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Smurf bat = an inflatable harmless device to hit someone over the head with whose mind is already made up. :blink:

DA

:P

Hey DA i made up my mind after playing with one for some time and found i personally dont like them for everyday use and the other reasons listed above.

I didnt go in close minded as i wanted it to be the be all and end all solution

And what post were you refering to?

And lost what?

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:blink:

Hey DA i made up my mind after playing with one for some time and found i personally dont like them for everyday use and the other reasons listed above.

I didnt go in close minded as i wanted it to be the be all and end all solution

And what post were you refering to?

And lost what?

This is a collection of meaningless words to me at least - heck you know my bias already! :P

http://www.dtvforum.info/index.php?showtop...ndpost&p=248508

Yea we've come a l-o-n-g way and the gap is closing -------------- the next gen. cards being released by nVidia and ATI are gonna make any scaler no matter how good they are - look primitive by comparison. And when I want Blu Ray movies to play back in a player at reasonable cost - well I know where it's gonna go into. It will beat anything, some 'snoobish thin air home theatre fluff filled' reseller/salesperson marketing peddler @ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

DA

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Glen, in what form are the Algolith filters, Direct show?

What is preventing you testing them?

Is it just a lack of CPU power?

What we have come across is lack of CPU power due to slight stutter on play back with CPU resorces maxing at 100% and have tried setting swapfile size to as muc as 2gb

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This is a collection of meaningless words to me at least - heck you know my bias already!  :blink:

http://www.dtvforum.info/index.php?showtop...ndpost&p=248508

Yea we've come a l-o-n-g way and the gap is closing -------------- the next gen. cards being released by nVidia and ATI are gonna make any scaler no matter how good they are - look primitive by comparison. And when I want Blu Ray movies to play back in a player at reasonable cost - well I know where it's gonna go into. It will beat anything, some 'snoobish thin air home theatre fluff filled' reseller/salesperson marketing peddler @ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

DA

You might be right DA but up until now they have not cut for me

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I persisted with a HTPC for a while, but my wife insisted that I buy some dedicated HT equipment for her ease of use. The HTPC will always be a tool for those who like to tinker to the nth degree, but for everyday use, simplicity wins out in my household.

I like to use the game consoles as a good example, you can buy a PS2 or xbox and just slip the games into the drive and they will run flawlessly. Now with PC gaming... grab the latest game, take it home and you realise that you now need a new video card, a bit more memory and a little more CPU grunt while you're at it, then there's the perpetual software and driver upgrades. It's a never-ending cycle of upgrades.

Dedicated devices have their purpose, YES they will be more expensive initially than the equivalent functionality on a PC, but long term they will provide the uncluttered simplicity that makes them easier to live with.

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Hey Foghorn

I persisted with a HTPC for a while,

Interesting.

but my wife insisted that I buy some dedicated HT equipment for her ease of use.

If you could give wife a good respite holiday time away with savings comparisons with a little effort in in remote good sound keyboard/mouse operation then the argument is done deal in the other direction.

Have you really looked lately - try this site..................

http://www.tomshardware.com/consumer/20050...eyboard-02.html

This thing GLOWs in the dark - and if someone can't work one of them - even some remotes would be much harder then I'd suggest your wife was NOT exposed to the right equipment. Cheap shortcuts in HTPC hardware but there there's this fallacy that $2,000 spent on some crazy upscaler / remote / DVD player is okay.

Show wives/girlfriend the correct hardware and not the el-cheapo HTPC solution is they'll be convinced - but then it is easy to attach $1000+ to a new COMPLETE device being enticed by a fast talking salesperson. Conceptually the female gender like things complete in front of them - the moment they see things in bits and pieces they panic - perhaps reminding them of the brother who disassembled a doll's house and could not put it back together.

Keep it in the garage or the garden shed and don't bring it out until you're tested, tested and tested.

The HTPC will always be a tool for those who like to tinker to the nth degree, but for everyday use, simplicity wins out in my household.

