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waveformkid

AFL HD this Saturday night (Swans vs Collingwood)

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I'm watching it on a 50-inch 1366 x 768 panel and it looks great! Obviously there are some MPEG blocking artifacts during fast movement, but that is to be expected. You would need a much higher bitrate, like 17 MB/s or greater to really minimize that. No matter how you slice it, it looks a million times better than an AFL match in SD.

BTW... has anyone noticed how woeful the SD service on TEN is at the moment? It looks heaps worse than SD AFL games normally look. Not sure whether it's something to do with the way they are downsampling the HD output to produce the SD service, or some other issue, but it looks very noticeably worse than SD normally looks on TEN for an AFL match. Not that I care! I am only flicking over to SD to compare from time to time.

The overlay graphics are still in SD, but that is to be expected. It's not as if they are going to redesign them all for a one-off match.

Well done to TEN and NBN for pulling this off. If only every AFL game could be produced like this! Truly awesome.

Adam

Zero blocking with AUSID.

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It's good that you find the picture to be good aspro, but I do find it hard to believe there is absolutely no blocking even during fast movement - the bitrate is only ~13.8Mbps.

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No offence, but if someone thinks there's zero blocking, then it just means that the equipment they are watching on is not sufficiently high enough quality / large enough screen size to make the distinction, or, that they are not used to identifying these artifacts.

There is _definitely_ blocking in this broadcast. But in saying that, it is really awesome, and in no way is this a criticism. Of course there's going to be MPEG blocking on a high-action sports broadcast in MPEG2 at 1080i at ~13.8 Mb/s.

As I already said earlier, it looks so much better than an AFL SD broadcast, that there really is no comparison. The MPEG blocking on an SD broadcast is far worse, either that - or they filter the hell out of it to avoid blocking. In either case, it has nothing on this special TEN broadcast. The resolution is amazing. Even during fast movement, you can track things so much better than with an SD AFL match.

Adam

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that why i said i was running an analog widescreen display so i know my equipment aint that crash hot but can see it :blink: :ph34r:

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SD ten is bad all time sometimes neighbours is shocking on sd ten, seven sd is good quality.

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I still hate Football but this looks great. So much more detail than what you would normally get during an AFL match. One question - did it have the HD logo at the start on the SD channel to tell the viewers it was available?

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Hopefully this doesn't mean Ten will start watermarking other HD programmes....

And there is definitely blocking...

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There was no "available in high def" HD logo at the start of the broadcast.

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I'm watching it on a Fujitsu 42HHA40US using the AUSID HD STB and if you ask anybody else using the same they'd tell you the same. THERE IS NO BLOCKING. If you'd read the HD STB forum you'd have dscovered this.

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*Pats aspro on the head* Thats nice dear....

What a wonderfull imagination you have!

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I checked out the SD service on another TV here -- just an analogue 76cm widescreen -- and the SD service definitely looks worse than normal even on that. You can see the "sea of grass" swimming, due to the pre-encoding filtering. Normally this is not as noticeable on TEN SD, because they have the best SD bitrate in the country at ~7 Mb/s. (For a moment I was wondering whether I was dreaming about the SD service being worse than usual, since I pretty much always watch all SD content on 12, upconverted by TEN to HD).

But yeah, the SD definitely is worse than normal. So I am assuming that TEN have temporarily taken the SD bitrate down by a bit, as well as remove the VPG, in order to maximise the HD bitrate. I captured a bit of the SD stream as well, so afterwards I'll see what the SD bitrate was in order to confirm this theory.

Even Southern Cross 10's SD service looks slightly clearer than TEN's at the moment. Normally TEN looks noticeably better than SC10. (I have the advantage of comparing both, here on the Gold Coast).

Adam

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I'd just like to add my positive comments to the HD AFL as well.

It looks fantastic. Watching in 1080i on Sony KVHR36 and DG-TEC 5000i.

Bring on more!

Craig.

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I'm watching it on a Fujitsu 42HHA40US using the AUSID HD STB and if you ask anybody else using the same they'd tell you the same.  THERE IS NO BLOCKING.  If you'd read the HD STB forum you'd have dscovered this.

