Sony Grand Wega

[mizu]

17" WUXGA = laptop?

[Owen]

17" WUXGA = laptop?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep, a Dell 9300 with 1920x1200 screen.

A VERY nice screen it is to.

I have never seen an LCD display that I would consider using as a TV.

The blacks are no where near good enough under subdued lighting conditions.

However, under bright viewing conditions thay can look great.

Peitro, you should have been watching when the dude adjusted your Toshi.

Convergence adjustment is a simple task to perform, and would only take a few minutes. Just go into the service menu, bring up the convergence grid and adjust the Blue and Red to overlay the Green. (don’t adjust Green unless the geometry needs adjustment).

It's also easier to do adjustment in a darkened room, as blue is difficult to see.

[pietro1503559499]

I have tried doing the service convergence myself...I don't have the patience and I find the blue and red very difficult to see properly, even in a dark room. Maybe I'll have another go. The easiest way I found was to play the convergence screen of the DVD of Digital VideoEssentials and flick back and forth from that to the Tosh grid. Very fiddly though and I would happily pay Aaron if I could get him to come to the country.

I'm wondering about a Sony G420 19" monitor on E-bay until the day arrives when I am happy to have an LCD.

BTW saw the Tosh 62" DLP again today at HN with 9 HD loop of Bondi Beach. The colour looked so artificial. Would it be true to say that large digital monitors also only have 16.2 or 16.7mill colours, similar to PC monitors, whereas CRT has billions of colours?

[Owen]

Sorry to hear you are having such difficulty there Pietro, but don’t give up.

Practice makes perfect.

I’d recommend a G500 or G520 over a G400 or G420.

They are 21” in stead of 19", and are also considerable better monitors.

I have owned 4 G400’s, and none was in the same class as my G500.

There is probably a good reason for that, as the G5’s cost double what a G4 did.

There are plenty of used G5’s around these days.

There are some good TFT displays around, but most of the good ones seem to be in notebooks for some strange reason.

The 17”-19” stand alone TFT monitors that I have seen are rubbish compared the supper high res panels used in notebooks.

Colour on digital displays is much better then it used to be, and after calibration should not be a problem.

Forget about DLP’s if you want a top quality picture IMHO.

Wait for the SXRD offerings, or look at the better Plasma options.

The soon to be released Sony LCD RPTV’s with dynamic iris are supposed to be very good as well, and will be cheaper then the SXRD’s.

[Owen]

Another little tit bit of information about the SXRD has comer to light.

Black level tests on a 60” SXRD came out at .006 foot lamberts when using pro mode and the advanced auto iris. The best plasma measured .023 ft lamberts.

If this is correct, it looks like blacks are good, and much better then the best Plasma’s.

Maybe not up to the best CRT based displays, but damn good none the less.

[shemijo]

Another little tit bit of information about the SXRD has comer to light.

Black level tests on a 60” SXRD came out at .006 foot lamberts when using pro mode and the advanced auto iris. The best plasma measured .023 ft lamberts.

If this is correct, it looks like blacks are good, and much better then the best Plasma’s.

Maybe not up to the best CRT based displays, but damn good none the less.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Owen

What on earth are you doing up at this time of night?! (I'm preparing for an early morning walk...)

My latest info on SXRD, for what it is worth, is that it should be here in Oz Q1 2006; may not be of the same design as the US model (ie the "dumbo ears", subject of much criticism among US buyers and not to my liking, may have gone) but that it could have an RRP around A$12K.

First two make me think about holding off on a possible 3LCD Grand Wega purchase but the latter puts it outside my budget!

All your comments mean that I look forward to seeing the beast when it does arrive (irrespective of my own purchasing decision over the coming weeks) and hearing of your technical and viewing appraisal then!

Shemijo

[pietro1503559499]

Not sure if they have been mentioned here but the Toshiba SED sounds interesting "More like CRT". But we could be waiting until 2007 to see them apparently.

