Jump to content

Palsonic 76WSHD


Recommended Posts

Hi to all

I don't think that the horizontal lines have to do anything with the antenna.

It is more likely that has to do something with the refresh rate at some resolutions,at AA-HD1 stb settings.

OR it could be a hardware incompatibility between Pana-Dgetc (they are similar) and the TV .(refresh and drawing frequency out of sync) at AA-HD1 settings.

Anybody with Toshiba or Thomson DTI1500AU stb have the lines??

But what really puzzle me is that the lines are not so visible when (something) warms up? or gets in better sync?…. And also I can’t see any lines at all at some programs ,specially on movies

(depends on the source, resolutions ???)

marmaxwell

I have the Pana and I have no problems with it.PQ is good. Both Pana-Dgtec have vga output. According to others, Pana have better customers

Service than Dgtec .Have a look at the related forum

Link to comment
Share on other sites



  • Replies 548
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

I'm close to buying a 76WSHD, but I have a silly question first.

I've looked at this thread and read the Manual off the Website, but I can't find out if you use the XGA connection is it 16:9

I would like to use a PC, I've built with the DTV Card in it and wanted to use something better than the S-Video Connection on the Board.

Mr_Gurps

:blink:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello everyone,

Had a look at this tv in Hardly Normal today and was quite impressed. While obviously not at the level of the latest Sony, neither was the price!

The 9 HD loop looked quite good, clearly superior to the SD images on assorted Lg's, Phillips, etc. Managed to convince the salesman to switch the box feeding the Palsonic to an SD source, pictures not so good.

Of course there was no remote on hand, so was not able to make any adjustments. SD pictures seemed to be a little soft, lacking in contrast, and slightly blue. Salesman showed no interest in finding remote.

As tv was (i) located nowhere near the other widescreens in the store, and (ii) switched off, figured that salesman was not particularly interested in pushing the Palsonic. But he did claim that it was assembled in Australia!

Sorry about the long winded message. Has anyone seen a well set-up SD comparison between the Palsonic and other widescreens?

Thanks.

wazzak

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anybody with Toshiba or Thomson DTI1500AU stb have the lines??

When I originally bought this TV I had the the Toshiba STB and the lines were still there. I swapped the Toshiba for the Pana STB to do away with the resolution switching problem.

You are right - the lines seem to go away after the TV has sufficently warmed up. I am pretty sure this is a problem with the TV itself. Not the antenna as some people have suggested.

I say this because my aerial is split to two displays - the STB and a DTV card in a PC. I see no lines with the DTV card.

Link to comment
Share on other sites



I've looked at this thread and read the Manual off the Website, but I can't find out if you use the XGA connection is it 16:9

I would like to use a PC, I've built with the DTV Card in it and wanted to use something better than the S-Video Connection on the Board.

Mr_Gurps

:blink:

Mr Gurps, XGA connection is widescreen yes.

However, all I've ever connected is an HD STB.

Check the back of the manual. It lists the various resolutions and spells out what is 16:9 and which are 4:3 as well as those taht work in both. If your PC outputs a specific resolution it will display as specified here (I think).

You can probably change the output resolution from your PC in any event.

Good luck

blairy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

blairy,

Palsonic got back to me regarding the issue - it doesn't happen on their DGTEC 2000A/Palsonic combo. They suggested that I get a Palsonic service agent to look at the set, under warranty - I haven't done it as yet.

Yes, HD2 does fix the problem, but it introduces other problems, like a slight jitter in the picture and need to sometimes reset the geometry every now and then (the TV seems to forget its non-standard settings).

Another major problem is that the DGTEC upconverts SD differently when outputting in HD2 mode. It simply doubles 576i -> 1152i and then crops the top and bottom.... you may notice that bugs/titles may be slightly cut off now.

But, the DGTEC won't be the only 1080i device that you might want to connect to this TV. What happens if you buy a HD-DVD player and the TV is out of warranty?

But... the lines seem to have all but dissapeared from my TV. Warmer weather maybe? who knows....

travis

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Travis, lines have returned. They are worse than ever in HD1 mode and noticeable in HD2 as well. Of course, now that it's pointed out, yes the picture does jitter, SD pics are cropped and geometry needs resetting periodically (when using HD2). Thanks

Adjusted gain on masthead amp - no difference.

Disconnected XGA and reconnected via component - no difference.

I note others on this forum have mentioned this issue with other STB's, so this would seem to relate to the TV itself.

