Panasonic Sd Plasma Th-42pa60a - Need An Advise

[Struggo]

I wasn't expecting too much, but was suprised at the poor quality of the sound. Perhaps a set of speakers cold be the go.

Cheers.

The logitech speakers should do the job just fine.

[chugs]

I don't know if anyone will be interested however a couple pages back I have, sadly, a bit of complaint regarding this set. Well ok not the set, but more Panasonic.

When I purchased this set I had gone to the website and taken note of the very prominent advertising:

1080p Digital Processing Chip Set - This allows the SD Plasma to process full-HD video signals in their original condition before down conversion, allowing the reproduction of highly expressive images with exceptional detail.

I understood that statement to indicate the following. That full-HD equated to 1080p - I wanted this set in order to future proof myself. Yes I understood the set did not have sufficient pixels to display a 1080p signal but with its HDMI input and scalar I felt that the set would at least 1080p signal.

The intent was to plug in a PS3 and with its inability to output games (not movies) at 1080i (when it finds a set that can't take its signal it defaults to 480p) I wanted to ensure that if I settled for the cheaper SD that at least it would take the signal with the most information and try to display as much as it could.

Unfortunately this is not the case. The set cannot accept a 1080p signal (for that matter no Panasonic set has a HMDI input that can take a 1080p signal. Even the $18k model (despite their insistence it has a screen large enough to display 1080p of information).

They've told me (though I'm going to go back to them on this) to go back to the retailer for a refund. That to me doesn't gel though. Its there problem, nothing to do with the retailer. I didn't even ask because I thought the information supplied on their website was correct.

Something else, Since I've I complained (late Feb 07) strangely Panasonic a) denied receiving my letter have updated their site coincidently enough to no longer display that incorrect advice....

Thus is my tale of woe....so if your planning to buy this set in the belief that it takes a 1080p signal in its HDMI input, well beware.

[Struggo]

I don't know if anyone will be interested however a couple pages back I have, sadly, a bit of complaint regarding this set. Well ok not the set, but more Panasonic.

When I purchased this set I had gone to the website and taken note of the very prominent advertising:

1080p Digital Processing Chip Set - This allows the SD Plasma to process full-HD video signals in their original condition before down conversion, allowing the reproduction of highly expressive images with exceptional detail.

I understood that statement to indicate the following. That full-HD equated to 1080p - I wanted this set in order to future proof myself. Yes I understood the set did not have sufficient pixels to display a 1080p signal but with its HDMI input and scalar I felt that the set would at least 1080p signal.

The intent was to plug in a PS3 and with its inability to output games (not movies) at 1080i (when it finds a set that can't take its signal it defaults to 480p) I wanted to ensure that if I settled for the cheaper SD that at least it would take the signal with the most information and try to display as much as it could.

Unfortunately this is not the case. The set cannot accept a 1080p signal (for that matter no Panasonic set has a HMDI input that can take a 1080p signal. Even the $18k model (despite their insistence it has a screen large enough to display 1080p of information).

They've told me (though I'm going to go back to them on this) to go back to the retailer for a refund. That to me doesn't gel though. Its there problem, nothing to do with the retailer. I didn't even ask because I thought the information supplied on their website was correct.

Something else, Since I've I complained (late Feb 07) strangely Panasonic a) denied receiving my letter have updated their site coincidently enough to no longer display that incorrect advice....

Thus is my tale of woe....so if your planning to buy this set in the belief that it takes a 1080p signal in its HDMI input, well beware.

Time to contact fair trading mate!

[pgdownload]

Sorry Chugs that you haven't purchased what you wanted. You obviously had specific requirements and simply asking "Does it do this?" would have seemed prudent - these days, 9 out of ten ads/specifications/salesmen/etc. are stretching the bounds (the other guy is just an outright crook).

'full-HD' is such an aerey fairy term (but its legally defined as anything above 576p). 'Fair Trading' protects you from others chugs, not yourself.

FWIW your problem is with the retailer. They sold you the goods, its their duty to rectify things. The trader can then take it up with Panasonic if they like. I suspect that you'll get a much better outcome if you return to the retailer, explain the issue, and ask for a credit so you can purchase a TV that matches your requirements.

Regards

Peter Gillepsie

[alfalfa]

1080i, 576p, 720p are Australian HD standard signals. The panasonic sd plasma is capable of accepting all those signals.