[mizu]

SXRD blacks kick arse but CRTs better. (paraphrased)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So CRT blacks still the gold standard eh? I wonder if even the horizon technologies (OLED/SED/Flanders) will knock it off its pedestal.

may not be of the same design as the US model (ie the "dumbo ears", subject of much criticism among US buyers and not to my liking, may have gone) but that it could have an RRP around A$12K.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I may be the only one who likes the current cabinet/bezel. A$12K for (presumably) the 60"? I wonder how they'll justify it to the general public when the very competent 50" 8th-gen Pana plasmas are $5.5K now (and US SXRD street prices are about A$4-4.5K).

Unless ...*fingers crossed* ... they're slapping 1080p input on these ones!

[mizu]

I also thought one of the benefits of RPTV over wall-mountable technology is cost in the same size category. $12k is just a bit steep (compared to US price at todays exchange rates). I'd have to reconsider all options, given the barrage of upcoming competition.

[pietro1503559499]

Owen, regarding the monitors....I have a Sony 17" at present....if I got the G520 would I have to sit a lot further away? The screen is gi-normous.

[DavoNogo]

Owen, regarding the monitors....I have a Sony 17" at present....if I got the G520 would I have to sit a lot further away? The screen is gi-normous.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How close do you sit from your screen?

My 19" seems rather small to me, and I'm only 70cm away..

[pietro1503559499]

My eyes are about 70cm from the 17" screen. So I wonder how far from a 21" would be comfortable.

Something else that just occurred to me.....will the videocard have problems with a larger screen? I have an nVIDIA GeForce FX 5200

Sorry this is off the original thread.

[mizu]

My eyes are about 70cm from the 17" screen. So I wonder how far from a 21" would be comfortable.

Something else that just occurred to me.....will the videocard have problems with a larger screen? I have an nVIDIA GeForce FX 5200

Sorry this is off the original thread.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Off-topic, but I use a G520 frequently at work. If your eyesight is ok, t is fine at any distance you use the 17-19" screen at. Just set the res higher. You'll definately get used to it. Your video-card will relish the chance to unleash it's higher rezzes.

[DavoNogo]

Something else that just occurred to me.....will the videocard have problems with a larger screen? I have an nVIDIA GeForce FX 5200

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Regardless of who manufactured your card (ASUS, MSI, BFG), the supported resolutions would still be the same due to the same 400mhz RAMDACs..

The following site has a list of supported resolutions by this card.

http://www.bfgtech.com/5200_256.html

[pietro1503559499]

Thanks davonogo and mizu. I was thinking of using 1280x1024 which I see the Sony can do @ 123hz. Fantastic. I think I should go for it.

[Owen]

A$12K for (presumably) the 60"? I wonder how they'll justify it to the general public when the very competent 50" 8th-gen Pana plasmas are $5.5K now (and US SXRD street prices are about A$4-4.5K).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I doubt a 60’ SXRD will sell for 12K, maybe the 70” will.

Even so, how much do you think a 60” to 70” 1080p Plasma will cost?

I lot more then 12K that’s for sure.

We always pay to much here.

[DavoNogo]

http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000593056182/

65" 1080p Plasma = ¥1,000,000 = 11,658.19 AUD

Of course, you'll have to take into account the cost to import it, and if/when it's available here locally, the price will be much much more than that.

Either way, we both know the Qualia is in a completely different league... a much higher league

[mizu]

Even so, how much do you think a 60” to 70” 1080p Plasma will cost?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

*wince* ... I don't know, but the terms "arm" and "leg" come to mind.

Might have to get the Bravia instead unless 1080p input is added, at least on the VGA. LCD is small enough to move into the bedroom, and mountable without an industrial iron girder.