I emailed Palsonic (19/11/03) about the rolling black bars as well as geometry generally and a bow across the top of the picture. No response so far.

Just phoned toll free service centre and got message advising business hours. I'll try another email and ring on Monday too.

Have you had any luck arranging for your set to be looked at?

blairy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Palsonic responded to my email sent Saturday...

Thanks for the inquiry.

The Horizontal bars rolling up and down seems like generate from the set

top box. Try using the HD component Y Pr Pb and set the set top box to

HD2.

Geometry setting can be adjusted manually. Please contact our customer

service @ 1300 657 888 for a in home service.

Sorry for the late reply.

Thoughts on these bars being the fault of the STB? Previously in email corro Palsonic advised to use HD1. I've already tried the component cables.

I'll do as they suggest and arrange for an in home service.

blairy

Link to comment
Share on other sites



What is the quality of Standard Definition pictures viewed on this set? My parents are looking at buying a 76cm widescreen TV and I was considering suggesting this set as it is comparable in price to many of the SD sets available.

However, they will not be able to afford (or even be terribly interested in) a HDTV set top box in the immediate future. How does the quality of the Palsonic displaying SDTV compare to the quality of ordinary 76cm widescreens? (e.g. Philips 6516).

At my local Harvey Norman store, they have the Palsonic connected to a DGTEC via composite, which looks pretty ordinary. Don't ask me why they haven't used component or VGA - perhaps they are trying to sell the considerably more expensive Panasonic HDTV sitting next to it.

As well as picture quality, I have some concerns about build quality. Palsonic do not have the best reputation when it comes to making decent equipment. Is this TV an exeption to the rule?

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How does the quality of the Palsonic displaying SDTV compare to the quality of ordinary 76cm widescreens?

In my opinion, not very good. When using composite input, the Palsonics have a band of higher brightness down the middle of the screen, which is very visible when the picture is dark. It's also present on the SVideo inputs, but strongest on composite. This problem doesn't come up when using the component or VGA inputs. You'll also find, on all inputs, that at the left/right edges of the screen, the image is squished. The channel 7 program guide is a good way to check this - have a look at the news text scrolling in from the right edge. Palsonic claim that it is an inherent problem in widescreen CRTS, but I've never seen any other TV with this problem, widescreen or not.

I run my DVD player through SVideo, and whenever the camera pans, these two defects combine to produce an effect that looks like the screen is made of paper and being pulled over a couple of rollers. It's quite nasty, but may not bother you as much as it bothers me.

If you'll be using TV's own tuner, you may get 3 squiggly lines down the centre of the screen if you don't have strong, clear signal.

The above faults seem to be inherent in all units.

Otherwise, the SD picture seems quite reasonable. The picture is bright with good colour range, without the glaring/flicking whites you get on trinitron type SD tubes.

Regarding build quality, Palsonic don't actually make these sets themselves. I've returned one set already, due to a slight squeal being emitted from (I imagine) the flywheel transformer. I am about to return my second set due to faulty audio out connectors and a geometry setup problem when connecting my HD STB.

HTH,

Paul

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Paul

I am sorry to hear all the problems you have with your set

When using composite input, the Palsonics have a band of higher brightness down the middle of the screen, which is very visible when the picture is dark. It's also present on the SVideo inputs, but strongest on composite.

I am using composite input for my VCR , never had this problem..

You'll also find, on all inputs, that at the left/right edges of the screen, the image is squished. The channel 7 program guide is a good way to check this - have a look at the news text scrolling in from the right edge.

I never had this problem either. Not squished images left/rigth

Palsonic claim that it is an inherent problem in widescreen CRTS, but I've never seen any other TV with this problem, widescreen or not

That's a very common way specially with tech people ,when they don't know what to answer.

You are right I haven't seen any TV with this problem either,( including my Palsonic)

If you'll be using TV's own tuner, you may get 3 squiggly lines down the centre of the screen if you don't have strong, clear signal.

I do get 1 squiggly line down the centre of the screen when using TV's tuner But only on ABC . So yes it depends on the strength of the signal. You need a good antenna. I have the impression that HD wide screen TV's have average TV tuners(big names too) so they can make more obvious the difference when on HDTV mode . (cheap trick but works).

I run my DVD player through SVideo

Progressive (or HD) DVD player ,that's one of the points of

having a TV like this..

However I have this Horizontal lines on HDTV (some times there ,some times gone) Hardware incompatibility between Palsonic and STB boxes???

Also wile it is nice that the set have different settings of geometry for different resolutions, only on 1080i (1125)seams to keep the settings without the mysterious resets on 1152i.