Glad you're happy aspro! Did you ever consider that blocking has nothing to do with your STB? It is a result of MPEG encoding at insufficient bitrates. This happens at the broadcast-end. There is nothing that your STB can do to undo it. The effect will be masked, however, by factors such as using lower quality equipment, a smaller screen, composite interconnect instead of something better, etc. The reason these things can mask the blocking is because they reduce the quality of the image 100% of the time, instead of just while blocking is occuring! No one doubts that you are happy with your setup. That's great! Enjoy it :blink:

Adam

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SD ten is bad all time sometimes neighbours is shocking on sd ten, seven sd is good quality.

i would agree if i watched Ten SD, but since everything is at least up-converted on Ten HD, i only watch that...

but an interesting note on neighbours, do you notice the "preview" for the next epsiode at the end of each eipsode is of a MUCH lower quality?

take a look at this example:

Ten HD - http://img241.echo.cx/img241/7748/hd6nh.jpg

Preview for next ep - http://img241.echo.cx/img241/2/preview9gz.jpg

Ten HD - http://img241.echo.cx/img241/5669/hd1cp.jpg

Preview for next ep - http://img241.echo.cx/img241/1953/preview5ic.jpg

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Acutally no I havent noticed but Neighbours REALLY needs to get with the program, its just a horrible show to watch PQ wise everythings brown - so flat and analouge like.... And filtered so heavily to avoid all those composite nastys... OT!

Still Kudos to TEN for HD sport well done!

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Well done TEN and NBN. That was truly awesome! I think I'll be disappointed when I watch the next AFL game now.

It would be awesome to have the entire TEN AFL finals series in HD and this is not completely unfeasible since finals games are always played separately. Though I guess it would be a bit hard driving the NBN van (and HD cameras) to Perth between a Saturday afternoon and evening :blink: Seriously though, at least if most of the games were in HD, that would be a great start to professional sport in Australia being broadcast in high definition. TEN could really market it well, being the network that exclusively has all AFL finals including the Grand Final. There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that the difference HD makes is very well worth it and makes following and enjoying the game so much better!

Regards,

Adam

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I agree, the difference is amazing and I manage to sit through a lot of HD programs even if I dont find them that interesting!

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I manage to sit through a lot of HD programs even if I dont find them that interesting!

Same.. Amazing isnt it how we can sit and watch something that we have no real interest in just because the quality is good *shakes head*..man what a crazy world we live in!

Imagine if something came on in HD at full bit rate that we were actually interested in! :blink:

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I'm watching it on a Fujitsu 42HHA40US using the AUSID HD STB and if you ask anybody else using the same they'd tell you the same.  THERE IS NO BLOCKING.  If you'd read the HD STB forum you'd have dscovered this.

Here are some high motion field caps showing otherwise:

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/2210/cap12be.jpg

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/5527/cap20sn.jpg

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/9153/cap36bq.jpg

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/6642/cap45eb.jpg

Of course it can also look quite good as shown here:

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/3347/cap57jy.jpg

Though as the grass gets further away, MPEG blocking also starts showing up.

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Congratulations Channel 10. Sport and High Definition were made for each other. The wide angled shots were amazingly clear - i could almost make out the expressions on the players faces in shots where normally i'd just see a fuzzy blob that looked like a head! Hope Channel 9 get their act together and show some NRL in HD.

So how do they record these broadcasts? In 1080p? Would be good for future High Definition Video Disc releases! :blink:

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Neighbours PQ is worese the studio need to get better cameras i think.

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Here are some high motion field caps showing otherwise:

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/2210/cap12be.jpg

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/5527/cap20sn.jpg

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/9153/cap36bq.jpg

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/6642/cap45eb.jpg

Of course it can also look quite good as shown here:

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/3347/cap57jy.jpg

Though as the grass gets further away, MPEG blocking also starts showing up.

II guess the Fujitsu's AVM2 chip helps becase the motion blurr yu show in those captures doesn't occur on mine. Nor do i see any blocking.

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But yeah, the SD definitely is worse than normal. So I am assuming that TEN have temporarily taken the SD bitrate down by a bit, as well as remove the VPG, in order to maximise the HD bitrate. I captured a bit of the SD stream as well, so afterwards I'll see what the SD bitrate was in order to confirm this theory.

The SD bitrate was unchanged.

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