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Owen

Sony Bravia "r" Series (sxrd) 60"-70" 1080p

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Does an Xbox 360 actually render at 1920x1080p?

I did not think it had the power to do that, even the PS3 is underpowered for 1080p 60.

Cant the Xbox output 1080i from a component connection?

The 360 is doing 1080P in an internal MS build and will be released shortly to the public through xbox live. Currently the dashboard software is running 1080i over component and VGA.

D1 resolution and lower media will be upscaled over VGA only (legal issues with css with upscaling on analogue connections) in the coming update. Hence, the importance of using VGA instead of component.

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A VGA to Component transcoder will solve that problem.

It will convert 1080i from VGA to 1080i Component.

I have the Crescendo Systems one for sale.

http://www.crescendo-systems.com/transcoder.html

If anyone is interested in purchasing it, PM me.

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Owen

Thanks for your thoughts. I believe you have hit it on the head for me. I have only just started really looking at displays in stores and I have been changing my viewing distance and you can definately see less of the "detail" at 3.5m which is about my viewing distance.

Its quite amazing to notice the difference as you move back. As for lighting, I have a reasonably bright room with side on daylight. I think it will work well enough.

I have to say I dont really like plasma, lcd is ok to a point but I find the refresh or response as some prefer me to call it... I find it uncomfortable to watch. The picture feels like it is crawling or ...its hard to describe.. the picture moves accross the screen but its not smooth or linear... its a little up a little to the side a little down..jagged I guess so I feel a slight motion sickness from watching them....

As I mentioned in another post I saw the 46" Sony Bravia Plasma 1080p and I was very impressed. If I had the $$ I think it would be a no brainer.... The picture is smoother by quite a lot and that motion issue is gone for me.

I think it looks as good at say 1.5m as the other brands do at 3m and at 3m the Bravia is quite brilliant in comparison.

I think my decsions is nearly made.... if you think it is a kick arse tv then perhaps its time to make it so... I will drop in at Sony shop to see whats on display and then bite the bullet either way.

treb

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I think you will find that the 46” BRAVIA is an LCD panel, not a Plasma. :blink:

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again your right... hope I am not gonna spend my whole day doing this... :blink:

treb

Edited by treble

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As I mentioned in another post I saw the 46" Sony Bravia Plasma 1080p and I was very impressed. If I had the $$ I think it would be a no brainer.... The picture is smoother by quite a lot and that motion issue is gone for me.

treb

You better check out sd through this set what I saw was rather secong rate! what I mean is YOU take the remote and change channels unlike the staff that just show HD signals

cheers laurie

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You better check out sd through this set what I saw was rather secong rate! what I mean is YOU take the remote and change channels unlike the staff that just show HD signals

cheers laurie

Theres a 40" X series at QV in melb and it looked better than the other LCDs in that alcove displaying both SD and HD. It definately is a better set that that massive 42" philips that has terribly purple blacks when viewed off axis.

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Theres a 40" X series at QV in melb and it looked better than the other LCDs in that alcove displaying both SD and HD. It definately is a better set that that massive 42" philips that has terribly purple blacks when viewed off axis.

Er... Dritz, this is a rear pro thread you know! And how do RP sets perform off axis? :D Not too well!!!

This has gone OT but briefly I assume your Philips comments refer to my beloved 42PF9831 & I must disagree re the blacks, unless you were standing looking down on the display? At correct viewing (read eye-level) in a dark room the Philips has a very good black level IMO when set correctly. I cant see any normal seating arangement giving any problem. As for "massive" yes it is certainly bigger due to the (fantastic) surround ambilight & that really becomes and extension of the display so the experience is like no other 42" panel, more like a 45-50 IMO which it obviously isn't. I think a 60" or 70" R-pro is really what you should refer to as massive! SD it shines on a 480/576 feed and let the set do the scaling not the STB/DVD player - then I have seen blows the 40/46X away in SD colour clarity and blur, based on direct comparison. All IMHO of course. :blink:

That said Im considering the 60" SXRD for my lounge room and I look forward to seeing it. SD performance is my concern, and I hope the judder & blur I have seen (at Sony) on the X is gone based on the 2.5ms response.