1080p is not an Australian HD standard.

[chugs]

Sorry Chugs that you haven't purchased what you wanted. You obviously had specific requirements and simply asking "Does it do this?" would have seemed prudent - these days, 9 out of ten ads/specifications/salesmen/etc. are stretching the bounds (the other guy is just an outright crook).

Unfortunately I didn't ask the retailer for any advice. My conversation with Dickie Smith was purely one of haggling. I had gone to the website. Read the material that was there and made my decision to purchase the set based on their advice.

'full-HD' is such an aerey fairy term (but its legally defined as anything above 576p). 'Fair Trading' protects you from others chugs, not yourself.

1080i, 576p, 720p are Australian HD standard signals. The panasonic sd plasma is capable of accepting all those signals.

1080p is not an Australian HD standard.

Although I appreciate what your trying to say, why would Panasonic use a non-standard HD signal value (1080p) in their advertising if Australian standards are only 1080i, 576p, 720p?

I'm a pretty technical person. I know many different obscure standards for many a consumer product (and where to find the info) yet there is hardly a single depository that clearly explains what the deal is.

Most manufacturers won't even tell you what HDMI standard they use (1.2, 1.3 etc)

But get this - the same problem that afflicts my bottom of line Panasonic (that it can't accept 1080p signals) affects the $18k top of the line plasma, that they use to demonstrate Blu-Ray 1080p. Sure the screen is large enough to display 1080p of information but if you look in the specs sheet, for that set, note the HDMI input, the biggest signal (just like mine) that it will accept is 1080i/60.

I suspect what is happening is that the standalone blue ray players when they realise the set won't accept 1080p sends a 1080i signal. This however won't work with a PS3 (for games launched without taking note of a recent upgrade).

I think though ultimately my claim has been validated in light of the fact that Panasonic updated the advice on their website, and agreed to the return.

[pgdownload]

I think though ultimately my claim has been validated in light of the fact that Panasonic updated the advice on their website, and agreed to the return.

Actually chugs, I missed the all important 'p' in the original statement. I'll do a 180 and agree that it effectively states that handling (and FTM displaying) a 1080p signal is within the units capabilities. Glad you've been sorted.

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[alfalfa]

Although I appreciate what your trying to say, why would Panasonic use a non-standard HD signal value (1080p) in their advertising if Australian standards are only 1080i, 576p, 720p?

I can understand that others may have gotten confused. People see 1080p in the description of the digital remastering processor and would jump to the conclusion that the set accepts 1080p.

However panasonic's description of what the digital remastering processor does is an accurate description. It takes a full HD signal (1080i, 720p 576p), converts it to 1080p and then rescales to the panel's native resolution.

This was a huge improvement over the previous generation which converted 1080i to 540p (via simple bob deinterlacing) before scaling to the panels native resolution. There is a noticeable loss of detail with bob deinterlacing.

This was one of the major problems with most processing chips at the time and people were very pleased that panasonic addressed it with a more sophisticated deinterlacer (their 'digital remastering processor').

With relation to your current situation, cant the ps3 output at 720p? You would not be seeing any additional detail over 1080p on a standard def plasma.

It just means an extra step. 1080p gets converted to 720p by the ps3 and then 720p gets converted to 480p by your plasma, compared with 1080p converted to 480p in the ideal situation of the plasma accepting 1080p.

There should not be a noticeable difference in picture quality with the extra step of scaling assuming the ps3 can convert 1080p to 720p properly.

If the ps3 does not output 720p properly (or 1080i) then this is Sony's fault for not supporting international HD standards. Blame Sony.

[chugs]

With relation to your current situation, cant the ps3 output at 720p? You would not be seeing any additional detail over 1080p on a standard def plasma.

you know I was wrong re the PS3, it will output at 720p but the point is there is a differences. I still purchased the set knowing that it would downconvert to 480p. I just didn't want the multiple scaling through two devices. At the end of the day I could of purchased a cheaper plasma (or gone my preferred cheaper solution of buying a top of line, which had a much better picture the Pana SD plasma, a Sony 68cm CRT - now that looked incredible, all for the cheap price of $1400) - instead I thought I'll future proof myself to a certain degree with a set that can take a 1080p signal (albeit downconverting it)

To your other comments I didn't quote, full HD prefaced by the description "1080p" cannot but confuse the consumer irrespective of how technically correct it is.