Regards

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When using composite input, the Palsonics have a band of higher brightness down the middle of the screen, which is very visible when the picture is dark. It's also present on the SVideo inputs, but strongest on composite.

I am using composite input for my VCR , never had this problem..

This is present on both sets I've owned so far. Most visible on fades to black between scenes. May be stronger on one composite input over another.

You'll also find, on all inputs, that at the left/right edges of the screen, the image is squished. The channel 7 program guide is a good way to check this - have a look at the news text scrolling in from the right edge.

I never had this problem either. Not squished images left/rigth

I've verified this on 4 sets so far, two I've owned and two on display. Strongly urge you to check the news ticker on the channel 7 program guide. Does anyone else NOT have this problem?

Perhaps the guys at my local Retravision have sweaty palms and repeatedly drop every set before they sell them. Or I am the unluckiest customer on the planet. :blink:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i purchased and have since sent back this unit precisely because of the problem Paul is detailing.

i also noticed crap colour balance in SD mode and after a day of mucking around with the limited calibration options i basically gave up.

Niko, is it possible for you to connect your computer to the unit and using say, a checkerboard pattern, determine if there's any geometry problems on your unit, 'cause it's possible me and Paul acquired faulty units from the same batch and usually the units fine. i also bought my unit from Harvey Norman but in Canberra.

and also, Paul, is it every composite/S-video connection that causes the problem or just the ones at the front of the unit, which are the only ones i bothered to use.

Link to comment
Share on other sites



Palsonic responded to my email sent Saturday...

Thanks for the inquiry.

The Horizontal bars rolling up and down seems like generate from the set

top box. Try using the HD component Y Pr Pb and set the set top box to

HD2.

Geometry setting can be adjusted manually. Please contact our customer

service @ 1300 657 888 for a in home service.

Sorry for the late reply.

Thoughts on these bars being the fault of the STB? Previously in email corro Palsonic advised to use HD1. I've already tried the component cables.

I'll do as they suggest and arrange for an in home service.

blairy

Palsonic man came Thursday morning.

His view of the horizontal rolling bars is that it's nothing to do with the set itself. More to do with the actual broadcast from the tv networks. He acknowledged that it's not an issue with the antenna.

Tried his stb (also dgtec 2000a) and had same issue.

Problem with geometry, specifically bow across top of screen is something he has had to go away and investigate. He hasn't seen it on other sets.

Anybody got any thoughts on the rolling horizontal bars being problem with broadcast. Sounds like bull dust to me.

blairy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

and also, Paul, is it every composite/S-video connection that causes the problem or just the ones at the front of the unit, which are the only ones i bothered to use.

Do you mean the compression at sides of screen? It's the same across all inputs, including HD inputs. Or, if you mean the bright bar at centre, it's very strong on composite inputs, about half as strong on SVideo inputs. I just compared SVideo1 to SVideo3 and they are the same.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Palsonic responded to my email sent Saturday...

Thanks for the inquiry.

The Horizontal bars rolling up and down seems like generate from the set

top box.

So they do see the horizontal bars now on HD1.....

How come other HDTV's connected to HD1 don't have these rolling lines? It's not the broadcast.

Try using the HD component Y Pr Pb and set the set top box to

HD2.

Now they suggest we use our HDTV for 576p (that's what component with HD2 is)?

His view of the horizontal rolling bars is that it's nothing to do with the set itself. More to do with the actual broadcast from the tv networks.  He acknowledged that it's not an issue with the antenna.

How come people with other TV's can't see it then? And its on EVERY channel (upconverted SD and HD) & every state? And no other TV sees it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites



I have not seen the compression problem you guys are talking about. I've thrown up grids, full screen boxes with circles in them, text and what not and I don't see any compression issues. (used Digital Video Essentials and the THX video calibration tool) this was done in progressive scan mode from my omni dvd player. I might try the nokia monitor test util i have on my laptop next.

I also do not have any bright bands runing vertically or horizontally anywhere on the screen. Overall the image is consistent. However I have noticed that in some instances dark areas of a picture (shadows etc) will loose detail if something very bright appears on some other part of the screen. This seem slightly more noticable in progressive scan - I have cleared it up some what after calibrating brightness/contrast tho). I still notice it but I'm the only one that can it seems.