Also would anyone comment on why the tiny SXRD panel has an excellent response time of 2.5Ms compared to the X's 8Ms fullsize LCD? Is LCOS so completely different to LCD in that regard or is the the size of the actual panel? And will this translate into better upscaling 480/576 SD performance than the Bravia X also?

Thanks.

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I be surprised the 2.5msec is black to black levels be more grey to grey buy still good enough for sports viewing

cheers laurie

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My rearpro LCD Samsung has suffered from Burn In. i have two destinct 4:3 edges on my screen at the moment. Fortunately the LCD engine is about to be replaced.

My LG MW60 LCD RPTV also suffered from burn in - also have 2 distinct 4:3 edges on the screen

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Er... Dritz, this is a rear pro thread you know! And how do RP sets perform off axis? :blink: Not too well!!!

Thanks.

You should check out those photos the german guy took of his 55" SXRD...the off axis performance is phenomenal, cant imagine anyone sitting that far off axis to need anything that good.

My LG MW60 LCD RPTV also suffered from burn in - also have 2 distinct 4:3 edges on the screen

Mine suffers from image persistance, not burn-in per se.

Turning the screen off clears it, and apparently for those with it really bad, long periods of displaying widescreen content also removed it.

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Sony claim the off-axis performance as a selling point of these SXRD displays so it should be pretty good.

The reason SXRD (and all other LCoS) displays have such great response times is because the technology allows the use of a much thinner layer of liquid crystal than on a traditional LCD display. Hence it can respond much more quickly. It's one of the main reasons LCoS was invented.

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Gents I went into a store to have a general look at the market and see what sort of pricing I might be able to get on the 60" lcos sony.

The salesman (his card says audio visual consultant haha) reckoned the Sony RPTVs were crap and he doesnt stock them. He sighted display quality problems and what he claimed to be poor lamp life. I am techncially minded person and I have spent a fair amount of time doing research so I sought to challenge his positions in a freindly way - cos either I way I win by eventually getting the best display for my needs.

1. He says any 10 000:1 contrast ratio is going to be poor lamp life in a RPTV. On this point I dont ahve any data either way, but given I work full time and have no kids it's not going to be on all the time anyway so I'm not overly concerned.

2. On poor image quality I think he failed to recognise this is an LCOS display and that to the best of my knowledge no previos LCOS RPTV by Sony has come to Australia. And regardless of any subjective assessment, the reports of LCOS and reviews from overseas models shows a generally good outcome when objective tests are done on professional equipment.

The bloke was talking up the Toshiba 72CM9Ua. When I asked about DLP rainbows he acknowledged the problem but did not identify it as a major issue - he indicated that he doesnt see rainbows and only people with eyesight problems do. I couldnt see any rainbows in the demo of the 72cm9ua either.

I'm not going to subjectively comment on picture quality because the demo only had a D1 resolution bit of footage showingover unknown connectors. I asked for a 1080 test pattern set but none were attainable in the store.

He says he thought the unit will do 1080P on the VGA input as well, asked me to check on the website, and I did on the website showing it did not support 12080P over VGA, like the Sony.

What do people think? Given picture quality can be objectively measured there must be a degree of science than can be applied in comparisons.

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Another question I had was what version HDMI interface is supported on these?

If it is v1.3, and the source has footage encoded in Dolby TrueHD will the display actually decode TrueHD?

I know Dolby Digital Plus doesnt require v1.3 specifically, but again will that actually be decoded by the display?

It will probably be awhile before I can afford a good AC receiver that will switch HDMI v1.3 and my existing one does not support 8 channel analogue. The other thing is the missus doesnt always want to watch in theatre mode and would prefer to just run audio through the display (yes shes crazy! heh).

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Gents I went into a store to have a general look at the market and see what sort of pricing I might be able to get on the 60" lcos sony.

The salesman (his card says audio visual consultant haha) reckoned the Sony RPTVs were crap and he doesnt stock them. He sighted display quality problems and what he claimed to be poor lamp life. I am techncially minded person and I have spent a fair amount of time doing research so I sought to challenge his positions in a freindly way - cos either I way I win by eventually getting the best display for my needs.

1. He says any 10 000:1 contrast ratio is going to be poor lamp life in a RPTV. On this point I dont ahve any data either way, but given I work full time and have no kids it's not going to be on all the time anyway so I'm not overly concerned.