I DON'T tinker, I watch DIGITAL TV and very nice DVD's upscaled to perfection DAILY. ie My wife turns it on and uses a remote.

I like to use the game consoles as a good example, you can buy a PS2 or xbox and just slip the games into the drive and they will run flawlessly.

Dumb it down with game consoles. I detest the things and see them foreign to the lounge room - maybe in the family room with decent sized LCD but not in the home theatre room as a permanent fixture. Too trashy. There for 'kids'.

A better concept is to have a multi-purpose hobby/home office room casually fitted out (Ikea stuff) with at least a 81cm widescreen LCd and decent sound system and let them go for it with time outs on games/mutlimedia/special DVD watching/internet etc etc.

Now with PC gaming... grab the latest game, take it home and you realise that you now need a new video card, a bit more memory and a little more CPU grunt while you're at it, then there's the perpetual software and driver upgrades. It's a never-ending cycle of upgrades.

I'm not into gaming - just digital TV and DVD movies at best quality possible. It's that simple.

Talk about upgrades - its a fallacy that home theatre guys don't end up spending a fortune just to get 'smoke and mirror' quality from plain ordinary DVD's.

Software upgrading is one of the most cost effective things out there. It will stop you in your tracks to impluse buy the latest gadget making wild claims on quality hikes.

Dedicated devices have their purpose, YES they will be more expensive initially than the equivalent functionality on a PC, but long term they will provide the uncluttered simplicity that makes them easier to live with.

For $2000 you can have your blu ray device - for $799 I can have my blu ray device and go with latest then I take that $1,200 saving and transfer it into a BETTER holiday away.

DA

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DA, I'm reluctant to hijack this Panasonic plasma thread too much further, but I will say that I agree there is a price premium on dedicated equipment, and it may not be as flexible or powerful as a PC, but simplicity is the key.

Your wife may be an exception, but I can tell you that mine and many others will not even consider allowing a keyboard and PC into the living room, nor do they want to wait for a PC to boot up, nor do they want to have the setup constantly changing because I've added or upgraded software which they just don't understand.

I acknowledge that it's possible to make a HTPC perform just like a "dumb" piece of dedicated equipment, but there is an effort required to get this to happen, and then to maintain it.

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I am considering a 60” plus Plasma as a fall back option in case the Sony 62” and 70” SXRD displays are not as good as I require.

I have no interest in a 50” display, so is there any word on the availability and quality of a 60” or larger Panasonic?

All scaling and processing will be done externally, so the quality of the internal scaler-processor is not relevant to me.

Black levels are VERY important to me, and I therefor find almost all Plasma’s completely unacceptable.

The Pana-Fuji 50” are the only Plasma’s I have seen with passable blacks, but I have yet to see one in a dark environment so I may yet be disappointed

I had a look at a Pioneer 61” yesterday, and I don’t think I could put up with it, although I did not get to play with the settings so I will reserve judgment.

Everyone on this forum seems preoccupied with 42” and 50” models, with virtually zero discussion of 60” plus models.

So, does anyone have the lowdown on the best 60” plus Plasma?

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DA,

BluRay and HDDVD could well be a BIG problem for HTPC’s, as there is no way that Hollywood or Sony will ever allow unencrypted HD video loose on a PC data bus, as is the case with DVD’s.

Any replay system will be strictly hardware based (drive and video card) to ensure copy protection and at pricing that could be well above a stand alone player.

Since everything will be done in hardware, there will be no way to us any video processing tools.

It may well be that the only way to get HD from BluRay-HDDVD into a PC for processing will be to use an external player, a device to remove HDCP and a DVI-HDMI input card on the PC.

That little lot will be anything but cheap.

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After sitting in front of a pc all day at work, I couldn't think of anything worse than having to fiddle with XP whilst trying to convince myself this is enjoyable and relaxing.

Fiddle??? You set it up and forget the details and are rewarded by outstanding quality in DTV, sound and DVD stuff.