The horizontal lines issue I may have seen with my omni dvd player on this set on some occasions. Very faint, only when in progressive scan. Turn the dvd player off and then back on and that usually fixes it. I was the only one to notice this too - perhaps I spend too much time reading these forums :)

Reception wise I have no problems - well not since I repaired the aerial on the roof (new balun, new cabling, new wall socket) Up until I got this tv I never bothered fixing the aerial - I didn't use it with my old tv.

My rig as far as video signals into this TV goes -

Omni DV3200P -> HDTV IN Y Pb Pr

IBM Thinkpad T21 -> HDTV IN XGA (occasionally)

Toshiba SD2109 -> DVD IN Y Cb Cr

TEAC VCR -> AV1

XBOX -> AV2

Camcorders etc. -> AV3

Roof mounted aerial->VCR RF -> RF in

Link to comment
Share on other sites

However I have noticed that in some instances dark areas of a picture (shadows etc) will loose detail if something very bright appears on some other part of the screen.

I also see this, but only when playing certain Xbox games at 480p.

My rig as far as video signals into this TV goes -

Omni DV3200P      -> HDTV IN Y Pb Pr

IBM Thinkpad T21 -> HDTV IN XGA (occasionally)

Toshiba SD2109  -> DVD IN Y Cb Cr

TEAC VCR            -> AV1

XBOX                    -> AV2

Camcorders etc.  -> AV3

Roof mounted aerial->VCR RF -> RF in

Do you ever plan on using a HD STB? Have you connected a 1080i source to your set? When I got my replacement set, due to the limited HD inputs I had my STB connected to DVD in. Then, 2 months later when I finally connected my STB to HD in, I found that my replacement set can't display the 1080i signal from my STB without rainbow artifacts on the left side of the screen. The only way to get rid of the rainbow is to set the H-Size so that the edge of the image is within the edge of the visible display. AFAIK all the sets do this, but only at extreme H-size settings. Mine does it at the correct H-size settings. Anyway this might be something you want to test if you plan on using 1080i in the future.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Paul, and all

I've verified this on 4 sets so far, two I've owned and two on display. Strongly urge you to check the news ticker on the channel 7 program guide. Does anyone else NOT have this problem?

No squished image left/right

I did check the news ticker on channel 7 , as well all channels again and again.

Whatever I buy I am with the magnified glass all over it. I have taken

back to the stores almost everything I own to get something better . Apart from my wife(they don't want her back).Everybody home watch TV ,I watch the screen for any problems...

No squished image - No problems with composite inputs ,image is consistent . No compression problem. No rainbow artifacts on 1080i !

My problem ? : The *&^%^ Lines.

Yes you can see them on DVD progressive , you have to be close to the set

as they are very fine, in that mode. And not always there.

His view of the horizontal rolling bars is that it's nothing to do with the set itself. More to do with the actual broadcast from the TV networks.

Ones more . They don't know what to answer.

Is my DVD broadcasting too ???

However I have noticed that in some instances dark areas of a picture (shadows etc) will loose detail if something very bright appears on some other part of the screen. This seem slightly more noticeable in progressive scan - I have cleared it up some what after calibrating brightness/contrast tho). I still notice it but I'm the only one that can it seems.

Yep , same too, but not with the DVD progressive. I think the players contribute on that as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello All,

I checked last night and I have no significant distortion, I have the QTR-2140 hooked up in AB 1152i (to avoid horizontal lines in AA mode) on the xVGA, and an Omni3200P DVD through progressive.

I trained and tuned the other day and discovered that 2 of the 4 test channels failed the signal strength. Picture is fine though. The antenna man was amazed at the picture on the TV and when I told him I got it for $1750, he said he would get one. He said that the picture was as good or better than the Panasonic TV’s he has seen.

I do see a little bit of barrel distortion of the picture if in 4:3 mode, not really noticeable in 16:9. Looks a bit like a slightly squashed barrel with bulging sides. No problems (yet) with the dvd picture, it has been flawless!

The only thing I don't like is that some reds are over saturated on some shows but this appears to be related to the broadcast quality. Some shows like HD ABC or 9 is spot on. 7 typically is not as good as the these channels.

I also get something that looks like macroblocking if panning with lots of detail in the background (world cup rugby would show this up on the seats when panning). I have assumed that this is related to the STB since DVD picture is fine. Something to do with the MPEG conversion in the STB?

Overall very happy with the price/performance of the Palsonic.

I would be happy to swap the STB in a year or 2 and get a HD STB with a hard drive and throw the video away! …. may be Christmas 2004…

Merry Christmas all and thanks for your help! :blink:

Link to comment
Share on other sites



  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.




×
×
  • Create New...
To Top