AV Pre/Pro as your HIFI pre and/or dac ???

[ENIGMA]

When it comes to movies and music DVD's, Drizt, it is superb. Having independent monoblock amplifiers sets a solid base for the performance - seperate power supplies.

I am only running 50w per channel into 91db efficent JMlab electra speakers, the system intergrates well and sounds like it is over 100w pc.

It is great for music too, very nice performing amp. However, the Copland is miles ahead of the Sony.

[Guest JohnA]

you have an AVR do you not drizt?

[Drizt]

yeap, currently a pretty ordinary one that does all sorts of funky things that I don't want it to do (even in direct mode it digitises the analogue inputs etc.). Its a denon 1906. I've compared it to the stello a couple of times and once volume levels have been matched as good as possible the differences are still pretty apparent (noise floor is higher, flatter sound, smaller soundstage and the soundstage seems to collapse during more complex pieces). The denon 1906 is not a very good unit, so I'd want to compare better units before coming to any sort of meaningful conclusions.

[Guest JohnA]

hate to ask, but i know you won't mind

did you do a dbt?

[Drizt]

hate to ask, but i know you won't mind

did you do a dbt?

I did actually with the helping hand of my lovely wife. The noise floor made it pretty pointless though. Its hard not to notice the change in noise floor. I couldn't get past the noise, just drove me to distraction.

[Guest JohnA]

i would think the noise floor regardless of anything else is reason enough to not use it.

My take on it Drizt.

The higher up you move in the avr range, the better they will perform in 2 channel mode

Question is though, will they outperform a similar price high end pre-amp, or a very well designed cheaper pre-amp.

If it were me, i would concentrate my money on a very good 2 channel pre, as video and 5.1 is of very little importance to me.

I would continue using your stello, and if you feel you want or need to upgrade your avr, do so with something newer and current spec.

You can then run the test again

Also if you like:

If you can borrow a good quality avr or HT-pre pro, i am happy to bring the moon pre over so we can compare

[Drizt]

I guess we differ a bit though in that I have place equal importance on HT and HIFI. Jen and I get lots of use out of the HT setup, its probably about a 60/40 split HT/HIFI for us.

Thanks for the offer John, ill have to weigh it all up and do what I think is right for our situation.

Norpus using the AV Pre/Pro gives me a lot of confidence in the idea. Also hearing the HT setup at Harry's gives me very high hopes.

[Guest JohnA]

i know minty also said his Denon (same as Norpus) performed very well in the 2 channel stakes, but was not as good as his moon pre

you do realise how much that denon costs don't you?

[Jake]

I have place equal importance on HT and HIFI.

Its very easy to have both. All that is required is a HT bypass on your preamp. Cant recall you saying you've investigated that option Drizt (apologies if I missed it).

Cheers,

Jake

[rippingdragon]

Aaron,

Are you looking at getting the Integra DHC 9.9?

An easy way to solve the dilemna would be to get Stuart to arrange a demo. Then you can blind test between the Integra as a 2 channel DAC and Pre and your Stello to to your hearts content. If the performance is equal and you can justify the expense just for HT alone, then the choice is pretty simple. If the Integra beats the Stello then the choice is even easier.

If the cost is worth the HT enjoyment you will get from the unit, then you can always think about adding in a high end dedicated 2 channel pre and/or DAC later as an audio upgrade path.

[Drizt]

Aaron,

Are you looking at getting the Integra DHC 9.9?

An easy way to solve the dilemna would be to get Stuart to arrange a demo. Then you can blind test between the Integra as a 2 channel DAC and Pre and your Stello to to your hearts content. If the performance is equal and you can justify the expense just for HT alone, then the choice is pretty simple. If the Integra beats the Stello then the choice is even easier.

If the cost is worth the HT enjoyment you will get from the unit, then you can always think about adding in a high end dedicated 2 channel pre and/or DAC later as an audio upgrade path.

Bingo on all fronts

Thats been my exact line of thinking regarding the issue.

I was just wanting to see how many others are on this route or planning to take this route.

[Drizt]

i know minty also said his Denon (same as Norpus) performed very well in the 2 channel stakes, but was not as good as his moon pre

you do realise how much that denon costs don't you?

Yeap, that thing is uber expensive.

Its very easy to have both. All that is required is a HT bypass on your preamp. Cant recall you saying you've investigated that option Drizt (apologies if I missed it).

Cheers,

Jake

Yeah I would never by any 2ch gear that didn't incorporate the ht bypass feature. I think its essential myself.

[ENIGMA]

Or you can do what i did,

Get a dedicated processor for multichannel and a dedicated pre for stereo and link the whole thing up together.

Have Stuart provide two inputs into your speaker's amps, that way you can switch between the two on the fly.

[Drizt]

Or you can do what i did,

Get a dedicated processor for multichannel and a dedicated pre for stereo and link the whole thing up together.

Have Stuart provide two inputs into your speaker's amps, that way you can switch between the two on the fly.

Thats exactly what the HT Bypass does on 2ch HIFI pre. And why I think its an essential feature.

[Guest JohnA]

but i think what enigma is saying is:

by getting sgr to give you 2 sets of ins on the amps, you can just flicj a switch and not have to worry about a 2 channel pre with HT bypass.