I like what they've put on the website now. If that was there in the first place then I simply wouldn't of purchased it.

It just means an extra step. 1080p gets converted to 720p by the ps3 and then 720p gets converted to 480p by your plasma, compared with 1080p converted to 480p in the ideal situation of the plasma accepting 1080p.

Personally I don't understand why the set won't accept a 1080p signal - it has a HDMI port (so the interface has sufficient bandwidth). It has a chip that takes a signals and even upscale them to 1080p. What is this magical piece of hardware that makes a set accept 1080p, that the Pana SD doesn't have? The only possible answer is that it’s a product cycle ploy. They down-engineer the hardware to ensure a neat steady progression of improvements, each sufficiently compelling enough to convince the consumer to fork over more money, when it could of just been turned on in the technology they already own.

I disagree with the, "you can't tell the difference" - can you tell the difference between a set of $10,000 electro statics speakers and $15,000 set?

Can you see the difference between a good scalar and a badly engineer scalar both design to output the exactly resolutions on the a screen of the same size?

Of course you can - same with this issue. The source, quality and transmission of the media to your output device, irrespective of what it can handle, will cause notable differences. The way your television process that signal will affect how its displayed.

[mickbick]

Hi

Sorry, this is off topic from where the thread currently is, but can someone tell me if the PA60A enables picture adjustments per input, esp inputs 2 and 3 (component)?

Thanks

Mick

[Ultrasmart]

Hi

Sorry, this is off topic from where the thread currently is, but can someone tell me if the PA60A enables picture adjustments per input, esp inputs 2 and 3 (component)?

Thanks

Mick

Yes Mick, can individually adjust all inputs.

[Action]

Great forum, plenty (if not to much ) advice.

I have pretty much settled on the 42pa60a.....my only query is, I will be using this unit for viewing Foxtel only...... being this screen is 16:9 and it would seem that most of the stuff shown on Fox is 4:3......is the 42pa60a a waste of money when one considers this.....would I be better off sticking with my old 68cm NEC crt?

Edited April 10, 2007 by Action

[pgdownload]

would I be better off sticking with my old 68cm NEC crt?

Contentious query on this forum Action . Foxtel does a lot of 'classic stuff' which does mean 4:3. Presumably movies are broadcast widescreen though?

4:3 v 16:9 is one item to consider. The other is that you're increasing your screen size by 2/3rds (26" => 42"). This is nominally a plus, however as is often mentioned Foxtel picture quality is not all that flash and even less so when you blow it up on a 'large' screen. It will still be pretty good but some shows are going to look quite 'fuzzy'. In this instance your 26" is going to look much 'sharper'. Any chance one of your (work)mates has a Foxtel/large screen set up that you could try before you buy?

So for the time being if you've got a workable TV that you don't mind, I'd be inclined to hold off for a bit and see if Foxtel doesn't improve its PQ a bit etc. You can be be damn sure that a better TV for less $$ will be available in 6-12 months time.

Note that DVDs are also pretty much all 16:9 these days.

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[Action]

Thanks for the reply, Peter.

I don't have any movie channels, I mainly watch Foxsports, Discovery, Nat Geo and Lifestyle and it would appear that these are mainly 4:3.

Unfortunately none of my mates have the plasma/foxtel combo......looks like I might be the bunny.

You have given me some more food for thought.......at this stage I am inclined to hold off.

[pgdownload]

Thanks for the reply, Peter.

I don't have any movie channels, I mainly watch Foxsports, Discovery, Nat Geo and Lifestyle and it would appear that these are mainly 4:3. Unfortunately none of my mates have the plasma/foxtel combo......looks like I might be the bunny.

You have given me some more food for thought.......at this stage I am inclined to hold off.

Well all that said its nice to have a big new TV Just a final thought. Because of how 4:3 is shown on a 16:9 TV (ie black bars down each side) the net effect of going from a 29" TV to 42" TV will be to add 2" right around each side of your current TV. ie look at your current screen and add 2" top,bot, left and right and that's how big the picture will be on the new screen.

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[Action]

Thanks Peter........the black bars thing is what is going to sink this for me.......I know I am going to get sick of explaining to everyman and his dog (wife included), why I have this beautiful new widescreen TV with black bars each side of the pic.