Make one and use the savings if your a VideoPhile on a good holiday.

DA

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I persisted with a HTPC for a while, but my wife insisted that I buy some dedicated HT equipment for her ease of use. The HTPC will always be a tool for those who like to tinker to the nth degree, but for everyday use, simplicity wins out in my household.

I like to use the game consoles as a good example, you can buy a PS2 or xbox and just slip the games into the drive and they will run flawlessly. Now with PC gaming... grab the latest game, take it home and you realise that you now need a new video card, a bit more memory and a little more CPU grunt while you're at it, then there's the perpetual software and driver upgrades. It's a never-ending cycle of upgrades.

Dedicated devices have their purpose, YES they will be more expensive initially than the equivalent functionality on a PC, but long term they will provide the uncluttered simplicity that makes them easier to live with.

I'd have to agree foggy, my wifes a software engineer and I'm an engineer both reasonably computer literate and can tell you we played with the HTPC thing too but much prefer dedicated devices now not just for useability but quality(SQ & PQ) as well.

given the quality and useability possible with dedicated devices honestly not sure why you'd bother with a HTPC these days.

anyways wasn't this thread about the new panasonic plasmas.......

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I am considering a 60” plus Plasma as a fall back option in case the Sony 62” and 70” SXRD displays are not as good as I require.

I have no interest in a 50” display, so is there any word on the availability and quality of a 60” or larger Panasonic?

All scaling and processing will be done externally, so the quality of the internal scaler-processor is not relevant to me.

Black levels are VERY important to me, and I therefor find almost all Plasma’s completely unacceptable.

The Pana-Fuji 50” are the only Plasma’s I have seen with passable blacks, but I have yet to see one in a dark environment so I may yet be disappointed

I had a look at a Pioneer 61” yesterday, and I don’t think I could put up with it, although I did not get to play with the settings so I will reserve judgment.

Everyone on this forum seems preoccupied with 42” and 50” models, with virtually zero discussion of 60” plus models.

So, does anyone have the lowdown on the best 60” plus Plasma?

Owen,

I read recently that Pioneer, Panasonic, Hitachi and several Korean manufacturers are hoping to release 1080P plasmas by the end of the year. They will probably all be 60"+ panels The fact that so many manufacturers are involved will hopefully keep the prices to a reasonable level. Panasonic are also releasing a 65" 768P panel in their upcoming range of G8 panels.

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well my wifes a software engineer and I'm an engineer both reasonably computer literate and can tell you we played with the HTPC thing too but much prefer dedicated devices now not just for useability but quality(SQ & PQ) as well.

given the quality and useability possible with dedicated devices honestly not sure why you'd bother with a HTPC these days.

anyways wasn't this thread about the new panasonic plasmas.......

Given this thread is about the Pana, I should exit.

Every device has its merits - your post does not IMHO express the rewards in using such devices (media centric pcs). You are also inaccurate in the statements and claims you've made.

I too am a software enginner in the area of database large scale centricity - but that's horses for courses.

A sleek powerful attractive media pc is in the reach of everyone now. It's not difficult.

Exit stage right and leave it to Pana enthusiasts here. :blink:

DA

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Given this thread is about the Pana, I should exit.

Every device has its merits - your post does not IMHO express the rewards in using such devices (media centric pcs). You are also inaccurate in the statements and claims you've made.

I too am a software enginner in the area of database large scale centricity - but that's horses for courses.

A sleek powerful attractive media pc is in the reach of everyone now. It's not difficult.

Exit stage right and leave it to Pana enthusiasts here. :blink:

DA

Just my opinion DA and we did give HTPC a pretty good go. Not for us.

and yes we should try and get this back to the pana discussion

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DA,

BluRay and HDDVD could well be a BIG problem for HTPC’s, as there is no way that Hollywood or Sony will ever allow unencrypted HD video loose on a PC data bus, as is the case with DVD’s.

