodluck to everyone else and as always great information in this forum (valuable as hell).

Ray.

[Gadzooks]

After a couple of weeks waiting for delivery, my 46X arrived yesterday and I am extremely happy to report that the black is totally even across the whole screen even when viewed in the dark with the very bright default factory settings. No dead pixels either. The set has a March 2007 build date. [Having been following this forum for a while it seems to me that the sets with the problems seem to be pre-February??]

One very satisfied, and relieved, customer!

Now off to find the Bravia X owners thread to get some settings advice ...

Edited May 9, 2007 by Gadzooks

[ponncho]

After a couple of weeks waiting for delivery, my 46X arrived yesterday and I am extremely happy to report that the black is totally even across the whole screen even when viewed in the dark with the very bright default factory settings. No dead pixels either. The set has a March 2007 build date. [Having been following this forum for a while it seems to me that the sets with the problems seem to be pre-February??]

One very satisfied, and relieved, customer!

Now off to find the Bravia X owners thread to get some settings advice ...

do you know of bravia owners who have had thier sets changed over because of the problem as i have the toshi and get the bleed from the corners.

[wiseguy61]

Out of interest. Has anyone on this forum in Perth (or Oz in general) tried to return their cloudy panel? I bought mine from R*** H*** in Osborne Park (with extended warranty) only 3 weeks ago. Will go and talk to them and see what they say!

[rhodesy101]

Latest Update in my saga.

Sony are not going to repair or replace the panel.

They have requested that their local service centre pick up the unit off me and give me a cheque from Sony, for the value in which I paid for the unit.

Why won't they repair or replace the unit ?

Seems like they can't.

What to do now ?

[Black Dawg Down]

What to do now ?

Whatever you do, don't buy a plasma. At least your LCD is alive.

[davep]

At least you're getting a full refund. Since you went from 40 --> 46" before, any thoughts of going larger again? If so, seeing as plasma is not recommended and the 60" SXRD *might* (includes all disclaimers) have shuttdown issues, I guess the only TV left is the 70" one

[rhodesy101]

At least you're getting a full refund. Since you went from 40 --> 46" before, any thoughts of going larger again? If so, seeing as plasma is not recommended and the 60" SXRD *might* (includes all disclaimers) have shuttdown issues, I guess the only TV left is the 70" one

Not spending another (restraining myself from swearing) dollar more on these so called state of the art screens.

My experience has pissed me off. I have no faith in any new product out there.

I can't go bigger than 50-52" screen as it won't fit in my entertainment unit.

[davep]

I wouldnt lose faith just yet. You've had some bad luck, but ultimately will get a refund, which is good. I don't think I could go backwards after going forwards.

[burstock]

Hi,

Interesting reading. We are having this same issue with Jan 2007 build. Called Sony and they are sending someone around who recons that it is a software upgrade issue. Has anyone had this reason given before ? Anyway Eu***** El***** from Melb are coming around to have a look next week. Seems from the posts here I need to print this out and show the guy what the issue is. As for fixing it, do I seek cash or repair ?

Edited May 17, 2007 by burstock

[rhodesy101]

Hi,

Interesting reading. We are having this same issue with Jan 2007 build. Called Sony and they are sending someone around who recons that it is a software upgrade issue. Has anyone had this reason given before ? Anyway Eu***** El***** from Melb are coming around to have a look next week. Seems from the posts here I need to print this out and show the guy what the issue is. As for fixing it, do I seek cash or repair ?

Been through the whole process.

You probably won't have a choice as they CANNOT fix the issue. Only swap for a new unit or money back. I made my complaint within 30days.

I would have rather they had a proper fix for the issues, instead of my money back. Aside from the clouding / backlight bleed, the bravia x has best PQ I have ever seen especially on HD material.

I am now left with what to do for a TV.

Do i wait, or buy something else cheaper without 1080p.