Also, it looks like the current US SXRDs still have a few little overscan/underscan issues with HDMI/DVI HTPC input. Maybe the new nVidia/ATI drivers will smooth this out to fill the screen perfectly, but still... no go on the 1:1 :/

I'm still holding out hope that someone will prove me wrong. Rumours abound that an aftermarket 1080p input mod may be available via a Sony certified tech, but sounds kinda complicated.

Speed-read avsforum :

SXRD-HTPC reports for HDMI/AVI:

----------------------------------------------------

user - GPU - setting - status - note

mevco - x800 pro - 1920x1080@60Hz(!) - success - some overscan (subsequent post - TV recognizes source as interlaced on OSD?)

jvrobert - 9700 pro - 1920x1080i/p - failure

Parthon - ?GPU - 1920x1080i - some overscan

gazelle - ?GPU - 1920x1080 - no comment

Uninvited Guest - 9700 mobility - 1920x1080i - Powerbook with OS 10.4.2 recognizing display as "Sony TV"

ABhatnagar - some success, didn't really explain

-------------------------------------------------

VGA capability as per approved resolutions on page 100 of the manual. Clearest at 1280x768 or 1360x768 with some underscan. 1600x1200 with heaps of overscan and no "Out of range" message.

[shemijo]

I doubt a 60’ SXRD will sell for 12K, maybe the 70” will.

Even so, how much do you think a 60” to 70” 1080p Plasma will cost?

I lot more then 12K that’s for sure.

We always pay to much here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Owen

Quite right - I "bumped" into the 60" Panasonic Plasma last week at a store here - $18K...

Shemijo

[Owen]

Thanks davonogo and mizu. I was thinking of using 1280x1024 which I see the Sony can do @ 123hz. Fantastic. I think I should go for it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

1280x1024 is very conservative for a 21”.

I recommend you try 1600x1200 with your desktop DPI set to 120 is stead of 96 and “Cleartype” ON

This will give you maximum screen real estate and readable fonts.

The whole idea of having a 21” is that you can run it at high res to get extra screen real estate.

Two pages of text can be displayed side by side for desktop publishing type work.

You will wounder how you ever got along without it.

[Owen]

Also, it looks like the current US SXRDs still have a few little overscan/underscan issues with HDMI/DVI HTPC input. Maybe the new nVidia/ATI drivers will smooth this out to fill the screen perfectly, but still... no go on the 1:1 :/

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Overscan on a TV is NORMAL and expected.

A custom resolution INSIDE a standard 1080i timing WILL solve the problem, as it does with other TV’s and should give 1:1.

The SXRD’s are much lighter then a Plasma of similar size.

I assume you are a gamer. Why else would 1080p input be so important to you?

I’d say there is virtually zero chance of a 1080p mod.

Unless the Oz version comes with 1080p input, that will be the end of it.

If 1080p input is important to you for some reason, you had better look at another option.

As long as the deinterlacer in the SXRD’s is top notch, I cant see much point in a 1080p input for watching video.

I would like 1080p input as well, just for the hell of it, but I can live without.

I’m using 1080i now and don’t have a problem with it.

He SXRD should not have any flicker issues with a 1080 Windows desktop.

[DavoNogo]

If I were to get the PS3, then I'd see 1080p input as important... The Xbox 360 can only go up to 1080i, so it's not as important...

PCs can do 1080p, which might be necessary because running a 1080i desktop is very painful on the eyes. The same logic for the 1600x1200 resolution on the 21" can be applied here... 1280x720p is just too small on a >60" display.. there's just no desktop space

[laurie]

As long as the deinterlacer in the SXRD’s is top notch, I cant see much point in a 1080p input for watching video.

Owen

What about HD-DVD & Blu-Ray!!

cheers laurie

[mizu]

Overscan on a TV is NORMAL and expected.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Arghh.. I thought this was only true of displays without fixed-res. :/ I guess it doesn't apply to RP then, because FPDs will snap the desktop edges right to the bezel for the right signal/input.

I assume you are a gamer. Why else would 1080p input be so important to you?