Any replay system will be strictly hardware based (drive and video card) to ensure copy protection and at pricing that could be well above a stand alone player.

Since everything will be done in hardware, there will be no way to us any video processing tools.

It may well be that the only way to get HD from BluRay-HDDVD into a PC for processing will be to use an external player, a device to remove HDCP and a DVI-HDMI input card on the PC.

That little lot will be anything but cheap.

The facts on Blu Ray on the Interent are contary to the above opinion.

There were problems in the early days for MPEG 2 (1995) decoding without hardware.

MS LongHorn will incorporate HD DVD capability.

Dual CPU Processing are biting at one end along with dual processor GPU card from both ATI and nVidia. Spectacular claims and counter claim in MPEG, H.264 processing quality gains are in the pipeline and we catch glimpses of this from the Internet.

DA

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I am considering a 60” plus Plasma as a fall back option in case the Sony 62” and 70” SXRD displays are not as good as I require.

I have no interest in a 50” display, so is there any word on the availability and quality of a 60” or larger Panasonic?

All scaling and processing will be done externally, so the quality of the internal scaler-processor is not relevant to me.

Black levels are VERY important to me, and I therefor find almost all Plasma’s completely unacceptable.

The Pana-Fuji 50” are the only Plasma’s I have seen with passable blacks, but I have yet to see one in a dark environment so I may yet be disappointed

I had a look at a Pioneer 61” yesterday, and I don’t think I could put up with it, although I did not get to play with the settings so I will reserve judgment.

Everyone on this forum seems preoccupied with 42” and 50” models, with virtually zero discussion of 60” plus models.

So, does anyone have the lowdown on the best 60” plus Plasma?

I have seen both the Fujitsu and Panasonic and they are great units for the size but personally would be waiting until 1080P panels are available

The reason i suggest this is that the resolution on the larger units does not appeal to me being so large with the same res as the 50"

You might be in for a great wait until the 60"+ at a1080P resolution comes down to acceptable pricing

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The facts on Blu Ray on the Interent are contary to the above opinion.

There were problems in the early days for MPEG 2 (1995) decoding without hardware.

MS LongHorn will incorporate HD DVD capability.

Dual CPU Processing are biting at one end along with dual processor GPU card from both ATI and nVidia. Spectacular claims and counter claim in MPEG, H.264 processing quality gains are in the pipeline and we catch glimpses of this from the Internet.

DA

And i've also read an article claiming that Longhorn will require a HDMI connection to you monitor in order to maintain HDCP compliance. That would be in synergy with the approach of bluray and HD DVD with maintaining HDCP at all times.

If that's the case, it's going to be a while before i get longhorn, whenever it's released.

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The facts on Blu Ray on the Interent are contary to the above opinion.

There were problems in the early days for MPEG 2 (1995) decoding without hardware.

MS LongHorn will incorporate HD DVD capability.

Dual CPU Processing are biting at one end along with dual processor GPU card from both ATI and nVidia. Spectacular claims and counter claim in MPEG, H.264 processing quality gains are in the pipeline and we catch glimpses of this from the Internet.

DA

I think you missed my point DA,

BluRay-HDDVD playback may well be supported in Longhorn, but via special hardware ONLY.

No software solution will be permitted, as it is too easy to crack.

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I have seen both the Fujitsu and Panasonic and they are great units for the size but personally would be waiting until 1080P panels are available

The reason i suggest this is that the resolution on the larger units does not appeal to me being so large with the same res as the 50"

You might be in for a great wait until the 60"+ at  a1080P resolution comes down to acceptable pricing

Yep, that is my opinion as well Glen.

As for pricing, well if they get under $20K I will be interested.

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Yep, that is my opinion as well Glen.

As for pricing, well if they get under $20K I will be interested.

I would say its all a matter of time before the 1080p units come down BUT it will happen.

I will say tho the Fuji and Pana's did look pretty damn good for thoses sizes but if you are spending that sort of money wait

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