[wiseguy61]

Hi,

Interesting reading. We are having this same issue with Jan 2007 build. Called Sony and they are sending someone around who recons that it is a software upgrade issue. Has anyone had this reason given before ? Anyway Eu***** El***** from Melb are coming around to have a look next week. Seems from the posts here I need to print this out and show the guy what the issue is. As for fixing it, do I seek cash or repair ?

Burstock I also have rung Sony on Monday this week from Perth in my case. A service agent will contact you within 2 days they said. Well Friday tomorrow and no call yet. Not surprising. From all I have read the best we can hope for is money back like rhodesy101. Otherwise you are in for a dodgy replacement panel that may be better but may also be worse according to other posts .. a lotto! The software fix apparently dulls the backlight and turns the light sensor on (permanently if I remember what I've read on other forums) which ends up giving you a dull image. I know I didn't pay over $4500 for this! I know how rhodesy101 must feel. The Bravia is a great panel and after many months of research I decided it was easily the best. Damn how did I miss the backlight issue!! I want this TV but I don't want the clouds! Bugger! Mine is a Feb2007 build. I went back to Ri** Ha** this evening to talk about this problem - "Ring Sony" - gee thanks mate. The salesman claimed to not have heard of this problem. Hmmm. Friday - Talked to the Manager today. Said he will talk to their Sony rep and get back to me. At least he was responsive. One thing I do know is I won't be lying down on this one till its fixed one way or another!

Edited May 18, 2007 by wiseguy61

[burstock]

Thanks for the replies. Have the repair bloke coming on Thursday, so will let you know how I go.

Edited May 19, 2007 by burstock

[Trigg]

Thanks for the replies. Have the repair bloke coming on Thursday, so will let you know how I go.

Best of Luck!

[magictorch]

Latest Update in my saga.

Sony are not going to repair or replace the panel.

They have requested that their local service centre pick up the unit off me and give me a cheque from Sony, for the value in which I paid for the unit.

Why won't they repair or replace the unit ?

Rhodesy, you've probably already discussed this in this thread, but how did you get to the stage of Sony offering you a refund?

So far I have:

* Called Sony a couple of times

* Had the local service centre examine the unit, take it away for a couple of weeks and bring it back as cloudy as before

* Contacted Consumer Affairs in Victoria and had them chase up Sony for me

* Had the firmware upgraded on my TV (even though I knew it wouldn't fix the problem - and of course it didn't)

I've called my contact at Consumer Affairs and am waiting for him to get back to me, and at the moment I expect that he will contact Sony and either they'll just give in and give me a refund or I'll have to take Sony to VCAT (a civil court in Victoria), take the day off work and pay a $30 fee, and hope the magistrate rules in my favour.

However, if it's just a case of calling Sony up and saying, "The firmware upgrade doesn't work, you know that, I know that, the Bravia X-Series has a lot going for it but no-one should get a cloudy screen after paying $5k+ for it", and then Sony will offer me a refund if I give them the TV back, then I'll do just that.

Like yourself, my first preference would be to have a Bravia X-Series with a perfect screen, but by the sounds of it most of the panels are imperfect to varying degrees and I don't think this will ever change. Sony will just quietly give refunds to the few people who complain and continue to produce poor-quality panels. The cloudiness problem has been known about by the public for about 9 months and still there seems to be no improvement in the quality control of the Bravia Xs - reports of clouding haven't gone down as manufacturing dates have progressed. The new X model will be released this year and I would be surprised if the same problem isn't still there.

I've come to accept that I will never get a perfect Bravia X (well, at least not this year, or before the warranty on my current panel runs out). A refund is the best I can hope for and I've decided to cut my losses and run. Clouding wouldn't be so painful on a $1-2,000 panel, but I paid more than $6,000 for mine in the hope that it would last me for at least the next 10 years, and I can't imagine staring at those clouds all that time. If and when I get a refund I'll put some of it towards buying a smaller, cheaper panel and and wait until technologies mature before buying 'my next big TV', maybe in a few years' time...

[magictorch]

The software fix apparently dulls the backlight and turns the light sensor on (permanently if I remember what I've read on other forums) which ends up giving you a dull image.