2. On poor image quality I think he failed to recognise this is an LCOS display and that to the best of my knowledge no previos LCOS RPTV by Sony has come to Australia. And regardless of any subjective assessment, the reports of LCOS and reviews from overseas models shows a generally good outcome when objective tests are done on professional equipment.

The bloke was talking up the Toshiba 72CM9Ua. When I asked about DLP rainbows he acknowledged the problem but did not identify it as a major issue - he indicated that he doesnt see rainbows and only people with eyesight problems do. I couldnt see any rainbows in the demo of the 72cm9ua either.

I'm not going to subjectively comment on picture quality because the demo only had a D1 resolution bit of footage showingover unknown connectors. I asked for a 1080 test pattern set but none were attainable in the store.

He says he thought the unit will do 1080P on the VGA input as well, asked me to check on the website, and I did on the website showing it did not support 12080P over VGA, like the Sony.

What do people think? Given picture quality can be objectively measured there must be a degree of science than can be applied in comparisons.

On point 1, dont forget contrast ration measures a difference between two extremes, not a level of brightness per se. So in theory, what he says does not have to necessarily be the case.

And in actuality, Sony exacerbate the numbers by use of the Iris, however unlike normal number tweaking, this actually has practical benefit.

By letting less light thru on dark scenes, it creates better blacks and thus lowers the "dark" component of the contrast ratio.

That has nothing to do with lamp power, and if he had bothered to do his research, he'd find that the contrast ratio of the chips sony use in the SXRD are much less than 10,000 without the Iris activated (Owen will know the exact numbers), therefore the 10,000 number (which btw has been independantly verified) is obtained by lowering the "dark" component of the ratio almost entirely as the Iris doesnt make the lamp any brighter.

As for the Toshiba...is that model number you cited the same model as the 72" that there is ALLL those problems with in the other thread around here? premature bulb blowouts (300hrs), diagonal lines on the screen, 'butterfly' effects, noisy colour wheels on some, as well as an increasingly less satsfactory response from Castel?

Even if its not teh same model, thats Toshiba's current history (bit of a misnomer i suppose), you compare that to what you know of Sony's quality levels overseas from your own research and see whcih you'd prefer.

Edit: Just checked it, and its the same.

I was looking at this set myself, but held off waiting for the Sony, and glad i did as during that time, all these problems surfaced.

Not to mention its still only a DLP using a single-chip and colour wheel, not to mention the Wobulation which puts me off a bit.

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Bathrone I can tell you why tha salesperson dissed the Sony and says he wont stock them...............

the real reason - he sells Toshiba !

Toshiba is a very very very tightly distributed product and so those stocking dont need to discount it as much, so you dont get as good a deal, and he rubs his hands together when he stitches you up with an inferior set, at a high markup.

Its the oldest trick in the book. Diss the product you dont have, and dont stock and promote the one with the most profit, or you have in stock, or you need to shift.

Now what would his comments be is he had 6 of the sony in his storeroom. Quite possibly the Sony would be the best TV on the market.

I have seen the SXRD sony beasts and they are magnificant. And everyone who ahs seen them at Sony's launch events agrees.

Wait till you see it then make a descision.

Sony SXRD is NOT LCos and it is not DILA, or anyhalf baked technology, it is a Sony technology which in my opinion genuinely works

Wait till you see it with your eyes and you will agree.

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Guest Sparky66
Sony SXRD is NOT LCos and it is not DILA, or anyhalf baked technology, it is a Sony technology which in my opinion genuinely works

Sony technology is LCOS based technology.When Intel failed to deliver a marketable stable LCOS chipset to various manufacturers, it pulled the pin on its production ! This is where Sony stepped in and developed their own variation of the same technology. :blink:

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Gents I went into a store to have a general look at the market and see what sort of pricing I might be able to get on the 60" lcos sony.

The salesman (his card says audio visual consultant haha) reckoned the Sony RPTVs were crap and he doesnt stock them. He sighted display quality problems and what he claimed to be poor lamp life. I am techncially minded person and I have spent a fair amount of time doing research so I sought to challenge his positions in a freindly way - cos either I way I win by eventually getting the best display for my needs.