Will give you a huge variety to pick from

I am having this done with the subs

input 1: rca, bypassing inpuilt x-over for HT use (use HT pre-pro x-over)

input 2: xlr using internal x-over for 2 channel duties (for when the need arises playing 5 Hz tones)

[ENIGMA]

That's basically it, the two fronts switch between HT & HIFI sources, the centre & rears are permanently hooked up to your HT.

Stuart could easily set up two RCA inputs and perhaps also set up a 12v trigger switch so that the two fronts automatically select HT input when the HT amp is switched on. (from the 12v trigger on the ht amp perhaps)

just a thought.

[Jake]

Drizt, you may find some interest in my little mud map.

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/showthread.php?t=14661

Cheers,

Jake

[Drizt]

Drizt, you may find some interest in my little mud map.

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/showthread.php?t=14661

Cheers,

Jake

wow, excellent diagram mate.

I recon you should try out some active biamping (maybe some EQ in the mix) with those speakers mate. I'd love to read your opinions regarding passive vs. active bi/tri amping.

[Jake]

wow, excellent diagram mate.

I recon you should try out some active biamping (maybe some EQ in the mix) with those speakers mate. I'd love to read your opinions regarding passive vs. active bi/tri amping.

The more I think about it and the more I listen to my system, the more I realise that active is inevitable for me. Just not this year.

[Sentient]

That's basically it, the two fronts switch between HT & HIFI sources, the centre & rears are permanently hooked up to your HT.

Stuart could easily set up two RCA inputs and perhaps also set up a 12v trigger switch so that the two fronts automatically select HT input when the HT amp is switched on. (from the 12v trigger on the ht amp perhaps)

The SGR plate amps already offer 2 inputs, but are even more functional than you'd expect (ie: a trigger isnt required at all).

The SGR plateamps have a RCA input and an XLR input. Both inputs can be fed simultaneously, the inputs are summed and amplified.

This means both can be on, or either can be on, and it will all work without any manual switching in any way.

I'm using my SGR plateamps this way. My Receiver is connected to the XLR inputs (via rca->xlr cables), and my 2ch pre is connected to the RCA inputs. I dont need HT bypass on the pre at all. Using the plateamps like this opens up ALL the options in the 2ch space, I dont have to restrict myself to insisting on having the HT-bypass feature on my 2ch pre.

Very cool, ya gotta love SGR's electronics !!

Edited June 10, 2009 by ozmillsy

[Drizt]

The more I think about it and the more I listen to my system, the more I realise that active is inevitable for me. Just not this year.

Fair enough mate. I look forward to reading your reviews in the future once you have gone down that path.

[Drizt]

The SGR plate amps already offer 2 inputs, but are even more functional than you'd expect (ie: a trigger isnt required at all).

The SGR plateamps have a RCA input and an XLR input. Both inputs can be fed simultaneously, the inputs are summed and amplified.

This means both can be on, or either can be on. And it will all work, without any manual switching in any way.

I'm using my SGR plateamps this way. My Receiver is connected to the XLR inputs, and my 2ch pre is connected to the RCA inputs. I dont need HT bypass on the pre at all. Using the plateamps this way, opens up ALL the options in the 2ch space, I dont have to restrict myself to insisting on having HT bypass on my pre. Very cool, ya gotta love SGR's electronics !!

Too true.

Still I hold it against companies that won't put a SIMPLE ht bypass on their pre's. I don't buy the purist opinion that a ht bypass negatively impacts the performance of the pre. Thats a cop out plain and simple. A competently engineered pre would not be sonically affected by the addition of ht bypass.

[ENIGMA]

Musical Fidelity have a power amp with two inputs and two buttons on the front panel to switch betewwn the two. From memory, the second button is labled HT, i think.

With the RCA & Balanced input on the SGR plate amp, if you have a signal in both at the same time, does it mean you hear both signals from the speaker playing?

I like the idea of the amp switching to HT automatically when the HT is on.

[Sentient]

With the RCA & Balanced input on the SGR plate amp, if you have a signal in both at the same time, does it mean you hear both signals from the speaker playing?

Yes, it sums both inputs.

I've done it, at low levels, and I can hear both at once. Not that you want this as a feature. What it means is, I really dont have to worry. I use 1 or the other, and dont have to do any switching. Too easy.

[Sentient]

Still I hold it against companies that won't put a SIMPLE ht bypass on their pre's. I don't buy the purist opinion that a ht bypass negatively impacts the performance of the pre. Thats a cop out plain and simple. A competently engineered pre would not be sonically affected by the addition of ht bypass.

I hear you, but in practical terms, you and I dont have to worry about it, so why care?

All that matters, is finding the best solution for the system, whether it has bypass or not.

In my case, it allows me to run an older (very reputable) 2ch pre, which I got at a reasonable price 2nd hand. I contemplated mod'ing it for bypass, but I dont need to go to that expense, it's a moot point.

Back on topic. I'd love to try the 9.9, and am interested to hear your experience with it, if you have the opportunity to try it on your system. My wife and I also watch more HT together (similar ratio). I tend to listen to music on my own, as our music tastes are very different for the most part.