Just to clarify:

The firmware upgrade reduces the backlight when the image on the screen gets dark, not when the ambient lighting goes dark as with the light sensor. It still results in a dull image though, and a backlight that increases and decreases in brightness far more often and more noticeably than the light sensor (unless you switch your lights on and off all the time!). If a certain percentage of the screen becomes dark (eg. most of it, or all of it, such as switching between channels or when the credits roll for a movie), the backlight goes down immediately, and then slowly increases back to normal over a second or two when the signal on the screen becomes brighter. This can be distracting when watching a movie, but the worst part (for me) is that the update makes the clouding less noticeable, but not unnoticeable, and if the signal shows a picture that is about half dark and half light, the backlight won't reduce at all and the dark parts of the screen will be just as cloudy as before the update was installed.

I actually quite like the idea of the light sensor. My lounge is very bright so I need the backlight at the maximum level ('torch mode' as the service centre repair centre reps always refer to it as, disdainfully) during the day, but at night it hurts my eyes if I turn the lights in the room off. The problem with the light sensor is that it reduces the backlight level too much. You should be able to adjust the degree of change.

[wiseguy61]

Just to clarify:

The firmware upgrade reduces the backlight when the image on the screen gets dark, not when the ambient lighting goes dark as with the light sensor. It still results in a dull image though, and a backlight that increases and decreases in brightness far more often and more noticeably than the light sensor (unless you switch your lights on and off all the time!). If a certain percentage of the screen becomes dark (eg. most of it, or all of it, such as switching between channels or when the credits roll for a movie), the backlight goes down immediately, and then slowly increases back to normal over a second or two when the signal on the screen becomes brighter. This can be distracting when watching a movie, but the worst part (for me) is that the update makes the clouding less noticeable, but not unnoticeable, and if the signal shows a picture that is about half dark and half light, the backlight won't reduce at all and the dark parts of the screen will be just as cloudy as before the update was installed.

I actually quite like the idea of the light sensor. My lounge is very bright so I need the backlight at the maximum level ('torch mode' as the service centre repair centre reps always refer to it as, disdainfully) during the day, but at night it hurts my eyes if I turn the lights in the room off. The problem with the light sensor is that it reduces the backlight level too much. You should be able to adjust the degree of change.

Thanks for that! I will print this out and quote it to the service guy if I ever see him. It would be really beneficial to all of us 'Bravia Losers' if everyone can post there problems and 'wins' here so we can all get an idea of what Sonys bottom line is. If Rhodesy can get money back then we all should.

[rhodesy101]

This was the procedure I went through

* Called the number on the sony website in relation to cloudy issues. Spoke to the person on the phone who gave me another number to call.

* Rang this number and explained my situation with what was going on with the screen in relation to the clouds / backlight while watching different sources.

* Sony sent authorised service centre guy around to do update via the memeory stick. I showed the guy before the upgrade the issues which he agreed was quite visible. After the update the there was no

change to the picture. Cloudy very evident on black no input screen and while watching all media sources. So upgrade did nothing in my book. The guy who came over was not the regular guy who does my area as he was sick. He followed the sheet that Sony sent him on the procedure they would like him to follow. I asked if he had heard of this issue previously, and he no. Only issue he has dealt with 1 bravia X was an issue with the HD decoder no working properly. I asked him what happens now, and he responded that they will let Sony know of the problem. He said you can keep the TV until the parts come in that are required to fix the unit. Most likely you won't get a new panel, just fix the panel.

* 2 days later I got calll from the local service centre saying they have sent a report of the issue away to Sony and will wait for their response, and if I could fax them a copy of my invoice.

* 1 month later I get a call from the service centre telling me one of their guys will need to pick up the unit off you, and he has a cheque for you with him. I asked a cheque for what ?

"A cheque for the bravia X. Didn't someone tell you" "Sony are refunding the money you paid for the unit" I said what about fixing it, they said NO. Sony have instructed us to pick the unit up and give you

a cheque.

Thats where I am. (took 2 months from day I rang till now)