I’d say there is virtually zero chance of a 1080p mod.

Unless the Oz version comes with 1080p input, that will be the end of it.

If 1080p input is important to you for some reason, you had better look at another option.

As long as the deinterlacer in the SXRD’s is top notch, I cant see much point in a 1080p input for watching video.

I would like 1080p input as well, just for the hell of it, but I can live without.

I’m using 1080i now and don’t have a problem with it.

He SXRD should not have any flicker issues with a 1080 Windows desktop.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'd hesitate to buy a 1920x1080 native display if I could not input a full 1920x1080 picture without halving the frequency and doing some extra (otherwise unnecessary) loss-incuring processing, even if it's to a small degree. The thought of having an interlaced source on computer/appliance, deinterlacing it, reinterlacing it for output, then deinterlacing it again for display, seems less than ideal.

Not a major gamer (except tetris) but wouldn't mind if it was an option. Everything I buy I've been wary of upcoming standards and at times when I've succumbed to the lesser, have often ended up with a bottleneck on a system/appliance/component I rather like.

Gigabit ethernet came around a lot quicker than I imagined and I'm glad I paid a little bit extra on my computers/notebook. However, I thought AGP would stick around for a while longer, but it's quite hard to find non-PCIE now so as a result, I'm stuck with a 92xx radeon on a SFF system. I would like to upgrade to a next gen GPU, but that means a major system overhaul, and at the time I bought the rig, AGP wasn't exactly on its last legs.

HDMI output videocards are not that far away, neither are the next-gen consoles. If it's true that Vista forces HDCP output, then I wonder how long VGA will be around for. DVI blitzed 15pin input in a very short time for LCDs. Since 1080p inputs have appeared in other displays, I'm sure other manufacturers (eg. HP-rptv) will start including them too since it's clear thats what a lot of forum people want, and once that happens things'll snowball. For a purchase probably A$6-9k I would like to optimize my chances of extending its lifetime.

Also, if the 06 SXRDs include 1080p input, I wouldn't mind buying one even after buying a late 05 Australian Bravia (even if the cost difference with SXRD isn't great), since it could sit unobtrusively in the bedroom. I'd feel a little awkward pulling a trigger on another 50-60" SXRD a year after purchasing one. I'm sure for a lot of non-enthusiast potential buyers cost isn't as big an issue as the perception of value, and for an evolving enthusiast like myself, anticipation of an upgrade path is an additional factor.

A custom resolution INSIDE a standard 1080i timing WILL solve the problem, as it does with other TV’s and should give 1:1.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It should, and I hope the Australian one will. The reports of current users state that it's a little fiddly and the text is a bit blurry (suggestive of non-1:1), being clearer at scaled resolutions than resolutions closer to native. I've just gotta wait and see with my own eyes. If it's good enough then I would probably be quite happy to compromise other misgivings.

The SXRD’s are much lighter then a Plasma of similar size.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, so they are. However, I imagine the depth of a rear-pro mandates a stronger wall support due to the center of gravity. Now you've got me wondering what an SXRD would look like sticking out of the wall with a stylishly fashioned front stilt. Probably ridiculous, but it might balance out those dumbo ears

You're right about the SXRD possibly not being for me. I keep my options open however and without seeing one in person I don't yet know. I've fallen prey to the phenomena of "love at first sight" before and considering the "first sight" experiences of others (now current SXRD owners), this could possibly happen. Like all else in life, TV purchase can be done with the head or it can be done with the heart (eyes), and a superlative PQ can do wonders to overcome pragmatism.

[mizu]

PCs can do 1080p, which might be necessary because running a 1080i desktop is very painful on the eyes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I believe that's why the flickerless quality of SXRDs is emphasized.

Agree with you on 1080p appliances around the corner. They'll come in swarms. SWARMS!

... and one day, they might even slowly trickle into Australia.

... for 2x the overseas cost.