[pgdownload]

Thanks Peter........the black bars thing is what is going to sink this for me.......I know I am going to get sick of explaining to everyman and his dog (wife included), why I have this beautiful new widescreen TV with black bars each side of the pic.

We'll to counter that there's always "centre cut zooming" most TVs have it. Picture your 4:3 square box sitting comfortably inside the 16:9 rectangle (black bars down either side). Now enlarge the 4:3 box so that its touching the left and right sides of the rectangle. At the same rate the 4:3 square also moves off the top and bottom of the screen.

The net effect is that you crop a few inches off the top and bottom of the 4:3 broadcast, but the remaining image takes up the entire 16:9 screen.

On the minus side, your zooming into an already blown up picture (bigger screen) broadcast at Foxtel PQ. So again the PQ will take a bit of a hit. You can check out this effect at any store. Find a 4:3 broadcast and use the remote to zoom. Note that you are zooming, not stretching (which keeps all the picture on the screen but makes evryone look fat)

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[wheelz]

Thanks for the reply, Peter.

I don't have any movie channels, I mainly watch Foxsports, Discovery, Nat Geo and Lifestyle and it would appear that these are mainly 4:3.

Action most of foxsport and lifestyle these days is in WS.I watch fox on both a 68cm(bedroom) and a plasma and i know you will be more than happy if you purchase a plasma,as long as you use s-video or component to connect fox you will be happy.

ps.more channels and more shows are changing to WS on fox

[Action]

Action most of foxsport and lifestyle these days is in WS.I watch fox on both a 68cm(bedroom) and a plasma and i know you will be more than happy if you purchase a plasma,as long as you use s-video or component to connect fox you will be happy.

ps.more channels and more shows are changing to WS on fox

Aha...more food for thought....thank you wheelz.

How sure are you that more fox will be broadcast in WS?

[Action]

Update....after a bit more research within these forums, I have pretty much decided to go with an LG 32FS2ANB......76cm CRT

[alfalfa]

Update....after a bit more research within these forums, I have pretty much decided to go with an LG 32FS2ANB......76cm CRT

Why?

[Action]

Hi alfalfa,

Less dollars mainly......considering I will be viewing only Foxtel, I consider the extra dollars for a better/larger display (which will not improve the Fox pq, but possibly make it worse), to be a waste.

[alfalfa]

Hi alfalfa,

Less dollars mainly......considering I will be viewing only Foxtel, I consider the extra dollars for a better/larger display (which will not improve the Fox pq, but possibly make it worse), to be a waste.

90% of our viewing is foxtel digital and I find the panasonic sd to handle it really well. You can increase the mpeg noise reduction if you notice the artifacts but from my viewing distance of 3.6m I dont notice any major issues with the picture quality.

4:3 shows on a 76cm ws crt are really tiny ... even smaller than the 68cm non ws crt I previously owned.

My neighbour also upgraded from a crt to the pana sd after first buying a 32" pana lcd which looked terrible with foxtel. I advised them to swap the lcd for the sd plasma because the picture quality would be better and frankly 4:3 shows on the 32" lcd were hardly any bigger than the 4:3 crt they previously owned. They have been very happy ever since.

What distance will you be viewing the tv from?

[pgdownload]

Hi Action,

We'll you are roaming around ) CRTs we're easily much better than early panels (just smaller), but this is not really the case any more. However they are a really proven technology and they cost a heck of a lot less than a panel. So if you don't mind about the bulk and don't need 90cm+ screen size they are a great choice.

That said, while 76cm is a nice size (IMO) you should realise that it will be about 2cm shorter than your current TV. You'll gain about 6 cm on either side though to make it a wide screen TV. But this will mean that if you are watching 4:3 content then the picture will atually be smaller than if shown on your current TV. Not saying don't go this way but just something to be aware of.

As mentioned though a fair wack of stuff is now broadcast 16:9 and this will only increase (on any platform) as 16:9 becomes the standard.

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[Action]

Thank you both for your advice.......yes I'm all over the place

Went into GG's this morning to have a look at the LG CRT.......they had $950 on it.....offered him $700 thinking they would not go for it, next thing you know I'm loading it into my car!

The PQ looked nice instore, though I realise probably not as good as a Pana plasma, but hey for just viewing FOX, I thought the price was right.

alfalfa, I am viewing the TV from about 2.2m