1. He says any 10 000:1 contrast ratio is going to be poor lamp life in a RPTV. On this point I dont ahve any data either way, but given I work full time and have no kids it's not going to be on all the time anyway so I'm not overly concerned.

2. On poor image quality I think he failed to recognise this is an LCOS display and that to the best of my knowledge no previos LCOS RPTV by Sony has come to Australia. And regardless of any subjective assessment, the reports of LCOS and reviews from overseas models shows a generally good outcome when objective tests are done on professional equipment.

The bloke was talking up the Toshiba 72CM9Ua. When I asked about DLP rainbows he acknowledged the problem but did not identify it as a major issue - he indicated that he doesnt see rainbows and only people with eyesight problems do. I couldnt see any rainbows in the demo of the 72cm9ua either.

I'm not going to subjectively comment on picture quality because the demo only had a D1 resolution bit of footage showingover unknown connectors. I asked for a 1080 test pattern set but none were attainable in the store.

He says he thought the unit will do 1080P on the VGA input as well, asked me to check on the website, and I did on the website showing it did not support 12080P over VGA, like the Sony.

What do people think? Given picture quality can be objectively measured there must be a degree of science than can be applied in comparisons.

Basically, this “salesman” is full of it.

Either he just does not know what he is talking about, or he is being deliberately deceptive.

Take your business elsewhere.

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Another question I had was what version HDMI interface is supported on these?

If it is v1.3, and the source has footage encoded in Dolby TrueHD will the display actually decode TrueHD?

I know Dolby Digital Plus doesnt require v1.3 specifically, but again will that actually be decoded by the display?

It will probably be awhile before I can afford a good AC receiver that will switch HDMI v1.3 and my existing one does not support 8 channel analogue. The other thing is the missus doesnt always want to watch in theatre mode and would prefer to just run audio through the display (yes shes crazy! heh).

The Sony does not have HDMI 1.3, I can’t see any use for it either.

The high colour feature of 1.3 is not supported by any video source, now or in the foreseeable future. Both BluRay and HDDVD do not support it.

As for the advanced sound features, well what use are they on a TV?

To get value out of them, you will need a high quality multi channel sound system costing more then the TV.

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Thanks all, very much appreciate the expert advice.

1. Has anyone done any objective or subjective picture quality comparisons with the new Sony to other LCOS or DLP products available in Australia?

2. HDMI. Agree that the colour formats for the HD-era wont help and I've never been a fan of colour conversions for quality encodes. With the momentum behind GPGPU applications I think we will see more and more real time transcoding and the possibility of real time colour conversions but I am skeptic of any improvements being possible by shifting the colour format.

What I think might be relevant is the case where HDMI is being sent from high def sources directly into the Sony in cases like my partner only wanting to casually listen to stereo without having the full bass response of our 5.1 setup. In this case, there will be alot of dolby digital plus and to a lesser extent TrueHD audio being passed over the HDMI. It would be handy if the Sony has the ability to decode the latest audio formats, downmixing that into stereo for playing on the Sony.

I'm not sure if the Hd-DVD / BD players are able to be configured to pass stereo over HDMI, and for the players to do the downmixing themselves. This would overcome and incompatability at the display but I'm not sure if this feature is implemented.

I guess the obvious workaround is to use stereo RCA for audio but this will just continue the AV rack cable clutter.

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This may be old news, but I just went into the Sony Central store in Melbourne CBD, and was told they were not expecting even demo stock until the end of the month. I don't know where they rank on the distributors pecking order, but if anyone knows of anywhere in Melbourne that has a demo model on the floor, I'd be keen to hear about it.

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This may be old news, but I just went into the Sony Central store in Melbourne CBD, and was told they were not expecting even demo stock until the end of the month. I don't know where they rank on the distributors pecking order, but if anyone knows of anywhere in Melbourne that has a demo model on the floor, I'd be keen to hear about it.

Sony Aust treats Sony Central like any other customer sometimes I think it's an disadvantage as people think there ARE Sony

cheers laurie

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Sony Aust treats Sony Central like any other customer sometimes I think it's an disadvantage as people think there ARE Sony

cheers laurie

Yes, this is a common mistake. I know that the Sony Central in Chatswood is owned by Valtel... the same guys who own the Retravision store.

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